The Immortals Handbook

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Krust!

Hiya mate!

My impression (and I'm only familiar with one, perhaps two, of your metempiric powers) is that I'd like you to leave em' in there.

He he!

I think part of your appeal as a game designer/developer (although certainly only one) is that you are willing to go out on a limb and attempt to 'define' uber-powerful beings via RPG mechanics. Now I certainly think that you would be going where no one in d20 has gone if you stopped at Galactus-level beings, you might feel like you've left "money on the table" so to speak. If your cosmology handles beings and abilities above this level of power, then by all means go for it.

Even leaving out the Metempiric powers the book is way beyond Galactus level! Metempiric powers are beyond Living Tribunal level.

I mean to be fair its pretty much only the Supreme Being who can gain Metempiric Powers anyway, so they seem to be fairly redundant in a way.

Of course, I realize that some of this stuf is unlikely to have much practical value in a 'linear' campaign (i.e. there is almost no forseeable way to move your 1st level character to 10,000th level) I view the upper end stuff being used as backdrop and in 'one-shot' gaming sessions that could be a great deal of fun.

Even then, they are so powerful that really you would need to be running a party of Time Lords just to survive the encounter.

And, on another note, I couldn't speak to whether 8 metempiric abilities is enough, too many, etc. Intuitively, I like the idea of having more rather than less, but they should all 'fit'.

I may even have too many powers if thats possible. My abilities chapter is more than twice the size of the Feats Chapter in the PHB.

I agree 100% that people will get more use out of the cosmic than the metempiric abilities. Would it be possible to add to the roster of cosmic abilities w/o reducing the number of metempiric abilities (or re-vamping the entire system)?

Of course it would but I have to draw the line somewhere.

Interesting, by low yield are we speaking in terms of kilotons rather than megatons?

Yes, something akin to Hiroshima level. Meaning the Orcus (from the BoVD) could survive such a blast.

 

[Anabstercorian]

Dump the Metempiric abilities and give them away for free! More cosmic powers!

 

[Fieari]

I'd also vote for leaving metaempiric things in. My PCs may never touch them, but NPCs? Need to be able to pin down what they can do.

Although, my PCs may at some point become a party of 4 Time Lords. They'll need a challenge at that point, now won't they...

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Anabstercorian and Fieari!

Dump the Metempiric abilities and give them away for free! More cosmic powers!

Heh heh!

I'd also vote for leaving metaempiric things in. My PCs may never touch them, but NPCs? Need to be able to pin down what they can do.

You understand of course that virtually only GOD can have Metempiric Powers.

Although, my PCs may at some point become a party of 4 Time Lords. They'll need a challenge at that point, now won't they...

You know if you say it fast enough, Time Lords don't sound that powerful.

 

[-Eä-]

Hey

I think it is a good thing that your Powers Chapter is big. After all, you need reference and all the things that follows. However, it may be a good idea to create more cosmic abilities to have in the book and release the Metaempiric Powers in a Web Enhancement. However, if dropping Metaempiric Powers affects some other part of your work, you should leave them in the book.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey

Hi Eä mate!

I think it is a good thing that your Powers Chapter is big.

Doesn't make writing it any easier.

After all, you need reference and all the things that follows. However, it may be a good idea to create more cosmic abilities to have in the book and release the Metaempiric Powers in a Web Enhancement. However, if dropping Metaempiric Powers affects some other part of your work, you should leave them in the book.

Perhaps I could do that. Then if people think the Metempiric Powers add anything I could always slot them back into the Print Version.

 

[historian]

Howdy Krust!

Even leaving out the Metempiric powers the book is way beyond Galactus level! Metempiric powers are beyond Living Tribunal level.

Sweet!

I mean to be fair its pretty much only the Supreme Being who can gain Metempiric Powers anyway, so they seem to be fairly redundant in a way.

I see your point -- there may be little difference between Akashic Memory and Omnipotence in game terms, but I like the idea of having different alternatives for flavor (of course, you may view these abilities as mutually exclusive, but that's likely debatable).

Even then, they are so powerful that really you would need to be running a party of Time Lords just to survive the encounter.

Cool, I love this high level talk!

Although if the metempiric abilities are survivable (at all) then one could argue that they are not redundant.

I may even have too many powers if thats possible. My abilities chapter is more than twice the size of the Feats Chapter in the PHB.

This is a testament to your imagination. It's a negative in that it increases your costs of bringing the IH to market, but I don't envision any gamer or DM shying away from the IH because it has too many powers.

Of course it would but I have to draw the line somewhere.

Indeed. This, of course, is a tough issue on every front. I'm sure that whatever you decide will be 'right on'.

Perhaps I could do that. Then if people think the Metempiric Powers add anything I could always slot them back into the Print Version.

This, depending on how executed, could work well.

Yes, something akin to Hiroshima level. Meaning the Orcus (from the BoVD) could survive such a blast.

That sounds right to me.

Thanks dude - hope the feedback helps rather than complicates things.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy Krust!

Hiya mate!

Sweet!

I'll have to sort Galactus out for the website, would I have to call him Galactor or something I wonder? I'm still not sure if I can get away with the stats for Godzilla.

I see your point -- there may be little difference between Akashic Memory and Omnipotence in game terms, but I like the idea of having different alternatives for flavor (of course, you may view these abilities as mutually exclusive, but that's likely debatable).

I see any such alternatives being philosophical rather than mechanical though. Which is why the Metempiric Powers may not be relevant.

Cool, I love this high level talk!

I wonder can anyone guess the names of possible Time Lords from world mythology?

Although if the metempiric abilities are survivable (at all) then one could argue that they are not redundant.

Well the quick answer is yes and no.

This is a testament to your imagination. It's a negative in that it increases your costs of bringing the IH to market,

I dunno, I hadn't really thought about it increasing the costs.

but I don't envision any gamer or DM shying away from the IH because it has too many powers.

I suppose.

Indeed. This, of course, is a tough issue on every front. I'm sure that whatever you decide will be 'right on'.

Thats the idea. I think in future projects I am going to have to work closely with an editor who can tell me how to close chapters better.

This, depending on how executed, could work well.

My gut instinct tells me they are unnecessary, and not up to the standard of the other powers, certainly in terms of practicality.

That sounds right to me.

Thanks dude - hope the feedback helps rather than complicates things.

Of course!

The only one who complicates things is me unfortunately.

 

[historian]

Hello Krust!

I see any such alternatives being philosophical rather than mechanical though. Which is why the Metempiric Powers may not be relevant.

My gut instinct tells me they are unnecessary, and not up to the standard of the other powers, certainly in terms of practicality.

Makes sense to me, although I will miss seeing the 'Akashic Memory'. Even if the metempiric 'abilities' don't make the cut, I encourage you to preserve them in draft form, in the event you decide to release them later as I would love to see them at some point.

Any chance you can tell us anything about the other 7?

Also, if metempiric abilities are left out, will you have other ways to distinguish supernals from eternals?

I wonder can anyone guess the names of possible Time Lords from world mythology?

Ahura Mazda? Angra Mainyu?

I'll have to sort Galactus out for the website, would I have to call him Galactor or something I wonder? I'm still not sure if I can get away with the stats for Godzilla.

Cool, I'd love to see 'Galactus' and 'Godzilla'. While I'm an American lawyer I wouldn't dare presume to give legal advice in this context.

That said, speaking as a fan, 'Galactor' would be fine. Alternatively, you could just spell his 'real' name backwards, so you get 'Nalag of Aat' as opposed to 'Galan of Taa'.

You could even preview him here!

I 'quick statted' (didn't calculate feats or skills) one possible version of Thanos pursuant to v4 guidelines and came up w/about a 230 CR. Aside from HD, the most significant CR factor was his ability to manipulate cosmic energy(as opposed to divine or deific) ability to the tune of something like 120 d6.

He would have easily slapped around most anything in the ELH.

I can't wait to see the 'official' version (sneak peek? ).

I dunno, I hadn't really thought about it increasing the costs.

I was speaking in terms of opportunity rather than book costs.

I'm glad your focus is on marketing rather than operations/costs -- this is another reason why your work is more appealing than the rest of what's out there.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello Krust!

Hi historian mate!

Makes sense to me, although I will miss seeing the 'Akashic Memory'.

Well the Akashic Memory was never statted anyway.

Even if the metempiric 'abilities' don't make the cut, I encourage you to preserve them in draft form, in the event you decide to release them later as I would love to see them at some point.

Well I might be able to squeeze two or three into the Omnific Abilities.

A few others I was never really happy with from a mechanical perspective (they were more philosophical than mechanical).

Any chance you can tell us anything about the other 7?

Well there was Alpha; Omega [Effect]; Metadimensional; Metamerism; Metastasis and a few others I wasn't really happy with like Metaphysical and Metaversal.

Some on that list may end up in the Omnific Abilities if they test out okay.

Also, if metempiric abilities are left out, will you have other ways to distinguish supernals from eternals?

To be honest I am debating whether or not Supernals (certainly plural) are necessary.

Ahura Mazda? Angra Mainyu?

*NNNNHHH* Wrong answer.

At best Overgods. Though I would be partial to making Ahriman/Angra Mainyu and Ormazd/Ahura Mazda 'merely' Greater Gods.

Cool, I'd love to see 'Galactus' and 'Godzilla'. While I'm an American lawyer I wouldn't dare presume to give legal advice in this context.

Yes, I am curious if merely explaining who owns the copyright for such characters would be enough - its not like I am wanting to make money from the characters, I mean I could post the stats herein and no one would bat an eyelid.

That said, speaking as a fan, 'Galactor' would be fine. Alternatively, you could just spell his 'real' name backwards, so you get 'Nalag of Aat' as opposed to 'Galan of Taa'.

You could even preview him here!

Perhaps, I haven't done his stats yet, though I do have Godzilla practically finished.

...Its the 100 metre version of Godzilla by the way (rather than the 50 or 55 metre versions) with all the added extra powers he showed in the later movies. I think hes pretty tough, probably on a par with Odin - albeit in a more direct way obviously.

I 'quick statted' (didn't calculate feats or skills) one possible version of Thanos pursuant to v4 guidelines and came up w/about a 230 CR. Aside from HD, the most significant CR factor was his ability to manipulate cosmic energy (as opposed to divine or deific) ability to the tune of something like 120 d6.

He would have easily slapped around most anything in the ELH.

I can't wait to see the 'official' version (sneak peek? ).

Well it won't technically be Marvel Thanos, despite some similarities. But it would be easy to stat up Thanos using the IH. I make him Skyfather/Greater God level.

I was speaking in terms of opportunity rather than book costs.

I suppose.

I'm glad your focus is on marketing rather than operations/costs -- this is another reason why your work is more appealing than the rest of what's out there.

If I knew how to be able to sell the pdfs on my website then I would be able to circumnavigate the fees for places like rpgnow and lower the price of the pdfs.