Yes, but many people use it, or some form of romantic medieval Europe, as baseline for "normal" fantasy worlds, even when it has much more magic than LotR.
The impacts of Fantasy on (fantasy) society
- Thread starter fuzzlewump
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Yes, but many people use it, or some form of romantic medieval Europe, as baseline for "normal" fantasy worlds, even when it has much more magic than LotR.
fuzzlewump
Explorer
Good point on the tomb thing. See, a point I didnt think of that would be great to be in a book somewhere !
Could you elaborate? Is there a way WotC could make the logical conclusion sway toward expected fantasy?
Derren said:
Could you elaborate? Is there a way WotC could make the logical conclusion sway toward expected fantasy?
They can make magic less useful like they tried with 4E where the nearly only thing magic can do is combat. The downside with this is that there are no rituals for high level parties and some world shaking spells are simply required in D&D like ressurection. That also doesn't solve the problem with high level monsters/characters who can single handedly destroy a city and are rather plentyful because PCs need something to kill.
And even if magic is only good for combat it will still turn the fantasy combat into WW2 than knights fighting against each other in melee.
The best solution imo would be to shift the action rather early into the planes where the expectation of what constitutes as fantasy is not there. Problem with that is that established settings are left behind as are players who don't like the planes.
Except that magic items would not sold at a pawn shop but rather something like a weapon black market and even used stuff sells rather well in there (especially as many magical items can't be used up and also don't break down with time)
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Andor
First Post
Why do people think this? Can any of you name a D&D world where someone might give away multiple wagon loads of enchanted items like magical musical instruments on his birthday? Where nobody even questions a forest of trees that assault a hedge as being out of place? Where elves enchant their iron rations to keep them from spoiling?
Big flashy magic effects like fireballs are rare in LotR, but magic is everywhere.
I don't think fantasy worlds have to be totally internally consistent. in fact, I'm always willing to accept some whackyness when it makes the session more fun.
That said, DMs definitely need all the help they can get to create a living, breathing fantasy world. World building definitely is a core topic for the DMG.
That said, DMs definitely need all the help they can get to create a living, breathing fantasy world. World building definitely is a core topic for the DMG.
fuzzlewump
Explorer
Andor said:
I think they mean the actual casting of magic spells.
But LotR's magic, saves a few things, don't change the world. LotR's powerful magic is rare. After a certain point, everything major is done with pointy sticks, big clubs, fellowship, and talking.
If everyone in the world can turn their hands different colors, magic would be everywhere too but do nothing.
But D&D's magic....
Andor
First Post
I've got to disagree with you there. D&D magic is almost entirely limited to combat usage. I've griped for years that D&D magic is 10,000 ways to blow things up and not one damm way to heat your house.
Eberron was, in part, an attempt to make the world more magical with common place magic items. And I bet most of them would look like those LotR items. Most people don't need a wand of fireballs, they need a stove and a car and hot showers.
LotR magic tended to be informational: foresight, telepathy, mind reading/control, the Palantirs, Sarumans Voice. The technology you're using to read this is along that same vein.
But you also had just plain impossible magic stuff. Rope that unties itself. The light of the lanterns of the gods, which once lit the whole world, captured in a tree, then a gem, then a vial of water. A ring of invisibility. A tiny musical instrument that sounds like a full sized one. Men who can shift their shape, or understand the speech of birds. Dragons. Magical statues that watch and warn.
D&D does have a few genuinely useful (in a day-to-day sense) magic items. The decanter of endless water. Golems (which should belong to merchants and be used to move cargo, not guard tombs). Flying carpets. Teleportation. Healing.
Most of this is not common place, for an excellent reason: It changes the world too much. People want to play Aragorn or Fafhrd or Elric. Isolation is one of the key elements to the feel of these worlds. Even in a big city you are probably weeks from another big city. 4e's "points of light". Difficulty of transportation and communication is central to this feel. Commonplace flying carpets or crystal cellphones is to disruptive to the sense of isolation that provides narrative justification to wandering bands of heroes righting wrongs. If the mayor has a sat-phone he'd just call the king and ask for for some knights to deal with those pesky goblins.
No. The issue with D&D is not commonplace but people have it and no one uses it. There might only be 5 crystal balls out there but someone has them and doesn't use them. There are dozens of humaniods and hundreds of monsters that would rub out villages but they don't. Every king and lord would simple send armies to collect the forgot WMDs that are left to rot in caves and dungeons. Heck, I'd probably have to think hard to not risk my life for one of those wondrous items left on a cavern floor.
Yes, if D&D worlds actually used their tech, the game would be no fun. But that is still spraying idiocy over the world to make the game work. D&D relies on "too scared to waste resources, my enemies might snipe me." for everything.
