The Last of Us (HBO Max)

[GrahamWills]

OK, I'm seeing comparisons to Black Mirror's "San Junipero" episode and, while that is almost certainly Black Mirror's finest hour (although the next tier down has a lot of great episodes, too), I think "Long, Long Time" handily beats it. Any thoughts on the comparison?

Interesting. I'm not sure that I'd have compared the two. Are there really so few genre shows that are well-done, generally hopeful and feature same-sex romance that simply having those qualities makes them comparable?

Without delving into spoilers, some essential differences are:

• The thrust of the two episodes is different. One is designed to lead you to a big reveal -- it is drawing the viewer into a puzzle; the other tells you nothing new -- it is deepening a known set of facts and providing color and context
• The energy of the two differs; San Junipero is edgy, fast and upbeat. Long, Long Time is slow and thoughtful.
• The worlds are very different. Spoilers are required to explain why.

Because Long, Long Time is part of an overall story, it has an added emotional and world-building depth not available to San Junipero. In LLT the moment that most deeply affected me was when Ellie paused in reading the letter; that only had meaning with the whole series as a context. This episode also established how long Joel and Tess had known each other, which makes their relationship and events in other episodes stronger.

Overall, both episodes are sensational, but Long, Long Time wins by doing something harder, by being focused on character relationships and not on a reveal, and by integrating with the greater story. Having said that, it's like saying winning $12 million is better than winning $10 million. It's true, but honestly, you're going to be very, very happy either way.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Interesting. I'm not sure that I'd have compared the two. Are there really so few genre shows that are well-done, generally hopeful and feature same-sex romance that simply having those qualities makes them comparable?

I'm just seeing it in the context of "best episode of TV of all time," rather than the content, although it's an interesting coincidence.

 

[Flamestrike]

Ep 3 is currently being review bombed by the usual incel gamergate crowd for obvious reasons.

Jesus I hate those guys.

Shows been really good so far. It's hard for me coming in from having played both games many times and rating the first one especially as my number 1 game of all time, and still the best example of what the gaming medium can offer a story.

I've never been affected by any story medium (book, movie, play etc) to the extent that the 1st game had me deep in introspection for days if not months afterwards.

I find myself watching it from an academic viewpoint, contrasting it to the game, rather than being able to just sit back and watch it like any other show, which is bumming me out a bit.

That's my problem, not any fault of the show though.

 

[HaroldTheHobbit]

Now I've stared at the empty reply box for 10 minutes, but I still can't find words to describe how Episode 3 hit me and my wife. As others have said, just give everyone involved all the prizes.

 

[Morrus]

That was a good episode! I've been over the zombie thing for a long time, so that Walking Dead aspect of the show is a bit of a hurdle for me, but this episode was such a good solid character piece that it's won me over.

 

[payn]

That was a good episode! I've been over the zombie thing for a long time, so that Walking Dead aspect of the show is a bit of a hurdle for me, but this episode was such a good solid character piece that it's won me over.

For sure, this is the difference I was trying to articulate earlier without be spoilery.

I find myself watching it from an academic viewpoint, contrasting it to the game, rather than being able to just sit back and watch it like any other show, which is bumming me out a bit.

That's my problem, not any fault of the show though.

I was thinking about this last night. At first I thought this series would be too close to the game. Though, I am seeing it be both true and able to make changes to differentiate the two. I finally came around to not minding so much because now I have two versions of TLOU, and so far, the series is not disappointing me.

 

[Flamestrike]

For sure, this is the difference I was trying to articulate earlier without be spoilery.


I was thinking about this last night. At first I thought this series would be too close to the game. Though, I am seeing it be both true and able to make changes to differentiate the two. I finally came around to not minding so much because now I have two versions of TLOU, and so far, the series is not disappointing me.

Yeah. It's just... every time it deviates from the game (Bill and Frank, no Spores) I compare those changes to the game. Then every time it tries to mirror the game (Ep1 in the car escape from the house), Im again brought back to comparing it to the game.

Im having a real hard time watching it, and not constantly contrasting it to the game. It's almost an academic experience, rather than an entertainment experience.

That's entirely on me, on not on the show. Im trying to just enjoy it 'as is' but just keep getting jarred out.

I feel like Joel is less 'Evil' in the TV version (in the game he casually engages in torture early on, and doesnt blink when Tess flat out murders several people in cold blood) in an effort to make him more sympathetic. In the game he's implied to have engaged in many a cold-blooded murder himself, and expressly engages in torture and murder a few times later on as well.

The changes to the infected are OK, but I miss seeing them crying and sobbing (it really brought on the horror that -unlike in other Zombie genres, the person is still 'in there' - just mind controlled by a fungus that is slowly agonizingly consuming them from the inside out, while forcing them to live in the filth and in the dark and kill people).

I like it (and I like the Zombie genre in general) but It's going to take me a while to dwell on how much, and be able to view it as it's own thing (separate from the game).

 

[payn]

Yeah. It's just... every time it deviates from the game (Bill and Frank, no Spores) I compare those changes to the game. Then every time it tries to mirror the game (Ep1 in the car escape from the house), Im again brought back to comparing it to the game.

Im having a real hard time watching it, and not constantly contrasting it to the game. It's almost an academic experience, rather than an entertainment experience.

That's entirely on me, on not on the show. Im trying to just enjoy it 'as is' but just keep getting jarred out.

I feel like Joel is less 'Evil' in the TV version (in the game he casually engages in torture early on, and doesnt blink when Tess flat out murders several people in cold blood) in an effort to make him more sympathetic. In the game he's implied to have engaged in many a cold-blooded murder himself, and expressly engages in torture and murder a few times later on as well.

The changes to the infected are OK, but I miss seeing them crying and sobbing (it really brought on the horror that -unlike in other Zombie genres, the person is still 'in there' - just mind controlled by a fungus that is slowly agonizingly consuming them from the inside out, while forcing them to live in the filth and in the dark and kill people).

I like it (and I like the Zombie genre in general) but It's going to take me a while to dwell on how much, and be able to view it as it's own thing (separate from the game).

I think they are slow rolling the series. Everything is snail paced compared to the game. A lot of gamers (not saying you) are not keeping patience for that. Though, im actually glad they are airing this thing out and letting the stories unfold naturally. Unlike many other zombie stories, there doesn't seem to be a high intense scene requirement every 5 min of screen time. Keeping with the characterization based story telling of the original game.

Spoiler: Joel

I noticed this too. The showrunners seem to be flirting with the idea Joel is definitely different than he was 20 years ago. Not quite a violent sociopath, but just a guy who has calloused over time from hard livin. Sure he can do awful things when he needs to, but mostly he just tries to get by. Perhaps they are trying to endear him to viewers before things get real bad, which it appears might start next week. Time will tell.

 

[GrahamWills]

I find myself watching it from an academic viewpoint, contrasting it to the game, rather than being able to just sit back and watch it like any other show, which is bumming me out a bit..

I direct and act in amateur theater, and this sort of thought is so common to me. Even the experience of acting is one of divergence, half your brain involved emptionally and being part of the action, with another half analyzing and contrasting in the background. So already when I watch a show half my brain is going “triple downbeat, excellent time for a moment of hope” or “good use of the action scene to include a set-up for Ellie finding a gun, setting up an almost literal ‘Pavlov’s Gun’ moment for a future episode to use”.

So for me, I now just have a third part of my brain interluding with ”unclear yet if the change to how spores work is improving the tv show” or “did the game ever let us know how long Tess and Joel were together?”

It used to annoy me a bit; now I just accept it, and enjoy the added perspective on the artfulness of the show

 

[Sacrosanct]

That was a good episode! I've been over the zombie thing for a long time, so that Walking Dead aspect of the show is a bit of a hurdle for me, but this episode was such a good solid character piece that it's won me over.

Same. The "Behind the Show" part was worth watching as well. I thought this was very well done.