D&D 5E The Muscle Sorcerer.

Hohige

Explorer

1599246218823.png

The Armored Sorcerer
With the arrival of Tasha's Couldron of Everything. Summons spells are now official.
And a powerful combination came to my mind.
Behold, The Armored Sorcerer.

This combination turns the Divine Soul Sorcerer much stronger than a fighter or barbarian, is not afraid of enemy wizards and still dominates in the social.
Let's say you are the best duelist I have ever seen.

Highlight:
  • Incomparable tanking (Tanker)
  • High damage output (Blaster)
  • Really powerful Summon with Radiant Longbow or Melee (Extended summons for long duration spells)
  • Buffer (Extended cleric spells)
  • The best social character possible with Subtle Spell
  • Unbeatiable on 1v1
  • The best mage killer
  • Bodybuilder

Level 12, V. Human Divine Soul Sorcerer.
Metamagic: Subtle Spell, Extend Spell and Quicken Spell.

Feat selection: Lightly Armored, Moderately Armored, Heavily Armored and Heavy Armor Master.

Key Spell: Extended Summon Celestial Spirit (UA now, but officially printed on next book), Extended Aid, Extended Death Ward, Freedom of Movement, Subtle Counterspell, Protector against blades and Quicken mirror image.

With 16 base strength, we have a sorcerer with 20 STR (Lightly Armored, Moderately Armored, Heavely Armored and Heavy Armor Master feat).
Awesome, hahaha. Barbarians? Arm wrestling?

With that, the sorcerer has 25 AC (Plate Armor, Shield + Shield Spell) and reduces the damage of non-magic weapons by 3.


Extended Aid Spell, Upcasted to level 5 for free +20 HP to himself and allies, total of 106 HP.




1599262798610.png

Large Celestial (Defender) Summon
Extended Summon Celestial Spirit upcasted to level 6. (2 hours duration)
The Defender
It hits 3x. +9 to hit, 1d10+9 Radiant Damage. Average potential damage 15 damage per hit.
Averagare total per turn 45 damage.
HP: 66 + 20 Aid = 86 HP
AC: 17

Large celestial, neutral good
Armor Class: 11 + the level of the spell (natural armor)
Hit Points: equal the celestial’s Constitution modifier + your spellcasting ability modifier + ten times the spell’s level
Damage Resistances: radiant
Condition Immunities: charmed, frightened
Senses: darkvision 60 ft., passive Perception 10
Languages: Celestial, understands the languages you speak
Actions
Multiattack. The celestial makes a number of attacks equal to half this spell’s level (rounded down).
Radiant Bow (Avenger Only). Ranged Weapon Attack: +2 + the spell’s level to hit, range 150/600 ft., one target. Hit: 2d6 + 2 + the spell’s level radiant damage.
Radiant Mace (Defender Only). Melee Weapon Attack: +3 + the spell’s level to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 1d10 + 3 + the spell’s level radiant damage, and the celestial can choose itself or another creature it can see within 10 feet of the target. The chosen creature gains temporary hit points equal to the damage dealt, provided it doesn’t already have temporary hit points.
Healing Touch (1/Day). The celestial touches another creature. The target magically regains hit points equal to 2d8 + the spell’s level.




With 2 hours duration spell, The Muscle Sorcerer, it can stay in several battles.

Damage absorbing sponge:

Action for Blade Ward Cantrip: Resistence against all weapons. (Barbarians?).

Bonus action for quicken spell: Dimention Door, Fireball, Healing, Revivify, Dispel, Booming Blade or just extended Upcasted Spiritual Weapon
Honorable Mention to Sanctuary Spell (Really defensive spell)

The Defender's Radiant Mace (Defender Only). Melee Weapon Attack: +3 + the spell’s level to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 1d10 + 3 + the spell’s level radiant damage, and the celestial can choose itself or another creature it can see within 10 feet of the target. The chosen creature gains temporary hit points equal to the damage dealt, provided it doesn’t already have temporary hit points.

So, the Muscle has High AC, HP, Resistence against Weapons and free THP each Defender's Radiant Mace hit (Average 15 THP).




The Tanker Sorcerer
A fighter level 12, 20STR and Greatersword, can attack 6 times with +9 to hit, action surge.
Against 25 AC, It's 0,36 chance to hit.

Each attack is 2d6+5 = 12 damage and -3 against Heavy Armor Master feat = 9 average damage.
Blade Ward cantrip halves the damage to 4,5 average damage.
If all hits, It's 27 avg damage(Action Surging round)
Well, the Sorcerer has 15 average THP (Defender summoner). The real damage is 12. IF ALL HITS.

But agaisnt 25 AC, the real average damage is 27x0,36 = 10 average damage against 25 AC.

The sorcerer has each turn at least 15 THP, so the real damage is 0 (ZERO).

after Action Surging round, the fighter's damage is simply negligible.

In hand-to-hand combat, the Muscle Sorcerer is invincible.



Blasting

The Sorcerer average damage per turn without spend spells slots.

Defender's multiattack (3x) +9 to hit, 45 avg radiant damage.
Sorcerer's Quicken and normal booming blade. +9 to hit for 37 average damage, and 18 if the enemy moves.
If all hits, 82 damage per turn.

If the sorcerer spends spells slots to deal damage, It increases heavily.

Avenger's Multiattack (3x) +8 to hit, 150/600ft for average 45 damage at distance.




Spellcaster Enemy?


This is simply not funny. Subtle Spell and counterspell simply dominates the combat, with no chance of reaction.



Add: When Muscle Sorcerer spends spell slots.

1599665757353.png

Expending 3th ~ 5th spells slots to cast Animate Dead to control 46 skeletons for 24 hour.
Grapple, Shove, Knock Prone, Damaging
If all hits, It's 253 damage per round.

Converting 1 ~ 2 spells slots into higher spells slots (Sorcerer's flexible casting shenanigans).
The Muscle Sorcerer casts Extended Seeming Spell (16h), disguising himself and all controlled creatures (Skeletons and Celestial Summon).

The Celestial Summon can provide free 15 THP for skeletons.

Why Seeming Spell?

It disguises all creatures as a celestial creature, making it impossible for the enemy to distinguish the real enemy.
That combination makes any an illusionist jealous.


Subtle Metamagic and Seeming Spell

This combination is extremely potent, because the Muscle Sorcerer casts Subtle Spell to avoid be noticed. The enemy is unable to distinguish who was the caster, as it provides no visual or sound effects.
Without Subtle Spell, verbal and somatic components would reveal the true spellcaster.
It's effectively a Mirror Image spell with 48 duplicates



Tip:
Good on paper, but not so good in practice...
Extremely efficient, but this can bring serious social problems. If you are going to use this combination, make sure it is worth the risk and that you can save your party.

If your Party doesn't mind raising skeletons, go for it.

Expending 3th ~ 5th spells slots to cast Animate Dead to control 46 skeletons for 24 hour.
Grapple, Shove, Knock Prone, Damaging

Converting 1 ~ 2 spells slots into higher spells slots (Sorcerer's flexible casting shenanigans).
The Muscle Sorcerer casts Extended Seeming Spell, disguising himself and all controlled creatures (Skeletons and Celestial Summon).

The Celestial Summon can provide free 15 THP for skeletons.

Why Seeming Spell?

It disguises all creatures as a celestial creature, making it impossible for the enemy to distinguish the real enemy.
That combination makes any an illusionist jealous.


Subtle Metamagic and Seeming Spell

This combination is extremely potent ... because when Muscle Sorcerer casts Subtle Spells. This makes it impossible for the enemy to detect the true caster, as it provides no visual or sound effects.
To the enemy, the Muscle Sorcerer is just a minion.
It's effectively a Mirror Image spell with 48 duplicates

Tip:
Good on paper, but not so good in practice...
Extremely efficient, but this can bring serious social problems. If you are going to use this combination, make sure it is worth the risk and that you can save your party.

If your Party doesn't mind raising skeletons, go for it.
Be very careful with this combo, you can take all the fun out of the party, use it only in special situations.



Honorable mention:
You still can be a buffer, healer and social god (Subtle Spell) as your job.
 

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That 12th level fighter in your example...add in GWM and GWF style, and the fighter nearly kills the Celestial Defender in one round w/ Action Surge without even using the -5/+10 part of GWM.
Factor in using GWM and the Celestial Defender dies in one round.
 

Hohige

Explorer
That 12th level fighter in your example...add in GWM and GWF style, and the fighter nearly kills the Celestial Defender in one round w/ Action Surge without even using the -5/+10 part of GWM.
Factor in using GWM and the Celestial Defender dies in one round.

Hello !

Well, the defender's HP is 86 + 15 THP for 101 total HP.

The fighter Hitting all hits is 12x6 = 72 avg damage.

It is not enough to kill, not even if all attacks hit. Action Surging round is wasted.

Defender has 17 AC against +9 atk.
72 x 0.52 (52% Chance to hit) = Real 38 slashing average damage.

But the situation can get even more difficult with Extended Warding Bond spell (2 hours duration).
The Defender has now 18 AC and resistence all damage.
It's 36/2 = 18 average damage.
The real damage is 18 - 15 THP = 3 damage.

With GWM, It's +4 to hit. (22% chance to hit).
132 x 0,22 = 29 average damage
29/2 = 14,5 damage.
The real damage is 14,5 - 15THP = 0 damage.


The muscle sorcerer takes 1/4 (Resistence of the target and the muscle sorcerer's resistence) of the damage, so It's 9 damage. The real damage on the muscule sorcerer is zero (15 THP per turn).

The fighter's situation is really complicated.


The fighter with 16 con, has 105 HP. I believe he is dead in a single round.
 
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delph

Explorer
Hello !

Well, the defender's HP is 86 + 15 THP for 101 total HP.

The fighter Hitting all hits is 12x6 = 72 avg damage.

It is not enough to kill, not even if all attacks hit. Action Surging round is wasted.

Defender has 17 AC against +9 atk.
72 x 0.52 (52% Chance to hit) = Real 38 slashing average damage.

But the situation can get even more difficult with Extended Warding Bond spell (2 hours duration).
The Defender has now 18 AC and resistence all damage.
It's 36/2 = 18 average damage.
The real damage is 18 - 15 THP = 3 damage.

With GWM, It's +4 to hit. (22% chance to hit).
132 x 0,22 = 29 average damage
29/2 = 14,5 damage.
The real damage is 14,5 - 15THP = 0 damage.


The muscle sorcerer takes 1/4 (Resistence of the target and the muscle sorcerer's resistence) of the damage, so It's 9 damage. The real damage on the muscule sorcerer is zero (15 THP per turn).

The fighter's situation is really complicated.


The fighter with 16 con, has 105 HP. I believe he is dead in a single round.
Nice, but completely wrong.

At first something positive
- I believe when you have Blade ward and HAM, you use at first magic, than HAM, so from 12 dmg you'v got half - 6 dmg, then reduce to 3 dmg.

Than many negatives:
As you describe it, it can be only a Variant human - 4 feats. And use point buy system - STR, CON, CHA 15, other 8. From Racial and one feat incres you will be 16 on all three stats. Ok, but be dumb on dex? you very probably start last, and thats not good. In this "sandpools" It mean you lost your first round with fighter, and you'll get al 6 (or seven) attacks before you start casting your Celestilal... nothing good for you. And when do you use Standard array it stared to be not so strong. (Can got 2 +3 and than only +1, or +3 and two +2)

Then I'm wondering why so bad use of ASI - You really need only HA a HAM. Than +2 to STR and you can still take Warcaster or +2 to CON/CHA...

But you choose as you choose, so you can cast only with a weapon, or with shield, but no with both. So you will have -2 AC, or cant melee attack (as you write about green flame blade or booming blade).

And last, but really important part - You use absolutely wrong described fighter. I't doesnt count with battle master manouvers or eldritch knight. And his feats.

Battle master is most favorite choose and best against your sorcerer.

here are 2 versions:
DEX based melee - defensive, use sword and board,feats: defensive duelant, mage slayer, (can use shield master). You are now attacking against 25 AC as well. Will probably start first,

STR based - HWFS, HWM, PAM (maybe sentinel), Mage slayer.

DEX based ranged -archery style, SS, mageslayer,

and if they doesn't use every ASI, there can be magic initiate for hex.... or bless (when you use SS or HWM)

So what will be when fighter can start fight?
attack - hit? you can cast shield, he can use precision manouver, or if still beat it - Tripattack on you it will be not 2d6+ DEX/STR but 2d6+d8 and if he hav hex than 3d6+d8 and thats not so small as you laught. And can its really good chance to knock you prone (than attack with advantage) - if you arn't ranged fighter, than you use SS -5/+10 so it will be 2d6+1d8+10+DEX/STR..
and you will hit dice to maintain concentration with disadvantage. Have Celestial? Doesn't maintain PUFF.. You do? There are another 5 or 6 attacks...

Next attack with advantage? disarming attack - you'v had shield? No you havn't. -2 AC, or magic staff. or any casting focus? No. And again +d8 dmg.
and again concentration check. with disadvantage. And STR wariors can add -5/+10, so it will be really nasty...
.
.
.

trying to cast something? mage slayer - attack from oportunity... trying get out? attack of oportunity... If you use PAM and sentinel, bonus attack, and AoO when you'll come to his reach and stop you (or your celestial)...


I don't want to say it's really wrong setting, but not so owerhelming about others as you want to say. when you change feats to my suggestion you'll lost the biggest weakness - disadvantage againts mage slayer, or get advantage to others.
 

Hohige

Explorer
Nice, but completely wrong.

At first something positive
- I believe when you have Blade ward and HAM, you use at first magic, than HAM, so from 12 dmg you'v got half - 6 dmg, then reduce to 3 dmg.

Than many negatives:
As you describe it, it can be only a Variant human - 4 feats. And use point buy system - STR, CON, CHA 15, other 8. From Racial and one feat incres you will be 16 on all three stats. Ok, but be dumb on dex? you very probably start last, and thats not good. In this "sandpools" It mean you lost your first round with fighter, and you'll get al 6 (or seven) attacks before you start casting your Celestilal... nothing good for you. And when do you use Standard array it stared to be not so strong. (Can got 2 +3 and than only +1, or +3 and two +2)

Then I'm wondering why so bad use of ASI - You really need only HA a HAM. Than +2 to STR and you can still take Warcaster or +2 to CON/CHA...

But you choose as you choose, so you can cast only with a weapon, or with shield, but no with both. So you will have -2 AC, or cant melee attack (as you write about green flame blade or booming blade).

And last, but really important part - You use absolutely wrong described fighter. I't doesnt count with battle master manouvers or eldritch knight. And his feats.

Battle master is most favorite choose and best against your sorcerer.

here are 2 versions:
DEX based melee - defensive, use sword and board,feats: defensive duelant, mage slayer, (can use shield master). You are now attacking against 25 AC as well. Will probably start first,

STR based - HWFS, HWM, PAM (maybe sentinel), Mage slayer.

DEX based ranged -archery style, SS, mageslayer,

and if they doesn't use every ASI, there can be magic initiate for hex.... or bless (when you use SS or HWM)

So what will be when fighter can start fight?
attack - hit? you can cast shield, he can use precision manouver, or if still beat it - Tripattack on you it will be not 2d6+ DEX/STR but 2d6+d8 and if he hav hex than 3d6+d8 and thats not so small as you laught. And can its really good chance to knock you prone (than attack with advantage) - if you arn't ranged fighter, than you use SS -5/+10 so it will be 2d6+1d8+10+DEX/STR..
and you will hit dice to maintain concentration with disadvantage. Have Celestial? Doesn't maintain PUFF.. You do? There are another 5 or 6 attacks...

Next attack with advantage? disarming attack - you'v had shield? No you havn't. -2 AC, or magic staff. or any casting focus? No. And again +d8 dmg.
and again concentration check. with disadvantage. And STR wariors can add -5/+10, so it will be really nasty...
.
.
.

trying to cast something? mage slayer - attack from oportunity... trying get out? attack of oportunity... If you use PAM and sentinel, bonus attack, and AoO when you'll come to his reach and stop you (or your celestial)...


I don't want to say it's really wrong setting, but not so owerhelming about others as you want to say. when you change feats to my suggestion you'll lost the biggest weakness - disadvantage againts mage slayer, or get advantage to others.

Well, I could drastically change the feats.

Lightly Armored, Moderadely armored. For +2 DEX and Shield proficiency.
+2 DEX and Prodigy feat ( for Expertise Stealth)
Well, Extended Mage Armor and Shield for 20 AC and 20 DEX.
+13 stealth check + Guidance cantrip (1d4) and subtle spell for casting spell with impunity (Sneaky Mage).

But, It's boring and presents no challenge.

Heavy Armor Sorcerer with 20STR is so much more fun and your group won't hate you.
And still extremely efficient at 1v1.




Melee vs Melee​

Thanks, your fighter has really improved a lot with your combo.
But there is still no risk for Muscle Sorcerer.

At first it was very confusing, you created several builds and mixed everything up, but let's look at it coldly here.

Spending EVERYTHING, all the superior die, action surge, resources are over here. Let's take a look. (1 round and It's over)

Hex against the Muscle Sorcerer. Counterspell and It's over.
No more shield spell. (fixed 20 AC)

Action Surging round. expending all superior die here.

No hex (Counterspelled).
5 Superior die for extra 5d10 weapon damage (If all hits)

7 attacks with +9 attack roll (6 Action Surging and 1 for mage killer).

2d6 + 5 = avg 12 - 3 (HAM) for 9 damage.
Blade Ward for 4.5 avg damage.

Final damage: 4.5 x 7 = 31 avg damage.

5 Superior die (d10) = 5.5 average damage.
5.5 / 2 (Blade Ward) x 5 attacks = 14 average damage.

The fighter's damage if all attacks hit is 45.
+9 atk vs 20 AC= 45% chance to hit.
+9 atk with advantage vs 20 = 67% chance to hit (best scenarious possible, but Divine Soul Sorcerer's favored by the gods and STR 20 can be hard to do)

I will consider that all of our goals were at an advantage, let's be generous with the fighter

Damage vs AC = 45*0,67= 30 average damage - 15THP (Regarless of the summon) = 15 real damage expending all resources possible.

The single heal spell can heal 70 HP.


Next round:

3 attacks for 12 avg damage each -3 HAM = 27 / 2 (Blade Ward) = 13,5 avg damage.
It's +9 vs 25 AC now.

For the next few turns, the fighter's real damage will be considered zero, no matter what he does.



Honorable mention: -5 / + 10 is just useless against high AC characters.
+4 attack need natural 20 on dice...



Archer vs Archer​

Archer 6 attacks longbow.

Weapon damage 4,5 +5 (DEX) = 9,5 piercing damage -3 HAM = 6,5 / 2 HAM = 3,25 avg piercing damage
6x3.25 = 19,5 if all hits.
+5d10 Superior die = 27,5 if all hits (Superior die for Knock prone the enemy?) It's apply disadvantage against your long bow attacks. I will consider, precision attack instead Trip attack.

Damage and attack rolls:

+11 (Archery Style) + 1d10 (5,5) = +16 on 5 attacks.

5 attacks with +16 atk roll vs 25 AC (60% chance to hit)= 3.25 x 5 x 0,60 = 9,75 avg piercing damage

or

5 attacks with SS (-5/+10) for +11 atk roll vs 25 AC (30% chance to hit)= 8.25 x 5 x 0,30 = 12,3 avg piercing damage

1 attack without superior die for +11 vs 25 AC (30% chance to hit)= 1 damage

Total damage vs AC is average 11~13 damage with action surge and expending all superior die.

Next round: The archer damage is nearly to 0.


The Muscle Sorcerer's Sentinel Summon (Radiant Longbow):
+9 attack (3 attacks) with 45 average radiant damage vs 18 AC. (45% chance to hit) = 20 radiant damage per turn.

Against the archer, the muscle sorcerer doesn't even have to spend spell slots.
 
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Hohige

Explorer
Add: When Muscle Sorcerer spends spell slots.

1599665682450.png

Expending 3th ~ 5th spells slots to cast Animate Dead to control 46 skeletons for 24 hour.
Help, Grapple, Shove, Knock Prone, Damaging
If all hits, It's 253 damage per round.

Converting 1 ~ 2 spells slots into higher spells slots (Sorcerer's flexible casting shenanigans).
The Muscle Sorcerer casts Extended Seeming Spell (16h), disguising himself and all controlled creatures (Skeletons and Celestial Summon).

The Celestial Summon can provide free 15 THP for skeletons.

Why Seeming Spell?

It disguises all creatures as a celestial creature, making it impossible for the enemy to distinguish the real enemy.
That combination makes any an illusionist jealous.


Subtle Metamagic and Seeming Spell

This combination is extremely potent, because the Muscle Sorcerer casts Subtle Spell to avoid be noticed. The enemy is unable to distinguish who was the caster, as it provides no visual or sound effects.
Without Subtle Spell, verbal and somatic components would reveal the true spellcaster.

It's effectively a Mirror Image spell with 48 duplicates

Tip:
Good on paper, but not so good in practice...
Extremely efficient, but this can bring serious social problems. If you are going to use this combination, make sure it is worth the risk and that you can save your party.

If your Party doesn't mind raising skeletons, go for it.

Be very careful with this combo, you can take all the fun out of the party, use it only in special situations.
 
Last edited:

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