D&D 4E The New 4e Class Patterns and what is missing

[Nahat Anoj]

I haven't seen anything that says the Ranger is a divine striker. Nothing that WotC has released suggests they have any divine magic - just that they are badasses with bows. R&C mentions nothing about rangers using divine magic, either.

I think the barbarian will be a "primal" defender with lots of striker-y abilities and the druid will be a "primal" leader. I used to think that the barbarian might be a striker, but the logic of some posts on the WotC boards and R&C's comment that the barbarian-druid connection will be like the paladin-cleric connection have made me change my mind.

 

[Steely Dan]

and the druid will be a "primal" leader.

Hopefully, if, as many people are speculating, the druid turns out to be a striker, I will be one unhappy little camper.

 

[Rechan]

The druid, at least at the point of R&C's publishing, is focused on shape-shifting and a few sundry spells.

I can't really interpret that any other way than saying that between the Druid and the Barbarian, one will be the defender and the other the striker. They could go either way.

 

[Nahat Anoj]

The druid, at least at the point of R&C's publishing, is focused on shape-shifting and a few sundry spells.

I can't really interpret that any other way than saying that between the Druid and the Barbarian, one will be the defender and the other the striker. They could go either way.

For me, the logic of a druid being a leader is that, through their shapeshifting, they will be able to mix it up in combat. This is a lot like a cleric or warlord, who are capable combatants by virtue of their good weapons and good armor. I think most of their spells will augment party members, being things like healing (probably a regen-style heal) and barkskin.

Having said that, I actually think druids will be able to adopt more defender-ish (bear, rhino) or more strikerish forms (big cat), depending on what is needed in combat. So they probably will be more versatile in that regard than clerics or warlords.

And the fact that they have to be in humanoid form to cast spells does seem to present a bit of a dilemma regarding their ability to cast support spells. That is, if they have to spend actions to shift form, that will hamper their ability to use healing magic *and* fight in combat, something that the warlord or cleric don't seem to worry about. However, I think even in animal form druids will have powers that allow them to support their allies. For example, when scoring a crit in bear form, the bear form might roar and infuse a druid's allies with primal energy, augmenting their attack power. In any case, I'm very interested with what they are doing with the druid.

 

[Steely Dan]

I can't really interpret that any other way than saying that between the Druid and the Barbarian, one will be the defender and the other the striker.

Oh man, if the druid is anything other than a controller or leader I will be bummed!

 

[Rechan]

Oh man, if the druid is anything other than a controller or leader I will be bummed!

I'm certain that if they make a "Natural" power source, that there will be a leader and a controller, and they'll get nature-based powers.

Honestly, an entangling, volcano-making, comet-summoning, cloud-of-gnats-calling controller is so easy to conceptualize.

I don't see why anyone would get bummed because Class with Name X is a Y and not a Z, when there's a class that does exactly Z with a different name.

What I think is being neglected is a Shaman-type leader. One that uses the spirits of nature to buff his friends. Or hey, he could actually have spirits possess PCs, giving the PC the supernatural powers that the spirits have. "Brother Snake, lend your poisonous fang to my rogue friend's knife." "Father mountain, grant my barbarian friend your unbreakable skin of Damage Reduction."

 

[Nahat Anoj]

Hopefully, if, as many people are speculating, the druid turns out to be a striker, I will be one unhappy little camper.

I don't think that will be the case. But it's fun to speculate on!

 

[Cadfan]

R&C mentioned ranged attack spells. If these select out specific targets, that's striking. If they're area of effect, that's controlling.

Really, outside the PHB, I expect to see a bit more role overlap. I like Dreamchaser's way of putting things. Don't think of a class as having one role and one role only. Think of them having a proclivity for certain roles.

Imagine that maybe we gave every class 10 points, to divide up amongst the various roles.

Fighters might be Defender: 9, Controller 1, because they mostly defend, aren't fast enough to get into position to strike, don't have healing or group benefit abilities, but do have a little bit of ability to control areas of the battlefield they can reach with their weapons. After all, there's a bit of overlap between battlefield control, and defending- specifically, the overlap is the threatened squares of the defender.

A Paladin might be Defender 8, Leader 2. Too slow to be a striker, fewer attack of opportunity type abilities that would let him fake being a shortrange controller if necessary, but with some group benefits like smites that release invigorating energies to his allies, making him a minor Leader.

So how's druid measure up here? If they do what I'm kind of expecting, they'll drop area of effect elemental attacks on enemies at range. At close quarters, they'll turn into an animal and bite people. They'll probably have some minor healing powers, because those are too iconic to lose- though they may not be in-combat healing powers.

So I'm not seeing too much striking, unless I'm wrong about the nature of the ranged attacks. I'm seeing a bit of defending, and a bit of controlling. And a tiny dollop of leading. Lets say, Defender 5, Controller 4, Leader 1?

Individual builds may vary, of course.

 

[Rechan]

R&C mentioned ranged attack spells. If these select out specific targets, that's striking. If they're area of effect, that's controlling.

Really, outside the PHB, I expect to see a bit more role overlap. I like Dreamchaser's way of putting things. Don't think of a class as having one role and one role only. Think of them having a proclivity for certain roles.

Yeah. Warlocks are strikers, but we've seen them throw down a bog of acid over an area and it stays - that's controllerish. R&C says clerics have flame-strike and other boom type tricks. That could be striker-like or controller-like, depending on how many targets it hits. Paladins can buff or heal allies in conjuction with his smites. That's leader-like.

 

[TwoSix]

Also the reason I had the 4th "Other Power" in there is some of the desciptions I've read dont lean themsevles clearly to arcane or divine. And as yet I dont think its been confirmed they are the only power courses in the 4e world.

The "other power" for barbarians, druids, etc. will be "primal." Reference the elf primal blaster in the back of R&C.