The one sorcerer to rule them all.

[Cheerful Coffin]

I just am not happy with the current sorcerer, I think it's build should be more focused on what I have dubbed "monster magic". (Spell-like abilities and the like.) As such I've completely redone the sorcerer class, judge for yourself if you believe it's worth having in your games or not. I havn't had the oppurtunity to try it in-game to see if it's balanced with the other core-classes. But I believe it is in it's own right and no longer has that wizard immitation feel to it..

Sorcerer.

Mage-guilds, preisthoods, and druid covens, these are popular spellcasting groups that set balance and order to our magical universe. However feel truly understand the sorcerer's grove. From the time they are small they are shunned and feared or highly respected for thier innate power. Whatever the case may be, thier spells neither come from intense study or a forieghn entity. But themselves and thier inner potential.

Adventurers:
Sorcerers heed the call to venture out in the world early in life. Wether it be out of curiosity of thier own potential or the fact that were shunned and ignored do to thier "inhuman" magic prowless, the sorcerer is very rarely hesitant to explore and to master his or her newfound art.

Characteristics:
Depending more-so on where and how they were raised, a sorcerer can be very compassionate and understanding do to thier powers being seen as a god-send, or they can be paranoid and bitter for being viewed as a bane to human exsistance. A sorcerer's origin may have more impact on the value of his character then the spells in which they themselves actually wield.

Alignment:
Sorcerers tend not to be as easy to label as other classes, sense differant people react differantly and are treated differantly depending on thier social upbringing with thier innitiate power. However most tend towards chaotic do to the random nature of thier abilities.

Religon:
Not particularly drawn to any sortof religon, sorcerers tend to stay out of the hussle and bussle politics of spiritualism. However they may be drawn to dieties simaler to thier incarnate spells. Such as magic gods like Bacob and Wee-Jas or nature ones such as Obi-Han and Ehlonna.

Background:
Sorcerers can have very differant backgrounds, some are raised from the time they are small with knowledge of thier inborn arcana do to having a long family line of "mutants", others may have sprung up unexpectedly and ran away to find inner peace or solitude, while some stay at home, either growing hateful with inner abuse or flourishing into fantastic individuals with loving-acceptance or a strong will.

Other classes:
Few classes can truly relate to the sorcerer, inborn magic is not about understanding so much as it is feeling it out. Wizard's know the technichals but don't have the intuitive nature, clerics and druids rationilize powers beyond thier own but can't quite grasp how a mere mortal can manifest it alone. It's both a lonely and a celebrity like exsistance for the sorcerer.

Role:
Sorcerers can take on many roles, but are ussually confined to one in particular. Though their "spells" can be cast nearly infinitely do to it's natural prowless, their knowledge of such individual arcana is very very limited sense it is inborn, not studied.

Abilities:
Charisma determines how hard a sorcerer's spell-like abilities are to resist, how many extra times per day you can use each level of innate sorcerey (Check the modifier, it's treated just like normal spellcasters in this case.) and a variety of sorcerer related abilities.

Alignment: Any.

Hit Die: d4.

Class Skills:
The sorcerer’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha),Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int).

Skill Points at 1st Level: (2 + Int modifier) x 4.

Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 2 + Int modifier.

BaB and saves: Same as PH.

Weapon and Armor Proficientcy:
Sorcerers are proficient with all simple weapons, light/medium armor, and shields. (But not tower shields.)

Spell-like abilities:
At first level you begin play knowing four level 0 spell-like abilities from the sorcerer/wizard spell list and three level 1 spell-like abilities from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. You learn an additional two spell-like abilities of a level you are able to cast each additional level.

_________________________________________________________________
Level 1: Summon Familiar. Sorcerey level 0/1. Spell-like abilities 1/day.
Level 2:
Level 3:
Level 4: Sorcerey level 2.
Level 5: Spell-like abilities 3/day.
Level 6: Sorcerey level 3.
Level 7:
Level 8: Sorcerey level 4.
Level 9:
Level 10: Sorcerey level 5. Spell-like abilities 4/day.
Level 11:
Level 12: Sorcerey level 6.
Level 13:
Level 14: Sorcerey level 7.
Level 15: Spell-like abilities 5/day.
Level 16: Sorcerey level 8.
Level 17:
Level 18: Sorcerey level 9.
Level 19:
Level 20: Spell-like abilities 6/day.

Sorcerer Only Feats:

Natural Born Talent. [Special]
Prequisite: Atleast one level in sorcerer.
Effect: Choose a number of extra cantrips from the sorcerer/wizard spell list equal to your charisma modifier if any. You now know these spell-like abilities in addition to your otherwise known spells.

Inborn Arcana. [Special]
Prequisite: Atleast one level in sorcerer. Able to cast the appropiate spell-like level.
Effect: Choose one extra spell-like abilitity from any spellcasting class list (Sorcerer/Wizard, cleric, druid, etc.) you learn that spell as though you otherwise could.

Inherited Power. [Special]
Prequisite: Atleast level 10 sorcerer.
Effect: Your spell-like abilities are now treated as supernatural abilities.

Strong Bloodlines. [Special.]
Prequisite: Atleast level 15 sorcerer. Inherited Power.
Effect: Your supernatural abilities are now treated as extradionary abilities.

 

[Pyrex]

Umm, wow. More spells known than a sorcerer, their spells can't be counterspelled, at 10th level their spells ignore SR and at 15th they both function in an Antimagic Field and affect creatures who are immune to magic?

How does this not make every other arcane caster totally obsolete?

*boggle*

 

[Bryin]

thanks man you basicly turned sorcerer into a template now. dude you rock

 

[Li Shenron]

Cheerful Coffin... you are crazy!

Check how many spells your Sorcerer knows and casts per day:

Known	 0    1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 1st	 4    3
 2	 6    5
 3	 8    7
 4	10   9    2
 5	12  11   4
 6	14  13   6    2
 7	16  15   8    4
 8	18  17  10   6    2
 9	20  19  12   8    4
10	22  21  14  10   6    2
11	24  23  16  12   8    4
12	26  25  18  14  10   6    2
13	28  27  20  16  12   8    4
14	30  29  22  18  14  10   6    2
15	32  31  24  20  16  12   8    4
16	34  33  26  22  18  14  10   6    2
17	36  35  28  24  20  16  12   8    4
18	38  37  30  26  22  18  14  10   6    2
19	40  39  32  28  24  20  16  12   8    4
20	42  41  34  30  26  22  18  14  10   6

Cast	  0     1     2     3     4     5     6     7    8    9
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 1st	  4     3
 2	  6     5
 3	  8     7
 4	 10    9     2
 5	 36   33   12
 6	 42   39   18    6
 7	 48   45   24   12
 8	 54   51   30   18    6
 9	 60   57   36   24   12
10	 88   84   56   40   24    8
11	 96   92   64   48   32   16
12	104 100  72   56   40   24    8
13	112 108  80   64   48   32   16
14	120 116  88   72   56   40   24    8
15	160 155 120 100  80   60   40   20
16	170 165 130 110  90   70   50   30  10
17	180 175 140 120 100  80   60   40  20
18	190 185 150 130 110  90   70   50  30  10
19	200 195 160 140 120 100  80   60  40  20
20	252 246 204 180 156 132 108  84  60  36

You see my problem? At least you should be careful of multiplying things, which is basically what happens if you keep increasing the number of s.l.a. known to ALL spell levels AND increase the number of uses per day of each.

Maybe when you say "per day" you don't mean each of the s.l.a. you know, is it perhaps that 1/day means you can cast ONE s.l.a. of each LEVEL you are able to cast? That would bring back to earth at least the casts/day, but still the number of known is really large... consider letting it learn 2 s.l.a. per level but only of the highest spell level (it would be at least closer to how many are learned by the Wizard).

Even with these 2 changes, you'd be knowing as many spells as a Wiz, casting more spells/day than every caster in the books, and they would be s.l.a. which is far better than spells (no components!). The special feats even break it more, removing the AoO for example.

As it is now, this looks more like a new class: the God

 

[Li Shenron]

edit: double

 

[Pyrex]

I think you wildly misinterpreted his table Li.

If I understood correctly, at each level they don't learn two spells per level, but two spells that they can add to any level they can cast, just like the Wizard. (which leaves them with just a few more spells known than a standard Sorcerer).

Also, though it isn't clear from the table above, I think (or I hope anyway) that the intent of "S.L.A. 6/day" is intended as a per-level total (i.e. 6 1st, 6 2nd, ..., 6 9th), not 6/day for each spell known.

 

[Cheerful Coffin]

I think you wildly misinterpreted his table Li.

If I understood correctly, at each level they don't learn two spells per level, but two spells that they can add to any level they can cast, just like the Wizard. (which leaves them with just a few more spells known than a standard Sorcerer).

Also, though it isn't clear from the table above, I think (or I hope anyway) that the intent of "S.L.A. 6/day" is intended as a per-level total (i.e. 6 1st, 6 2nd, ..., 6 9th), not 6/day for each spell known.

Yep, exactly.

 

[Khaalis]

My original pass at an Alt.Sorcerer followed the same baseline. I kept the Spells Per Day and Spells Known tables as is but instead of spells, made them spell-like abilities and gave them bonus feats at 1,5,10,15 and 20 to take feats such as Quicken Spell-Like Ability, Empower Spell-Like Ability, etc.

However, there were some inherent problems with this system.

From the SRD
Spell-Like: Spell-like abilities are magical and work just like spells (though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, material, focus, or XP components). They go away in an antimagic field and are subject to spell resistance if the spell the ability resembles or duplicates would be subject to spell resistance.

A spell-like ability usually has a limit on how often it can be used. A spell-like ability that can be used at will has no use limit. Using a spell-like ability is a standard action unless noted otherwise, and doing so while threatened provokes attacks of opportunity. It is possible to make a Concentration check to use a spell-like ability defensively and avoid provoking an attack of opportunity, just as when casting a spell. A spell-like ability can be disrupted just as a spell can be. Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counterspell, nor can they be counterspelled.

For creatures with spell-like abilities, a designated caster level defines how difficult it is to dispel their spell-like effects and to define any level-dependent variables (such as range and duration) the abilities might have. The creature’s caster level never affects which spell-like abilities the creature has; sometimes the given caster level is lower than the level a spellcasting character would need to cast the spell of the same name. If no caster level is specified, the caster level is equal to the creature’s Hit Dice. The saving throw (if any) against a spell-like ability is 10 + the level of the spell the ability resembles or duplicates + the creature’s Cha modifier.

Some spell-like abilities duplicate spells that work differently when cast by characters of different classes. A monster’s spell-like abilities are presumed to be the sorcerer/wizard versions. If the spell in question is not a sorcerer/wizard spell, then default to cleric, druid, bard, paladin, and ranger, in that order.

The issue: “though they are not spells and so have no verbal, somatic, material, focus, or XP components”

This is very broken when removing these components.
a) Detection: There is no way to detect a sorcerer activating a spell-like ability. This is even more powerful than psionics in this respect.

b) Prevention: Effects such as silence or physical interference such as being immobilized do nothing to hinder spellcasting. Image in a sorcerer with gaseous form that cannot be imprisoned short of in an anti-magic zone. Also… ” Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counterspell, nor can they be counterspelled.”

c) Cost: Imagine the sorcerer casting Identify or stoneskin without the gp cost or Permanency or Wish without the XP cost.
Currently would effect the following spells (PHB): identify, arcane lock, continual flame, magic mouth, phantom trap, nondetection, sepia snake sigil, illusory script, fire trap, stoneskin, scrying, animate dead, secret chest, symbol of sleep, false vision, magic jar, symbol of pain, permanency, wall of iron, analyze Dweomer, legend lore, true seeing, symbol of persuasion, contingency, programmed image, circle of death, create undead, symbol of fear, undeath to death, transformation, instant summons, mage’s magnificent mansion, plane shift, vision, symbol of stunning, forcecage, mage’s sword, simulacrum, symbol of weakness, limit wish, protection from spells, trap the soul, binding, symbol of sanity, sympathy, clone, create greater undead, symbol of death, temporal stasis, gate, refuge, teleportation circle, astral projection, soul bind, shapechange and wish!

Overall the change to Spell-Like Abilities is too powerful as a simple change. Limiting the list of Sorcerer spells available as Spell-Like Abilities to prevent abuse of the no component rule would help, as would reducing the number of Uses Per Day by 1 or even 2 per spell level. Otherwise the benefits gain from Spell-Like Ability use is too powerful.

JMHO - YMMV

 

[MichaelH]

I agree with the others. Converting the spells to spell-like abilities makes your alt.sorcerer too powerful. If you want sorcerers (and bards) to cast spells without components, there are a number of ways it can be done. Give them Eschew Materials as a bonus feat at first level. Or use Monte Cooks alt.sorcerer idea of substituting costly material components with XP cost.