The Prestige - great movie (spoilers probably)

[The Grumpy Celt]

I liked The Prestige but (A) I knew what Bale's character was up to about halfway through and (B) I thought the incident where

Spoiler

Jackman's character's wife dies was contrived to spark the fued between Bale's and Jackman's character; Why didn't Jackman open the lock, pop the lid and get his wife out of the tank that way? 'Cause the story needed for her to die.

But it was a fun and attractive movie.

Has anyone read the novel the movie is based on?

 

[Mean Eyed Cat]

My son and I saw it this last weekend and we liked it - although, like others, I was able to figure it out half way through. I thought it was interesting how Cutter referred to Telsa's machine as "real magic." Tesla always seemed like a really interesting person to me. I don't know much about him, but he always intrigued me.

 

[Joshua Randall]

I disliked the movie.

The entire movie depends upon

Spoiler

Angier (Jackman) being stupid in two fundamental ways.

(1) He fails to keep a backup copy of himself, just in case something goes wrong.
(2) He tears up Borden's confession as to how the Transported Man trick works. With that information (that Borden had a twin), Angiers would presumably not have been caught off-guard and killed at the end of the movie.

Bah. The Prestige insulted my intelligence.

 

[DrNilesCrane]

I disliked the movie.

The entire movie depends upon

Spoiler

Angier (Jackman) being stupid in two fundamental ways.

(1) He fails to keep a backup copy of himself, just in case something goes wrong.
(2) He tears up Borden's confession as to how the Transported Man trick works. With that information (that Borden had a twin), Angiers would presumably not have been caught off-guard and killed at the end of the movie.

Bah. The Prestige insulted my intelligence.

Interesting - I thought the same thing, although:

Spoiler

(1) His immediate reaction is to kill the copy of himself as soon as it appears - it seemed to me that he didn't want another version of himself around particularly if it was as willing to kill him as he would be of him (is that confusing pronoun usage or what)? Combined with the bad experience with a "duplicate" earlier in the movie and the fact he was utter self-centered and consumed by revenge, I thought it made sense to the character even though it wasn't wise.

(2) I think Hugh's character would have seen himself as less or weaker than Borden if he resorted to looking at the note (and in effect, showing Borden that he needed to be told how the trick was done): tearing it up was a "f*** you!" move of the overconfident victor. Not a wise move (Hugh's character definitely seemed to use Wisdom as his dump stat, relying on his numerous Faux Magician levels for a good will save...er...nevermind), but I felt that it was in character.

Hugh's character could have made some better choices, but if he was wise enough to avoid the two pitfalls you mentioned, well...I wonder if he would have gone down the path he did to begin with. Anyway, just my two cents...I hope it's a movie that isn't dismissed even if it's flawed. It's nice to see movies that try to do something different, even if they end up stumbling.

 

[Hand of Evil]

Interesting - I thought the same thing, although:

Spoiler

(1) His immediate reaction is to kill the copy of himself as soon as it appears - it seemed to me that he didn't want another version of himself around particularly if it was as willing to kill him as he would be of him (is that confusing pronoun usage or what)? Combined with the bad experience with a "duplicate" earlier in the movie and the fact he was utter self-centered and consumed by revenge, I thought it made sense to the character even though it wasn't wise.

(2) I think Hugh's character would have seen himself as less or weaker than Borden if he resorted to looking at the note (and in effect, showing Borden that he needed to be told how the trick was done): tearing it up was a "f*** you!" move of the overconfident victor. Not a wise move (Hugh's character definitely seemed to use Wisdom as his dump stat, relying on his numerous Faux Magician levels for a good will save...er...nevermind), but I felt that it was in character.

Hugh's character could have made some better choices, but if he was wise enough to avoid the two pitfalls you mentioned, well...I wonder if he would have gone down the path he did to begin with. Anyway, just my two cents...I hope it's a movie that isn't dismissed even if it's flawed. It's nice to see movies that try to do something different, even if they end up stumbling.

Note something to think on:
[sblock]it was not the murder that he was doing but suicide, he stepped into the portal knowing he was going to die, dropped into water, and his replacement would be created X feet away.[/sblock]

 

[Victim]

I dunno, given the remarks the character makes about not knowing, it doesn't seem that clearcut.

 

[John Crichton]

I disliked the movie.

The entire movie depends upon

Spoiler

Angier (Jackman) being stupid in two fundamental ways.

(1) He fails to keep a backup copy of himself, just in case something goes wrong.
(2) He tears up Borden's confession as to how the Transported Man trick works. With that information (that Borden had a twin), Angiers would presumably not have been caught off-guard and killed at the end of the movie.

Bah. The Prestige insulted my intelligence.

Then you remove character and emotion from the entire story. Neither man was a genius and both were fatally flawed. People do rash things and Angier had already proven that he was a bit of a hothead. And would you keep an exact duplicate of yourself around if you were a self-centered, obsessed, overly secretive, rich, manipulative murderer?

I thought the movie was very fair to the viewer and the story well done. Really, a fun and entertaining piece of filmaking. I almost wanted to stand up and applaud at the end.

 

[Saba Taru]

We saw this last Sunday. I wanted to like it. I really, really wanted to like it. The problem was, I'd gone and read the book and fell in love with it before we saw the movie. I was so disappointed in the movie I almost went and asked for my money back.

I loved the book. In my opinion, the movie carries a passing resemblance to the contents of the book, if you take the character names, some of the locations, and a smattering of the events that are the same between the two into consideration. Other than that, there are very few similarities between the movie and the book. They're almost so different as to be completely separate entities. I actually went into the movie expecting to be totally sympathetic to Angier, as I was with his character in the book, but they made him into a villian, which I strongly objected to. The tragedy of the book was in the events that neither side revealed to the other, and therein lay the core of the feud. Ah, well.

Out of curiosity, has anyone else read the book? If so, what did you think when compared to the movie?

 

[Joshua Randall]

Neither man was a genius and both were fatally flawed. People do rash things and Angier had already proven that he was a bit of a hothead.

Okay, I'll give you this. But...

And would you keep an exact duplicate of yourself around if you were a self-centered, obsessed, overly secretive, rich, manipulative murderer?

Maybe, maybe not, but that's not how it was presented in the movie. Angier said (during his dying confession / flashback) that he went into the machine with a gun handy because, "I wouldn't want to live like that" -- i.e. with a duplicate. He said it as though his delicate philosophical sensibilities would be offended by a double existing -- not as though he were an egomaniacal villain who would murder his own mother to get his way.

But even if I concede both your points, the movie's final act still depends upon stupidity -- if not from Angier, then from other characters.

(1) Borden's wife. There is no possible way that she could fail to realize that sometimes "her" Borden was really the twin. Yet the movie presented things such that she didn't know or realize this. Stupid.

(2) Borden. He essentially sells his daughter to some random nobleman he's never met? While he has a convenient twin on the outside who could check up on the nobleman? Yeah, right. Stupid.

(Of course, what's even more stupid is that movie undercuts itself by killing off Angier, rendering the daughter's situation irrelevant. It would have been far more dramatic if Bordern "won", but had to leave his daughter permanently in Angiers' estate.)

(3) Cutter. He remarks, "Blind stage hands. I approve." What he doesn't say, but definitely should have, is, "Blind stage hands. Three or four of them. Who all look identical. Er... what the [bleep] is going on here?!" Stupid.

(4) Angier. So let me get this straight: his means for keeping his awful secret a secret is to tell Cutter not to go backstage, and then employ a bunch of blind watchmen? You have to be kidding me.

First, Cutter is the guy who was coming up with all the magic tricks throughout the movie. Do you think that maybe, just possibly, he might be curious about how Angier does his transported man trick, and might, just might, want a peek backstage?

Second, what kind of mental defective uses a blind guy to guard the watery tank in which he is murdering himself/a copy every night for 100 days?

I'm sorry, but I still say the movie insulted my intelligence. I'm willing to suspend my disbelief -- I have no problem with the Tesla machine -- but I'm not willing to suspend my stupidity filter.

 

[John Crichton]

Okay, I'll give you this. But... Maybe, maybe not, but that's not how it was presented in the movie. Angier said (during his dying confession / flashback) that he went into the machine with a gun handy because, "I wouldn't want to live like that" -- i.e. with a duplicate. He said it as though his delicate philosophical sensibilities would be offended by a double existing -- not as though he were an egomaniacal villain who would murder his own mother to get his way.

I took it as "not wanting to live like that" meaning that he knew what he had become and he wasn't to be trusted.

(1) Borden's wife. There is no possible way that she could fail to realize that sometimes "her" Borden was really the twin. Yet the movie presented things such that she didn't know or realize this. Stupid.

Maybe she did realize it (or at least had a notion) and didn't want to be shared anymore and was sick of all the lies and manipulation. She did kill herself after all.

(2) Borden. He essentially sells his daughter to some random nobleman he's never met? While he has a convenient twin on the outside who could check up on the nobleman? Yeah, right. Stupid.

(Of course, what's even more stupid is that movie undercuts itself by killing off Angier, rendering the daughter's situation irrelevant. It would have been far more dramatic if Bordern "won", but had to leave his daughter permanently in Angiers' estate.)

Huh? He knew all was well because his twin was on the outside to take care of things and the Cutter was still kicking around. And don't forget that he was putting on an act to sell it to Angier at the end. They were playing each other. I thought it made sense just fine in the end.

(3) Cutter. He remarks, "Blind stage hands. I approve." What he doesn't say, but definitely should have, is, "Blind stage hands. Three or four of them. Who all look identical. Er... what the [bleep] is going on here?!" Stupid.

Hmm, I didn't notice that they were all identical. Good catch if that was true. And if it was, perhaps that was one of the breaking points that turned him against Angier. Cutter was a pretty bright guy and the only one in the movie who was a realist and right just about all the time.

(More on Cutter below.)

(4) Angier. So let me get this straight: his means for keeping his awful secret a secret is to tell Cutter not to go backstage, and then employ a bunch of blind watchmen? You have to be kidding me.

You do recall (as I'm assuming you do) that it was a setup, right? He wasn't trying to keep it a secret. He wanted to frame Borden, so no witnesses could be there.

First, Cutter is the guy who was coming up with all the magic tricks throughout the movie. Do you think that maybe, just possibly, he might be curious about how Angier does his transported man trick, and might, just might, want a peek backstage?

Perhaps Cutter did. I would say that he knew what was going on. At least to a point.

Either way, it didn't matter because Cutter knew very well that something was wrong with the situation and that Angier had crossed a line. He wanted the machine gone long before there were any reveals.

Second, what kind of mental defective uses a blind guy to guard the watery tank in which he is murdering himself/a copy every night for 100 days?

*shrugs* I don't think it really matters to the story but Angier did have many resources. He could have had other people around that made sure that only Borden was allowed back there and no one else. And he was already committing murder/suicide every night anyway so they guy is already a but shaky in the brains department.

I'm sorry, but I still say the movie insulted my intelligence. I'm willing to suspend my disbelief -- I have no problem with the Tesla machine -- but I'm not willing to suspend my stupidity filter.

I think many of your gripes are really nitpicking. It also seems that you were looking for flaws and assuming that characters would behave a certain way because that's what you think they should have done.

But hey, it's all good. I really enjoyed the movie and want to see it again now, if even just to see if he cloned the blind guys or not.