The Secret Inspiration Of 4th Edition?

[Celebrim]

We all make mistakes the first time around ...

Mistake? Why? We seem to have very different ideas as to what constitutes a mistake.

 

[Remathilis]

Mistake? Why? We seem to have very different ideas as to what constitutes a mistake.

Ok, change "NOBODY" to "FEW, if ANY".

 

[Plane Sailing]

Clavis, I've deleted your post which referred to F.A.T.A.L. as it was non grandma-friendly.

 

[Clavis]

Clavis, I've deleted your post which referred to F.A.T.A.L. as it was non grandma-friendly.

Sorry. There are probably few ways to talk about that "game" that would be grandma-friendly!

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Characters more powerful from the start...

Demonic characters playable under the core rules...

Special points to change die rolls...

Epic level play assumed in the system...

Is it just me, or is 4th Edition starting to sound a lot like THIS game:
http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_2265.html

I don't honestly know why everyone is so mean to poor old SenZar. It was awful and all, but it had spirit, and honestly, it came out of the same kind of thinking as 4E, just by vastly less talented individuals.

I mean, what was SenZar about? It was about TOTALLY KEWL POWERZ used by kewl dewdz, and I don't mean that in an entirely negative way. All the classes in it were classes people WANTED to play in D&D, but that didn't exist, or weren't quite that kewl. Same goes for the races.

Frankly, 3.XE has been full to the bleedin' brim with this sort of thing! Ya got yer Duskblades, your giant stone-men with huge combat bonuses (in races of stone), yer "full-conversion cyborg"-style Warforged in Eberron, yer Raptorians (don't try to pretend that that's not a SenZar-worthy name), your Warlocks, your playable monsters, your Book of Nine Swords classes, your Weapons of Legacy, your Soulknives, and so on, and so forth. If anything, SenZar, whilst wildly juvenile and containing a horrible system, was foward-looking, towards an era of kewl-ness, where people don't play things that aren't kewl, and indeed, in 4E, it seems like anything that isn't kewl (like gnomes and bards), isn't going to be in the PHB initially. You can bet Tielfing McWarlock will be, though, and Eladrin McGoldenWyvern-Hiddenfire the Wizard. Are they not KEWL? I believe they are.

So really, comparison invalid or unfair? No, not at all.

Maybe, under all the whinging about "anime" and "over-the-top" and so on, is why some people dislike the direction of 4E? 3E was full of kewl, but it was all in the optional add-on books. It seems like 4E will be full of kewl from the get-go. To me, that's a good thing, but I can certainly see why Grim McGritty and his crew of 36th Level Grognards might be a little upset. Back in there day, you didn't get to be kewl! You hit your demihuman level limit and YOU LIKED IT!

Well, if 4E is the SenZarification of the D&D, then maybe it's about time, I say.

 

[Celebrim]

I don't honestly know why everyone is so mean to poor old SenZar. It was awful and all, but it had spirit, and honestly, it came out of the same kind of thinking as 4E, just by vastly less talented individuals...

Nice post. You said what I was trying to say when I said that I that the designers of 4e had sat down and asked, "What do 14 year olds want?", only I couldn't figure out how to elaborate on that in a way that would get my point across. Thanks for saying what I wanted to say better than I could figure out how to say it.

 

[Reaper Steve]

The game is finally seeing an update from its 30 yr+ old sources of inspiration.
'Bout freakin' time.
That doesn't mean that it deserves the derogatory label 'kewl' and that it's geared towards 14-year-olds. Sure, that's a target demographic, but those that think that the 'only true D&D fantasy' is what came out of Gygax's mind 30 years ago have a 30 year outdated perspective.
I would say that 1e abomination amalgamation of ideas is closer to SenZar than 4e is.