who said anything about being a brave cold-blooded murderer?
please explain
on the tv-show one of the main characters does indeed murder someone so he can escape alive.
The Walking Dead
- Thread starter Ringlerun
- Start date
who said anything about being a brave cold-blooded murderer?
please explain
on the tv-show one of the main characters does indeed murder someone so he can escape alive.
Mercutio01
First Post
Shane is a cold-blooded murderer. He didn't shoot the fat guy to save the kid. He shot the fat guy to use as bait.
The OP did the same thing. He cold-cocked an innocent guy and threw him to the zombies as bait.
You called such actions, and I'm using your own words here, acting with "brains, bravery and cunning." I'll give you cunning. But it's certainly not brave.
The OP did the same thing. He cold-cocked an innocent guy and threw him to the zombies as bait.
You called such actions, and I'm using your own words here, acting with "brains, bravery and cunning." I'll give you cunning. But it's certainly not brave.
First, it is done when Shane and Otis are both alone and nearly surrounded by zombies...and second, he realizes the rest of his group- as well as the other farmers- would be so outraged by this that he lies about his actions.
This tells you that Shane committed an act away from his peer group he knows his group would consider reprehensible.
IOW, in no way does the series depict this as a "good" or "OK" act. I dare say that had Shane done what he did in front of his group (as the OP described his PC's actions), Rick, the show's hero probably would have killed him for the crime of murder. At the very least, Shane would have been kicked out of the group, probably without any weapons beyond a knife.
Seriously- there's nothing wrong with being a badass in a ZA plot line- there are at least 3 in the current storyline of The Walking Dead- but there IS something wrong with being an über-Nietschean, my-might-makes-me-right type when the party (of your gaming buddies, lets not forget) decides on another course of action.
And to put this in perspective, I'm saying this as a guy who played a thuggish Ftr/Th who bullied the party mage, including volunteering him to be covered in blood to serve as bait in a "Tsavo Maneaters" type scenario, and pushing him through a wall of fire to find a path out...
Last edited:
Mercuti01... you have miss-quoted me very poorly
the section of text you refer too is not at all related to the game but to the real world expectation that as a society Australians would react with bravery, brains and cunning if faced with a situation like "the walking dead" or some other apocalyptic event.
No where do I say anyones actions in the game from the OP to the NPC's was brave.... I expect an apology from your "hopefully" mistaken quoted and twisting of my words....
Az
Shane is in no way what most Americans would consider to be a role-model of how to act in a ZA. He is being written as a cancerous influence on the group. His reaction to the ZA has been a lapse into barbarism.
Rick, OTOH, is the classic hero. Heart of gold, keeps his vows...and intends to balance the needs of survival with what it means to be civilized. He has internalized the rules of his collapsed society to the point that he is willing to live AND die by them, even now.
Rick, OTOH, is the classic hero. Heart of gold, keeps his vows...and intends to balance the needs of survival with what it means to be civilized. He has internalized the rules of his collapsed society to the point that he is willing to live AND die by them, even now.
Mercutio01
First Post
No apologies from me. You said survival first, guilt and shame later, and you hoped normal Australians would act with the same brains, bravery, and cunning. That is, the same brains, bravery, and cunning as the man who murdered someone to use as bait, instead of the other "moronically stupid" Americans who chose not to murder someone for bait.
There's no twisting here. Those were your words. You held up the Shane character as a paragon for how to act.
Also you said
There's no twisting here. Those were your words. You held up the Shane character as a paragon for how to act.
Also you said
and then went on to describe this. So, again, no twisting.
Mercutio01... again you twist quotes and words to your own ends
In the tv show it was an AMERICAN who shot another AMERICAN for bait.
Where do I hold Shane up as a paragon? geez you really like to pick and chose words from any place on in a post and then place them together to create some new fantasy so you can get all trollish and have a say.
In the game, all the players were Australian + the GM. How did American game players come into this? Your twisting my words and creating situations that do not exist.
I posted this "Yes I'm proudly an Australian and hope that most "normal Australian" people when confronted with a situation like the walking dead would act with more brains, bravery and cunning to survive!"
Where does it indicate that I support anyone murdering anyone? The Tv-show is about Americans surviving after a ZA. Watching the Tv-show frustrates me because of how the characters place morals and feelings and social behaviour before survival.
To feel guilt, shame and remorse you first HAVE TO SURVIVE.
As my quote shows, I said with MORE brains, bravery and cunning, ie in comparison to how the pathetic American characters have so portrayed themselves.
still waiting for an apology
Az
The one character who consistently puts survival first- ahead of morality, feelings, and social behaviors- is Shane. Then you go on talking about how Aussies would do things differently.
But without putting words in your mouth, what- EXACTLY- do you think the typical city-living Aussie would have done differently than the core group of TWD's Atlanta-area residents?
Mercutio01
First Post
And that's important, why?
You said he was right to shoot the fat guy. Then you said that putting survival first is a brave thing to do.
Which indicates what, in your mind? So I don't put more words in your mouth, what exactly is your meaning? Do you mean that you hope more Australians would act like Shane, killing people who are inconveniences?
Exactly. You're saying that being immoral is important, and that is takes "brains, bravery, and cunning" to be that way.
And your basis for that is the Shane character, who is who you hope more Australians would act like, rather than Rick.
Again, you said that Shane's murder of the fat guy was a good thing (by twisting the actual event. He didn't kill the fat guy to save the kid. He shot the fat guy to use as bait for the zombies and then watched as he was brutally eaten alive.) and then went on to accuse all the other characters of being morons. You have now said that morals have no place in a ZA, and that survival is the only standard, and that being able to set aside morals and feelings takes "brains, bravery, and cunning."
And that you hope regular Australians would be able to set aside their morals, feelings, and guilt to survive. I don't think that setting aside morals and shooting innocent people who are trying to help you is a definition of bravery. And I think that doing such immoral acts is cold-blooded murder. And cold-blooded murder is not brave either.
So keep waiting. I'm sure there's an apology running around in my house somewhere, but I haven't found a need to use it yet.
Aussies, even city living Aussies, know about survival because we live with some of the most dangerous and poisonous critters on the planet. If you are stupid, you die. From the first fleet of pioneers who settled into Australia, if you were stupid, you died. If you died because you were stupid then you had little chance of having stupid offspring.
We now have a society that respects danger, acknowledges danger from the smallest insect to the biggest man eating sharks.
After watching this show I can place some very definite comparisons about Atlanta to Australia
Merl the redneck beat down the sole black character
The other redneck beat his wife and had lustful intentions to his 12yo daughter
The farm owner thought his barn was a great meeting place for flesh eating zombies
can't say I have watched any Tv show from Australia depicting this kind of behavior!
I would like to believe that any Aussie faced with the imminent danger of some land walking shark ready to eat your face off would behave with some survival instinct breed into them from the first settlers when survival from snake, spider, octopus, crocodile, shark, shell fish and many other forms of danger and poisons threatened their selves or family.
I guess Urban Americans no longer have a survival instinct...
Az
We now have a society that respects danger, acknowledges danger from the smallest insect to the biggest man eating sharks.
After watching this show I can place some very definite comparisons about Atlanta to Australia
Merl the redneck beat down the sole black character
The other redneck beat his wife and had lustful intentions to his 12yo daughter
The farm owner thought his barn was a great meeting place for flesh eating zombies
can't say I have watched any Tv show from Australia depicting this kind of behavior!
I would like to believe that any Aussie faced with the imminent danger of some land walking shark ready to eat your face off would behave with some survival instinct breed into them from the first settlers when survival from snake, spider, octopus, crocodile, shark, shell fish and many other forms of danger and poisons threatened their selves or family.
I guess Urban Americans no longer have a survival instinct...
Az
Similar Threads
