The Witcher setting conversion

dd.stevenson

Super KY
Pretty cool.

My biggest problem, as someone who's only played the computer games and not read the novels, is that wizard magic in this setting is designed for narrative purposes and not for party-based gameplay. (The same as lord of the rings, really.) And that's hard to hack, because it's a setting fueled fundamentally by the inequality between those who enjoy the power of magic and those who do not.

I think if I were to run a witcher rpg, I would either ditch D&D and go for an indie-style narrative game, or I would run an all-witcher party--which is not such a bad option, since I really love what you did with the witcher class!
 
[MENTION=6683099]dd.stevenson[/MENTION]

If you think about it, all of the mages in the books and the games are rather high level characters. There are no 1st level wizards in the story of the Witcher. Characters like Triss and Yennefer are, in D&D terms, easily 9th level characters and probably higher.

At the same time, look at the arc of Triss in Witcher 2 and 3. She is taken captive by soldiers in Witcher 2 and compressed via magic into a little statue. Later she is leading a desperate escape for mages being pursued by witch hunters in Witcher 3. That paints the image of a world where even a group of mighty mages have reason to fear the powers that be.

I think the key thing to remember is that if you were starting a group of players off at 1st level, for example, the mages would be freshly graduated from Aretuza or Ban Ard. They would not be prominent members in the Circle of Mages or Lodge of Sorceresses, at least not yet.
 

dd.stevenson

Super KY
(snip) There are no 1st level wizards in the story of the Witcher.
But that's the heart of the concern--low level wizards don't exist in the fiction. If we put them in, how much of the setting will we lose? I think: a lot, because the power difference between the haves and have-nots is a fundamental theme fueling the darkness of this setting by blurring the difference between monsters and humans.

Sorry for raising a specter of the "simulating fiction with D&D" argument in your houserule thread! And if you like the feel of low level wizards in the witcher, then please disregard my concerns, as I haven't tested them with any kind of actual play.
 
[MENTION=6683099]dd.stevenson[/MENTION]

No need to apologize! It's a valid concern.

Actually, it might make for a very interesting game if you started other characters at 3rd level (with maximum HP) and "mages" at 9th level (with average HP)! Horribly unbalanced until XP balanced out, yes, but it might help reinforce the themes about the power difference between those with magic and those without. The DM could throw either lots of lower-level challenges at the group or set up a two-fold encounters with one part for the lower-level PCs and one part for the higher-level "mage" PCs.
 

Rod Staffwand

aka Ermlaspur Flormbator
I'm not up on my witcher lore, but I rather like the class. A bit complicated with lots of moving parts, but kind of what I wanted the 5e ranger to be. XP for you, sir.
 
I'm not up on my witcher lore, but I rather like the class. A bit complicated with lots of moving parts, but kind of what I wanted the 5e ranger to be. XP for you, sir.
Yes, I built it to be about 4-5x bigger than other classes because I wanted groups to have the option of an all-witcher group without the characters feeling overly similar.

Anyhow, glad a few folks appreciate the conversion. :) Witcher fans seem to make up a very small segment of ENWorld. I will update this week with a more polished version with finished classes.
 

SilentWolf

Visitor
I'm reading your conversion, this days.
I'm still at the beginning of your document, but so far I am thinking you have done a great job.

Specifically, I found several optional rules really useful. The "Weapon & Armor Breakage" is good idea, as the insert of the Circle of Elements in order to ensure Spellcaster with spell slots refresh. Another good idea is to give Cleric with Life & Nature Domain Herbalism Kit and Medicine, instead of heavy armor.
In general, Classes and Races have been presented with the right "witcher" flavor.

Now I have to read the Witcher Class.
For now I can't judge the whole Class, but at first glance there is already an issue: I don't know the Class balance, but it would be better if it has not dead levels (9, 13 and 14).
 
I'm reading your conversion, this days.
I'm still at the beginning of your document, but so far I am thinking you have done a great job.
Gratzie mille!

Bear in mind that it's a work in progress. I've since worked out all the witcher schools and source sub-classes.

Now I have to read the Witcher Class.
For now I can't judge the whole Class, but at first glance there is already an issue: I don't know the Class balance, but it would be better if it has not dead levels (9, 13 and 14).
Well, they're not really dead levels.

Combat Superiority grants the witcher new maneuvers at 5th, 9th, 13th, and 17th levels.

Also, the witcher gains a new Sign at 14th level.

Not as interesting as other levels of the class, sure, but this is pretty much on par with the fighter's Indomitable feature.
 
So...Ive built this over the past couple days, and it hasn't really gotten the traction I thought it would. Since you just so happened to build a (much nicer looking) version, I'd like to get your opinion on my interpretation.

Keep in mind: based solely off of my experience with The wild Hunt.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?420965-Witcher-Class-(WIP)&p=19388260#post19388260
Great work! I think it's a worthy first pass, and I like how you included a Bestiary feature. My critique parallels [MENTION=19587]Zen[/MENTION]Bears's - you're versions of Igni and Quen are flat out overpowered. Either you need to introduce some limit to the use of signs or you need to tone down Igni and Quen. Also, granting them Extra Attack (or your renamed version of it) AND +1d8 extra damage vs monsters with silver swords is probably too much.

That said, you've got a very "true to game" version of the Witcher here. I like it. My suggestion would be to read The Last Wish and gain exposure to some of the other source material. There's some inspiring stuff in there. For example, the at-will non-combat Sign uses in my version of the Witcher class are derived from the book.
 
I made a few edits, hopefully those abilities are a bit more balanced. You're right, I really do need to read the books; I really love Geralt's story, and I'd like to see how much has bled over from the novels.

To your point about Extra Attack, paladins get both Extra attack and Improved Divine Smite, which is what this was balanced against.
 
I made a few edits, hopefully those abilities are a bit more balanced. You're right, I really do need to read the books; I really love Geralt's story, and I'd like to see how much has bled over from the novels.

To your point about Extra Attack, paladins get both Extra attack and Improved Divine Smite, which is what this was balanced against.
Ah, I guess that works then. My suggestion would be to do a feature-by-feature comparison of your witcher class to the paladin class. For example, something like what I did for my witcher class compared to the fighter:



It's not a direct 1-for-1 comparison, of course, but an approximation to keep the power level in the same ball park.
 

MoutonRustique

Explorer
Finally!

I wasn't able to post yesterday - the forum wouldn't load the comment box... Maybe it was a "karmic ban" from my sparking that edition fisticuffs in another thread -which was NOT my intention!

But no matter.
[MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION], I'd like to pick your brain about the alchemy portion of the witcher class. I'm having a hard time figuring out how often it is supposed to come into play.

Also, you should really add this creation to your sig. While it's not as awesome as your Planescape conversions - oh yeah, your Planescape conversions are awesome btw - it is really very, very cool.

Annddd... it would be easier to find for me. But, you know, whatever. :p
 
Finally!

I wasn't able to post yesterday - the forum wouldn't load the comment box... Maybe it was a "karmic ban" from my sparking that edition fisticuffs in another thread -which was NOT my intention!
Haha, yeah just say NO to edition warring.

[MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION], I'd like to pick your brain about the alchemy portion of the witcher class. I'm having a hard time figuring out how often it is supposed to come into play.
I have a very DM-player collaborative style, so I normally am not too worries about pinning down things with exact language. Sometimes that can be a problem! Basically, alchemy has built in limits to prevent abuse: You need an hour to prepare witcher potions, you need to spend gold or monster parts, and you can only consume a number of potions up to Constitution modifier before needing a short rest.

So *how frequently* a witcher PC could use their potions would depend on the pacing of the adventure, wouldn't it?

The only scenario a DM would want to avoid (or change the way Witcher Alchemy works if this is a common situation in their games) is where the party has multiple encounters during a day with a short rest in between most encounters.

Also, you should really add this creation to your sig. While it's not as awesome as your Planescape conversions - oh yeah, your Planescape conversions are awesome btw - it is really very, very cool.

Annddd... it would be easier to find for me. But, you know, whatever. :p
Done! I put a link to the Google Drive PDF in my sig. Let me know if it doesn't work?
 
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MoutonRustique

Explorer
I have a very DM-player collaborative style, so I normally am not too worries about pinning down things with exact language. Sometimes that can be a problem!
It's not one when everyone knows the "idea" of it. I'm just having a hard time "visualizing" it for some reason...

Basically, alchemy has built in limits to prevent abuse: You need an hour to prepare witcher potions, you need to spend gold or monster parts, and you can only consume a number of potions up to Constitution modifier before needing a short rest.

So *how frequently* a witcher PC could use their potions would depend on the pacing of the adventure, wouldn't it?
Ok, so, point form:
- an hour to prepare (*check*)
- how long do they last once prepared (*blank box*)
- consumption limited by frequency of short rest (*check*)
- but if one can store them up, and there's the one that can reduce toxicity to 0, then... (*blank box*)
- the gold/monster part is too hard to plan out, so I'm killing it (not appropriate for the game in which the variant will be used)

I guess my real question is about this phrase :
The maximum number of potions you can prepare at a time is equal to your proficiency bonus.
Does this mean : (1) in that one hour required to craft a potion, you can simultaneously craft a number of potions equal to you proficiency bonus.
(2) You can "have crafted" a number of potions equal to your proficiency bonus - a form of hard limit on how many you can have at any one time.
(3) only pink elephants can fly - the story of Dumbo was a lie, a very sneaky lie. (I don't know where that came from, but I found it funny, so it's staying in.)

Done! I put a link to the Google Drive PDF in my sig. Let me know if it doesn't work?
Thank you very much. And it works!
 
- how long do they last once prepared (*blank box*)
Nope, that's a check. Each potion explains how long it lasts. 1 hour. Just like potions in the DMG.

- but if one can store them up, and there's the one that can reduce toxicity to 0, then... (*blank box*)
- the gold/monster part is too hard to plan out, so I'm killing it (not appropriate for the game in which the variant will be used)

Does this mean : (1) in that one hour required to craft a potion, you can simultaneously craft a number of potions equal to you proficiency bonus.
(2) You can "have crafted" a number of potions equal to your proficiency bonus - a form of hard limit on how many you can have at any one time.
I intended it as #2, a hard limit on the maximum number of potions you can prepare. The narrative justification I use for this is that witcher potions have a shelf life preventing them from being stock-piled. It's not a 1-to-1 map to the narrative explanation, but I think it will work in play.

Since I'm running a PbP witcher game soon, I'll have some actual play reports about how all this works and will adjust accordingly.

- the gold/monster part is too hard to plan out, so I'm killing it (not appropriate for the game in which the variant will be used)
I would think in that case it would be *especially* important to have some kind of hard limit.
 

MoutonRustique

Explorer
Nope, that's a check. Each potion explains how long it lasts. 1 hour. Just like potions in the DMG.
Ah, ha! This is where my incomprehension comes from.

I will use these definition :
(A) how long the potion lasts - how long the potion remains effective w/o being consumed. Its "shelf-life" if you would.

(B) how long the effect lasts - this is how long the effect of the potion lasts (i.e. 1 hour acid resistance)

I was (still am?) having trouble with the first one (A). But I think I've figured out your meaning :
- it takes an hour to craft a potion
- they last indefinitely
- you can have a set number of potions created at any one time

Is this the meaning? If so, then the "usage" becomes ~ proficiency bonus/short rest* (or ~ 2x prof per day)

*the star refers to the fact that the creation requires another hour - so, in a sense, a "two hours" short rest. Of course there will be situation where one hour over two will make a difference, but there will also be plenty of them where it does not - hence the *.

Here's hoping I got it this time.
 
MoutonRustique said:
I was (still am?) having trouble with the first one (A). But I think I've figured out your meaning :
- it takes an hour to craft a potion
- they last indefinitely
- you can have a set number of potions created at any one time
Yes, that's how I intended it.

I'd just allow the crafting to happen during a short rest, not require an hour apart from it (unless, of course, they were brewing multiple potions).

Though the hard limit of potions you can have created at a time works for balance, I'm not entirely satisfied with it not mapping exactly to the fiction. Still it should work ok.

Btw, are you running a witcher game? Or are you hacking the alchemy for a class of your own creation?
 

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