Third Party Character Creation iOS App Removed

The d20 Fight Club for D&D 5th Edition iOS app has been removed from the Apple App Store by its creator at the request of WotC. The creator reports that he received a Cease & Desist demand (although it's worth noting that some supposed recent C&Ds appear to have turned out to be amicable requests). This follows on from the removal of the D&D Tools website and the more recent online character generator.

The creator reports that "I received a cease and desist order from Wizards of the Coast. All D&D apps will be removed from the App Store as they weren't compliant with WotC's copyrights and trademarks. Hopefully they'll be back in some form someday. Til then, thanks for all the support."

Nobody has actually shared one of these C&Ds yet, and others have indicated that what they actually received was simply a friendly email asking that they respect WotC's trademarks, so it's not entirely clear what is happening. Hopefully somebody will share one soon!

It does look like this particular app contained text and stat blocks copied directly from the D&D books. Below is the DM version of the app (the companion to the character creation app).

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[Shasarak]

"Same or better". That means there was a value judgment, such as "Which is better, WoW or D&D?" The "D&D is better" and "They're the both about the same" responses added up to 94%.

Especially since only 80% know what WoW is.

I wish they had added Diablo in there as an option as well.

 

[Iosue]

It is always worth educating oneself before speaking. It helps saving oneself from embarassement. http://www.vox.com/2014/8/11/5974743/marvels-x-men-conspiracy-theory-guardians-future

You're welcomed.

So, for the lazy ones who do not read articles. Well, the contracts weren't very good for Marvel. Like only 5% of the profits of the movies and not a lot from merchandise. There are reasons why they want to get the rights back and support the comics less and less.

5% of the revenue. 5% of the revenue from the first X-Men movie got them just under $15 million from the box office alone, not counting DVD sales, merchandise (which is totally separate from the contracts with Fox and Sony), and indeed, increased sales of the comic books. They would get $20 million from X-Men 2, and even more from X-Men 3. Spider-Man got them $41 million, and that's assuming they licensed him for the same amount as the X-Men, which I find unlikely.

That doesn't make the contracts bad. Marvel was the toast of the town for a while. Everyone was feting Avi Arad for having turned the company around and saved Marvel. Those contracts are what gave Marvel the wherewithal to start their own movie studio.

But please, spin away how that guy from Disney/Marvel doesn't meen what the author of the article and I think it meens.

Given that he refers to "X-Men truthers", I'm not sure you and the author are on the same page. But all the article says is that the studios were in a strong position when they negotiated the contracts, so X-Men was licensed for 5% of revenue, which of course is a pittance when Marvel's making its own movies and keeping 100% of the profits. That doesn't mean the contracts were bad. It means producing your own product, if you can, is better on the whole than merely getting licensing revenue.

 

[Dannager]

Especially since only 80% know what WoW is.

I wish they had added Diablo in there as an option as well.

I think it's very likely that the value judgment was made up of only respondents familiar with both properties (WoW and D&D).

Also, the research took place in 2008. Diablo didn't have very much relevance at that point.

 

[Kramodlog]

Great policy! Fortunately, this isn't my gut feeling! Which I already told you, of course, but you didn't believe me because you think I might be a liar.

Hahaha! Not a liar. Just someone who isn't very critical. Don't take things so personally. D&D is just a game.

So, here you go! I'd make a snide comment about telling you to educate yourself, and how your opinions will magically improve after reading it, and snarkily tell you that you're welcome, but I think that kind of useless snark is getting more than a little stale in this thread.

I'll help you out. There is one key info that is missing. Who were questioned for this poll? With aid, 89% of people know about D&D? What is "aid"? 89% of whom? I doubt old folks, who represent more than 11% of population know about it. 89% of people between 18 and 35 years old? That is a key democraphic and makes could make more sense. Not convinced? Let us continue our journey!

54% played it!? That is huge for the entire adult population of the US. Even if people lied about it, that is very high for a RPG who had 24 million people play it at one point or another (so less than 1% of total US poluation). Yeah, things do not add up. Scout Rousse's numbers need a bit more clarification. They need to be put into context. Who was questioned for this? But I'm not someone wants to make them tell a story. I'm just being critical.

And once again, I'm glad to be of help.

Hilariously, someone upthread was talking about how D&D can't approach Blizzard because its brand recognition isn't strong enough.

Haha! No, you misread or doing what is called a strawman. Check it out, it is very common on these boards. Now, the the learning moment as pass, so let us go back to what I actually said. I said that WotC wasn't in a position to get the upper hand in negociation with Blizzard, like Marvel wasn't in a great position in the 90s (what was the brand recognition of Marvel and its heros in the 90s? oh yeah, I guess pretty high) when it negociated with Sony and 20th Century Fox. Did you read the article I linked? It had more words than my short post, so I guess there are more chances you misunderstood. But now I explained some of it. All is well.

Of course, WotC negociating with the world famous Trapdoor Entertainment certainly meens that it is giving small players a chance to shine since D&D is so well known. WotC is great like that. WotC is love. WotC is life.

 

[Kramodlog]

I did not expect to see that 54% of people have played DnD and 94% think it is the same as WoW.

Which democraphic was questioned? That is an important info we do not have. I suspect 18 to 35 years old. I have doubts that a lot of 70 years old were aware of WoW and D&D. In the post above this one I have a link to an article where WotC says that 24 million people use to play D&D. 24 million people is less than 1% of the US's population. Things do not add up. More clarifiation is need on the brand recognition numbers.

 

[Kramodlog]

5% of the revenue. 5% of the revenue from the first X-Men movie got them just under $15 million from the box office alone, not counting DVD sales, merchandise (which is totally separate from the contracts with Fox and Sony), and indeed, increased sales of the comic books. They would get $20 million from X-Men 2, and even more from X-Men 3. Spider-Man got them $41 million, and that's assuming they licensed him for the same amount as the X-Men, which I find unlikely.

That doesn't make the contracts bad. Marvel was the toast of the town for a while. Everyone was feting Avi Arad for having turned the company around and saved Marvel. Those contracts are what gave Marvel the wherewithal to start their own movie studio.

Given that he refers to "X-Men truthers", I'm not sure you and the author are on the same page. But all the article says is that the studios were in a strong position when they negotiated the contracts, so X-Men was licensed for 5% of revenue, which of course is a pittance when Marvel's making its own movies and keeping 100% of the profits. That doesn't mean the contracts were bad. It means producing your own product, if you can, is better on the whole than merely getting licensing revenue.

Heh. Predicted it.

But please, spin away how that guy from Disney/Marvel doesn't meen what the author of the article and I think it meens.

It is a gift. I need to use my powers for good, not evil.

I need to use my powers for good, not evil.

I need to use my powers for good, not evil.

 

[Shasarak]

I think it's very likely that the value judgment was made up of only respondents familiar with both properties (WoW and D&D).

Also, the research took place in 2008. Diablo didn't have very much relevance at that point.

**Cough**1996 and 2000**Cough**

 

[Dannager]

I'll help you out. There is one key info that is missing. Who were questioned for this poll? With aid, 89% know about D&D. What is "aid"?

You would know the answer to that, if you were familiar with market research. "Aided awareness" is the term for the metric that determines brand recognition. "Unaided awareness" determines something called brand recall. You can read more about it, at this link.

89% of whom? I doubt old folks, who represent more than 11% of population know about it. 89% of people between 18 and 35 years old? That is a key democraphic, it could make more sense. How many men and women in that sample?

The survey was carried out by a professional market research group as part of a survey conducted for internal reasons. The survey's results are not a marketing tool. They are to assist WotC in making sound business decisions. Accordingly, you shouldn't expect them to be inflated in any way. They were probably conducted against a representative sample of the total market.

More importantly, why does it matter? The original argument was that WotC can't sit at the table with big names like Blizzard Entertainment because D&D's brand recognition can't compete. I just provided a market research study that shows D&D's brand recognition to be significantly higher than World of Warcraft, Blizzard's star property. That's about as bulletproof a rebuttal as anyone could possibly muster.

56% showed a high interest in buying it? That is huge for the entire adult population of the US. Even if people lied about buying it, that is very high for a RPG who had 24 million people play it at one point or another (so less than 1% of total US poluation).

Oh god, how many people do you think live in the United States? The U.S. has a population of just over 300 million people. 24 million is more than 7% the total national population.

56% of US population wants to buy D&D produtcs for less than 1%? Yeah, things do not add up.

Namely, your math.

Scout Rousse's numbers need a bit more clarification. They need to be put into context.

No, they really don't. This is very standard stuff.

I'm not someone wants to make them tell a story. I'm just being critical.

You're not in a position to be critical. I want to be clear, I'm not trying to insult you, here, when I say that you simply don't have the requisite knowledge to be leveling meaningful criticism at this study.

And once again, I'm glad to be of help.

Come on, man.

Haha! No, you misread or doing what is called a strawman. Check it out, it is very common on these boards. Now, the the learning moment as pass, so let us go back to what I actually said. I said that WotC wasn't in a position to get the upper hand in negociation with Blizzard, like Marvel wasn't in a great position in the 90s (what was the brand recognition of Marvel and its heros in the 90s? oh yeah, I guess pretty high) when it negociated with Sony and 20th Century Fox. Did you read the article I linked? It had more words than my short post, so I guess there are more chances you misunderstood. But now I explained some of it. All is well.

You literally used the words "brand recognition" as evidence that WotC can't hold their own at the negotiating table. If you don't want to be corrected on critical points, don't talk about things you aren't familiar with.

 

[Dannager]

**Cough**1996 and 2000**Cough**

Pardon? I know when the games were released.

 

[Kramodlog]

The survey's results are not a marketing tool.

I neve said they were . I sahred a link to strawman. What am I suppose to do mre here? Sigh.

I just provided a market research study that shows D&D's brand recognition to be significantly higher than World of Warcraft, Blizzard's star property.

It is dated. 2009. Things change. Brand recognition too. I was also comparing with Marvel. Do you think Spider-Man wasn't know in the 90s? that didn't help Marvel get the upper hand in the contracts with Fox and Sony.

Oh god, how many people do you think live in the United States? The U.S. has a population of just over 300 million people. 24 million is more than 7% the total national population.

Oh yeah bad. Math. Late. My point still stands.

54% of the people in the survey say they play D&D. WotC says 7% of the US's population played D&D in there lives. Total. Ever. Numbers do not add up. Your bullet proof whatever, isn't proof. The key point misising is which demographics was surveyed. I suspect 18 to 35 years old. Not the entire US population. There is a difference.

I say that you simply don't have the requisite knowledge to be leveling meaningful criticism at this study.

Oh irony, I love you.

Don't talk about things you aren't familiar with.

Right back at you, mate.