D&D 4E Three Moves to Fix/Change 4E

[Mercurius]

Lots of great ideas, thanks. There seem to be some repeat themes emerging, in particular:

1) Feats clean-up
2) Math/inherent bonuses fix
3) Magic items

There are others (themes, rituals, etc), but those seem to be the most common fixes.

Another thing to note - most of the suggestions aren't "game changers" - they could be done with a revision of the 4E game. Sure, they would be akin to "4.5" or "4.7" but it wouldn't be like the 2E-to-3E or 3.5-to-4E massive changes.

I sincerely hope that WotC are listening as there are some really excellent suggestions here. Good work, folks.

 

[RangerWickett]

1. Introduce a new first step in character creation, covering background, history, connections to the world, and personality. Make it like a mini-game, akin to what Rogue Trader does, where you get small mechanical perks for different backstory decisions. And give the GM knobs and toggles so he can easily steer PCs toward certain choices that are more appropriate to a particular setting or plot-line.

2. Use Gamma World math for characters. You add your whole level to attacks, defenses, and damage. Stats no longer increase as you level.

3. Massive overhaul of magic items. Eliminate +x items, because their math fix is no longer needed. Magic items will generally just provide extra options, not mathematically superior attack bonuses, defenses, or damage, so you can rate (and price) magic items not by 'power level,' but by tier. (I.e., GMs would be advised not to hand out flying carpets until paragon tier, and no vorpal swords until epic tier).

 

[drothgery]

1) Like everyone else said, bake the math fix feat taxes into the game (and really, do it by fixing the monster defense and attack progressions; 1/2 level + ability + magic is simple and straightforward, so give the normally pre-calculated bad guys any wonky math)
2) Also like many have said, do a serious cleanup of the feat choices. Basic principle of feats - they provide fixed bonuses that are available to all characters; they never have pre-requisites other than one of race, power source, or one feat that has no pre-requisites.
3) Going against the grain on this one - one power source, one combat role, one primary ability score, and one of melee or ranged -> one class. I like a lot of what was done with Essentials, but this bugged me (as do V-shaped classes, and classes that can't make up their mind as to whether they're melee or ranged).

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Oh, and if I'm allowed one last tiny thing, a one line bug fix. A new action.
Lunge: Standard action. Move up to one square and make a melee basic attack after your movement. You can only take free actions after a lunge.

Oh no! Whatever will we do without the ten-foot bubble?

(My group allows 1-square charges, minus the usual bonus.)

 

[RLBURNSIDE]

1)

1) Racials such as dragonbreath need to have Expertise built-in, and also be compatible with melee classes (so that there's a holy symbol slot item that can be used to boost it like an implement). Not every dragonborn has a free hand to hold an expensive /rare Rod item just to be able to hit with their racial. Eladrin's teleport doesn't require you to swap items around each round, or invest heavily in cross-class implements to fix broken scaling.

2) Humans should be able to pick two stats, instead of the bonus feat and skill at 1st level, making them the ultimate versatile race. This way, one can actually play an Aragorn-type ranger who's as good with a bow as he is with a bastard sword. Currently it's impossible to make this character effectively, let alone if he wants to wear plate armor as well. I know that's suboptimal because your dex is wasted somewhat, but it's an iconic character that isn't compatible with 4e as it stands currently, using a 16 16 13...stat array. Also, if you have two weapon fighting style, you should be able to attack twice with a single weapon and get rid of the silly "paired weapon" enchantment requirement. This will allow Aragorn to attack twice with a bastard sword, as if he were using two of them. This has the side benefit of avoiding annoying item rarity issues to use your preferred weapon enchantment with both hands, and hoarding gold in the bank that you can't use because you can't buy the items you want, anyway.

3) There should be MORE ranged at-wills and encounters for classes such as paladin and so on. Non-strength classes often have a backup at-will which uses their main stat as a melee basic attack, so it's only fair that Str-users should be able to use some of their class features at range without resorting to basic attacks. If your class grants you proficiency in a weapon, such as javelins or spears, you should be able to run at least one at-will with it, rather than just basic attacks. In the same vein, there should be an option for Twin Strike to allow you to attack at range with a -2 / -2 penalty using a heavy thrown weapon using Str, or if you are an elf, to use Twin Strike in melee using Dex with -2 / -2 (and say, light blades). Currently, half-orcs make the best balanced rangers, and that's wrong IMO. Humans should be more versatile than anyone.

 

[Peraion Graufalke]

I like this, but I wouldn't call em feats - that's confusing. Perhaps call the entire group of rule elements Skill Focus?

Good point. I'd probably call them talents, proficiencies, or adventuring skills. Skill Focus is a bit confusing IMO because of the Skill Focus feat.

 

[Quickleaf]

Ditto to magic items, math, and feat fixes. I'll try breaking some new ground with my top 3 changes...

1. Each class has a beginner and an advanced 'mode' a player can choose from. The beginner mode is like the essentials martial classes, while the advanced mode builds upon that chassis, just increasesing the number of options available.

2. Skill challenges are overhauled to address narrative-mechanics divide, disincentive to take risks, and lack of strategy. Include a skill challenge creation process which takes into account different skill challenge structures or templates, interesting consequences for success/failure, and actions outside of skills.

3. Expanding existing rules in new directions, like hazard rules for monster "spawning" lairs, artifact rules for (dis)favor of NPCs/factions, disease rules for injuries, skill challenges adapted for mass combat, rituals as a basis for governing a keep/province, and so on.

 

[Blue]

Everyone says math fixes; it's covered, I'll leave that off.

#1 Clean up the cruft. When 4e first came out there was a rush to put out crunch. Much of that is explicitly obsolete, severely corner case, or just plain tired. And it lends to option paralysis.

You also get bigger delta between optimized and low-end characters. Not as much because the high end has growth (it has, but not so much) but because the low end can be so much lower.

#2 Expand improv actions (the famous DMG page 42) to explicitly talk about using powers in improv actions. Got a power that lets you shift 2 then make a 2[W] attack? Want to jump on a chandelier, swing across the room and attack? How to combine the two to make powers a starting point to describe actions, not the definitive description of what happens. (The recent article on terrain powers would be good examples for on-the-fly rulings for PCs/enemies using the terrain imaginatively.)

#3 (5e time) Take powers from themes/classes/races/feats to their next logical step. Forget class powers, have classes give features that give a unique feel and support their role. Powers are a wide selection of /flavorful/ and /distinct/ choices based on your character choices. So an [Elven][Primal][Striker][Forest guardian theme][Feywild Homeland theme] with a [Bow] has little power choice overlap with a [Dwarven][Divine][Leader][Ancestral channeller theme][Lost tribe homeland theme] with [Axes] and [Totems]. And even two [Human][Martial][Defenders] will have some overlap, one using [Polearms] and one using [Shield] and [Heavy Blade] will still have some different power options (or perhaps similar power options with different riders in some cases).

Seriously, it was a huge step from AD&D 2ed to 3.0 when they consolidated spells lists for the various classes. Before you had the same spell (often with slightly different effects) multiple times.

 

[NoWayJose]

2) Characters gain one non-combat feat every 5 levels. Non-combat feats are:
Skill Training, Skill Focus, Linguist (or one language with Int < 13), Skill Power, Ritual Caster, Expert Ritualist, Alchemy, Martial Practice, Deep Sage, Dungeon Experience, Fey-Minded, Herbalist, Holy Speech, Inner Compass, Jack of All Trades, Bard of All Trades, Long Jumper etc.

I like this, but I wouldn't call em feats - that's confusing. Perhaps call the entire group of rule elements Skill Focus?

I guess I could/should have mentioned Death To Ability Scores as a fix worth suggesting... covers a lot of ground, and I'm not even sure I would want to do it, but it does simplify things.

You know, I've been thinking about that just the other day...
But I figured it would never happen. The most sacred of all cows would probably not slaughtered on D&D. No matter how much you want to kill it and take its stuff. :/

How about moving Ability Scores into the Skill Focus list?

ie., Str bonus, Dex bonus, Con bonus, Int bonus, Wis bonus, Cha bonus, Skill Training, Skill Focus, Skill Power, Ritual Caster, Expert Ritualist, etc.

Then, to maintain balance, beef up the other foci and/or add prequisites and/or reduce the dependancy of other mechanics on the ability scores?

Just a thought...

 

[FreeTheSlaves]

1 - Grab 3E and update it to 4E, being particularly careful in the slaying of any sacred cows.
2 - Get people who love a specific class to play-test it. For example the original 4E Paladin was not tested vigorously enough by people who love the class.
3 - Have fully self contained core rules bound in 3 books.

With some hesitation I did not include artwork, I would have gone for a realistic medieval touched with fantasy look myself. But I'm certain I'm in an extreme minority.