Time to add new Armors to the table.

[Yaarel]

What if:

AC = 10 + Strength + Dexterity

A character with both +5 Strength and +5 Dexterity can with the appropriate armor attain 20 AC.

For example. A Chain armor that grants +3 AC, likewise has a +3 Strength prereq to wear it comfortably for long periods of time. A Chain armor that grants +5 AC, likewise has a +5 Strength prereq.

If a character is strong enough to wear the armor comfortably, they are also strong enough to apply their body agility effectively to dodge.

 

[Clint_L]

I don't think I'm explaining myself well. Looking at the OP, all I am saying is to get rid of the first column.

 

[Azzy]

Gambeson is padded armour, but scale armour and brigandine are both historical and distinct, if that's what you're referring to. It's things like studded leather and ring mail that are ahistorical.

I believe, from the description in the 1e DMG, that studded leather was supposed to represent brigandine.

 

[Fifth Element]

"Scale" includes any small metal pieces (platelets, strips, etcetera) that are secured together by chain links, rivets, cords, or sewn:

Brigandine (and the very similar jack of plate) are distinct enough from Eurasian style scale (which is how scale is described typically) for D&D purposes to be sure.

 

[Fifth Element]

I believe, from the description in the 1e DMG, that studded leather was supposed to represent brigandine.

It's often said to be based on a misunderstanding of bringandine, which does have "studs" on the outside - because they attach the metal plates on the inside.

 

[Yaarel]

Brigandine (and the very similar jack of plate) are distinct enough from Eurasian style scale (which is how scale is described typically) for D&D purposes to be sure.

There is no difference with regard to D&D mechanics.

The "fish scale armor" holds the platelets together with string. The "brigandine armor" holds the platelets together by riveting them between sheets of fabric. The jack of plate holds them together by sewing them.

The platelets are the part that is meaningful for AC. The fabrics and strings are the way to keep the platelets together.

 

[Azzy]

The armors can simplify.

I feel there are meaningful differences between the bladelengths of swords.
Up to 1 foot: dagger
1 to 2 feet: shortsword (gladius, seax, wakizashi, machete, etc)
2 to 3 feet: sword (viking, knightly, katana, etc)
3 to 4 feet: longsword (claymore, bastard, etc)
4 feet and up: greatsword (zweihaander, fantasy giant buster swords, etc)

Katana should be in the longsword category. Perhaps you're think of the wakisashi.

 

[Azzy]

It's often said to be based on a misunderstanding of bringandine, which does have "studs" on the outside - because they attach the metal plates on the inside.

Precisely.

 

[Fifth Element]

D&D Armor would be better it cloth armor was split in 2.

My point was that your table has padded and leather being identical mechanically. So adding gambeson, when that's just padded, makes little sense when you could just assign the gambeson mechanics to padded instead, for example. Rather than having two mechanically identical armours on the list.

 

[Fifth Element]

Katana should be in the longsword category. Perhaps you're think of the wakisashi.

Katana is fine where it is. Perhaps you're thinking of the tachi.

 

[Yaarel]

Katana should be in the longsword category. Perhaps you're think of the wakisashi.

The knightly sword and the katana are agile, even finesse. The katana is designed to be versatile, but the knightly is designed for one hand only. Something like:

Dagger 1d4, pierce, finesse, light, throw, simple
Shortsword 1d6 slash/pierce, finesse, light, simple
Sword 1d8 slash/pierce, finesse, versatile 1d10, martial
Longsword 1d10 (!) slash, versatile 1d12, martial
Greatsword 1d12 slash, twohanded, reach, martial

 

[Fifth Element]

The platelets are the part that is meaningful for AC. The fabrics and strings are the way to keep the platelets together.

The intent of OP is to create more gradation in armour types. Differentiating between scale and brigandine is one way of doing so.

 

[Yaarel]

The intent of OP is to create more gradation in armour types. Differentiating between scale and brigandine is one way of doing so.

My view is, bounded accuracy makes finer gradations for armor moot.

 

[aco175]

The OP talks about piecemail where you need a STR 15 and then describes it as half plate. I'm not understanding the difference. I would like to see a few more armors in the book. Would having a speed reduction if not proficient work instead of a STR requirement.

 

[Yaarel]

Where

AC = 10 + Strength + Dexterity

The armor grants an AC armor bonus that is equal to its Strength prereq.

If a character meets the prereq, then the character can "train" to be able to add the Dexterity on top of it. If the character fails to meet the prereq, the armor bonus applies, but the Dexterity bonus becomes void.

 

[tetrasodium]

What if:

AC = 10 + Strength + Dexterity

A character with both +5 Strength and +5 Dexterity can with the appropriate armor attain 20 AC.

For example. A Chain armor that grants +3 AC, likewise has a +3 Strength prereq to wear it comfortably for long periods of time. A Chain armor that grants +5 AC, likewise has a +5 Strength prereq.

If a character is strong enough to wear the armor comfortably, they are also strong enough to apply their body agility effectively to dodge.

You are very significantly missing the reasons why some armors need strength requirements. Dex is a more valuable attribute than strength & when a dex build can completely dump strength at no opportunity cost for the same or better ac as a strength build or non-dumped str dex build it widens the value gap between the two attributes. On top of that by having the same results for every type it just returns to a bunch of trash options with no subjective reasons for a player to ever consider.

My view is, bounded accuracy makes finer gradations for armor moot.

It makes them more important because the GM needs room to work within BA rather than the current state of 5e where GMs are forced out of BA's range by Players:"it's not better than $type+N, how much can we sell it for?">player:"I have YYY gold, can I find armor that's better than $type+N in this town?"

 

[Bill Zebub]

I kinda liked the thread that suggested three kinds of armor: light, medium, heavy. Fluff however you want.

 

[Yaarel]

You are very significantly missing the reasons why some armors need strength requirements.

The fiddly complication is unnecessary. It merits simplification.

The heavier the metal, or the bulkier the fabric, the higher the Strength prereq to wear it comfortably. It relates to encumbrance.

Dex is a more valuable attribute than strength & when a dex build can completely dump strength at no opportunity cost for the same or better ac as a strength build

If AC=Strength+Dexterity, then one cannot dump Dexterity. Likewise, one cannot dump Strength. To invest in both is a benefit.

To be clear. A character with +3 Strength and +5 Dexterity will be able to wear a Chain Tunic for +3 AC and add +5 Dexterity, totaling an AC 18.

 

[tetrasodium]

The fiddly complication is unnecessary. It merits simplification.

The heavier the metal, or the bulkier the fabric, the higher the Strength prereq to wear it comfortably. It relates to encumbrance.




If AC=Strength+Dexterity, then one cannot dump Dexterity. Likewise, one cannot dump Strength. To invest in both is a benefit.

Only the Monk dumps Strength for armor, substituting Wisdom instead. Similarly, the Berserker dumps Strength for armor, substituting Constitution instead.

To be clear. A character with +3 Strength and +5 Dexterity will be able to wear a Chain Tunic for +3 AC and add +5 Dexterity, totaling an AC 18.

except that shifts from subjective build choices with tradeoffs to one optimal option within pointbuy costs & even less room for the GM to use for treasure.

 

[Yaarel]

except that shifts from subjective build choices with tradeoffs to one optimal option within pointbuy costs & even less room for the GM to use for treasure.

The DM has many kinds of armor to offer for treasure.

• Chain shirt (prereq +3 Strength)
• Chain suit (helmet, longsleeves, with leggings or longcoat) (prereq +5 Strength)

• Heavy Wool Sweater (prereq +1 Strength)
• Reinforced Gambeson (prereq +2 Strength)

• Breastplate (prereq +4 Strength)
• Chain over Gambeson (prereq +4 Strength)

And so on.