Timing Question

[brunswick]

Hiya folks,

I run a D&D campaign for two different groups (they both play the same scenarios) and the same issue came up for both groups at the weekend.

The monster has a spell effect upon its person that, when damaged, deals damage in a Close Burst 1. The PC uses a power that deals damage but also pushes the monster back out of the range of the Close Burst 1. Since the 'spell effect' is an immediate reaction, I ruled that the PC dealt damage, then the spell effect dealt its damage and then the monster was pushed back.

Does that sound right?

Cheers,


Bruns.

 

[mellack]

I believe that is incorrect. An immediate reaction takes place after the triggering attack fully resolves. This would include the attacks push effect. So the critter should be pushed, then its burst can go off.

 

[S'mon]

I agree with mellack - if it says 'reaction' it's pretty clearly intended to occur after the attack fully resolves. If it says 'interrupt - when takes damage' then I'd run it the way you did.

 

[brunswick]

Great, thanks.

 

[wlmartin]

Hiya folks,

I run a D&D campaign for two different groups (they both play the same scenarios) and the same issue came up for both groups at the weekend.

The monster has a spell effect upon its person that, when damaged, deals damage in a Close Burst 1. The PC uses a power that deals damage but also pushes the monster back out of the range of the Close Burst 1. Since the 'spell effect' is an immediate reaction, I ruled that the PC dealt damage, then the spell effect dealt its damage and then the monster was pushed back.

Does that sound right?

Cheers,


Bruns.

To affect as an immediate action it must be an IMMEDIATE REACTION or an IMMEDIATE interrupt.

If it is a REACTION it happens after the triggering action resolves
(ie Do X when Target hits my nearby Ally... the X happens AFTER the hit not before it, so the damage kicks in before the effect happens)

If it is an INTERRUPT it happens before the triggering action resolves
(ie Do X when Target hits my nearby Ally... the X happens BEFORE the hit not after, so if the action forces a change in circumstances [moved out of threat range or monster destroyed] then it can disable the triggering action but otherwise after it resolves the original action carries on)

Typically Immediate Interupts will be placed on appropriate trigger types such as "Before it hits" or "When it targets" to prevent confusion

 

[DracoSuave]

The question is not clear enough to say anything one way or the other.

So, let's clear something up here BEFORE we talk about immediate anything or opportunity that or free whatever.

This effect could be anything. It depends ENTIRELY on what the effect says.

So, if it says 'Until foo, when the bar takes damage, the creature dealing the damage takes x damage.' then we have a situation where this is not an action and happens immediately upon the triggering damage's resolution. Effects that prevent actions don't matter here. It's not an immediate reaction OR interrupt. It's NOT any sort of action. It's just a triggered effect. There's no limit to how often it triggers unless it says so explicitly. So a ranger's twin strike will trigger it twice. It can even trigger on the monster's own turn.

On the other hand, if it says '...takes damage, deal x damage to the triggering creature as an immediate reaction' then yes, it would occur AFTER the action causing the damage is resolved. As well, only once per turn, as per the normal limit on immediate actions. If the creature has actions prohibited it, it cannot deal the damage. It cannot trigger on the monster's turn.

If the action is an immediate interrupt, it will occur before the action that triggered it. This will mean the damage CAN occur. It also means if that damage were to drop the triggering attacker, that would invalidate the attacker's action, thus rendering the original triggering attack non-existant.

If it's a free action, it will occur after the damage but whenever the monster pleases.

But this requires explanation, what exactly does the ability say? Answering questions about abilities we don't know the text to is unlikely to produce useful assistance.


Also, abilities don't say 'reaction' or 'interrupt.' They may say 'immediate reaction' or 'immediate interrupt' indicating the action type they consume to activate. Other actions, and triggered effects, do not use this nomenclature.