Tobruk, 1941 - Help!
- Thread starter Arrgh! Mark!
- Start date
Arrgh! Mark!
First Post
Lions? Bah! Give me Union any day.
As for new players: I'm willing to give it a shot, but I'd prefer to have a few beers at the pub telling bad D+D jokes first. Or some other friend-making venue.
talk to me at mh.baker@student.qut.edu.au
if you happen to be keen.
As for new players: I'm willing to give it a shot, but I'd prefer to have a few beers at the pub telling bad D+D jokes first. Or some other friend-making venue.
talk to me at mh.baker@student.qut.edu.au
if you happen to be keen.
Meadred
First Post
A great source for inspiration in this matter could be a book called "The Pirate of Tobruk". Unfortuantely, I'm at work so I cant give you the author's name or the publishing company right now, but I'll get back to you with that.
Anyway, in short the book is a biography of a quite remarkable man - an Aussie nonetheless. He learned to sail on the last great sail ships in the early 1900's, and through all sorts of adventures ended up in the Royal Australian Navy (or Naval Reserves, don't remember) during WWII. He served in the Mediterreanen, where he went through all sorts of stuff. He finally ended up commanding a captured Italian sailing vessel, which he used to bring supplies to Tobruk. He did quite a few trips, sometimes right under the nose of the Germans and Italians. He got shot so badly in the arm during an attempt to escape from the Axis that they had to amputate it, but he kept on serving. I can't come close to tell his story as well as the book does, so try to find it. Well, I hope you may glean something from it, and hey - this guy's a larger-than-life Aussie hero, so I thought you might like it!
Cheers,
Meadred
Edit: "The Pirate of Tobruk - A Sailor's Life On The Seven Seas, 1916-1948" by Alfred B. Palmer, published by Naval Institute Press, Maryland 1994.
Anyway, in short the book is a biography of a quite remarkable man - an Aussie nonetheless. He learned to sail on the last great sail ships in the early 1900's, and through all sorts of adventures ended up in the Royal Australian Navy (or Naval Reserves, don't remember) during WWII. He served in the Mediterreanen, where he went through all sorts of stuff. He finally ended up commanding a captured Italian sailing vessel, which he used to bring supplies to Tobruk. He did quite a few trips, sometimes right under the nose of the Germans and Italians. He got shot so badly in the arm during an attempt to escape from the Axis that they had to amputate it, but he kept on serving. I can't come close to tell his story as well as the book does, so try to find it. Well, I hope you may glean something from it, and hey - this guy's a larger-than-life Aussie hero, so I thought you might like it!
Cheers,
Meadred
Edit: "The Pirate of Tobruk - A Sailor's Life On The Seven Seas, 1916-1948" by Alfred B. Palmer, published by Naval Institute Press, Maryland 1994.
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Aaron2
Explorer
Arrgh! Mark! said:
Updates?
I've got a question about Australia (et. al). I'm working on an alternate history where England is forced out of the war by a semi-successful Sea Lion. I was wondering what you thought Australia (and India/South Africa) would do in such a circumstance. I'm not 100% sure of exactly what the status was between Britian and the various commonwealth countries in the 40's. Any opinions?
Aaron
Arrgh! Mark!
First Post
Update: First campaign finished, Tobruk is Saved... though not really by the players any more than the common man. Did a lot of scouting work, rescued some prisoners, had Staff Sergeant Robert Cornwall sending them to Certain Death a number of times..
lots of sand, bad chlorinated tea, their efforts really not amounting to all that much (I know, this may seem bad. But High Realism, folks. A single australian in WW2 bayoneted 2 whole trenches of Germans in flanders before they had him at gunpoint, where they surrendered. How much did it do to end the war? not a lot.) was all good. As a bit of fun for the last mission I had them all off helping the Pirate of Tobruk load up his ship with things from a small resistance-led town in greece.. only to find the nazi's had taken it over and the place was under lockdown. All good fun, especially when the crates they finally managed to get (After numerous whorehouse 'missions') opened up to rather illegal amounts of gold plates, paintings and other things stolen from greek temples around the place
.
It was good fun overall, but now I'm taking a break. Next up will be in late 42 or early 43 where the guys will be TOG commando's in PNG.
Aaron2: Interestingly, Australian sentiment had died a little. In the Great War it was going strong - 'home' was still britain, had to defend the motherland, cups of tea and all of that. After the depression and the subsequent failure to do anything much with the cream of the australian crop there began to form up little private armies with these blokes in them who had a lot of nationalist sentiment.
But still very strong. Education was all about Britain. Everything was all about it. Britain was our cultural ancestor, and there was little 'Australian' culture at all then (Compared to the very small amounts of it now.)
God, you make me remember my australian history lectures. *Shudders in boredom*
lots of sand, bad chlorinated tea, their efforts really not amounting to all that much (I know, this may seem bad. But High Realism, folks. A single australian in WW2 bayoneted 2 whole trenches of Germans in flanders before they had him at gunpoint, where they surrendered. How much did it do to end the war? not a lot.) was all good. As a bit of fun for the last mission I had them all off helping the Pirate of Tobruk load up his ship with things from a small resistance-led town in greece.. only to find the nazi's had taken it over and the place was under lockdown. All good fun, especially when the crates they finally managed to get (After numerous whorehouse 'missions') opened up to rather illegal amounts of gold plates, paintings and other things stolen from greek temples around the place
.It was good fun overall, but now I'm taking a break. Next up will be in late 42 or early 43 where the guys will be TOG commando's in PNG.
Aaron2: Interestingly, Australian sentiment had died a little. In the Great War it was going strong - 'home' was still britain, had to defend the motherland, cups of tea and all of that. After the depression and the subsequent failure to do anything much with the cream of the australian crop there began to form up little private armies with these blokes in them who had a lot of nationalist sentiment.
But still very strong. Education was all about Britain. Everything was all about it. Britain was our cultural ancestor, and there was little 'Australian' culture at all then (Compared to the very small amounts of it now.)
God, you make me remember my australian history lectures. *Shudders in boredom*
Arrgh! Mark!
First Post
Update: First campaign finished, Tobruk is Saved... though not really by the players any more than the common man. Did a lot of scouting work, rescued some prisoners, had Staff Sergeant Robert Cornwall sending them to Certain Death a number of times..
lots of sand, bad chlorinated tea, their efforts really not amounting to all that much (I know, this may seem bad. But High Realism, folks. A single australian in WW1 bayoneted 2 whole trenches of Germans in flanders before they had him at gunpoint, where they surrendered. How much did it do to end the war? not a lot.) was all good. As a bit of fun for the last mission I had them all off helping the Pirate of Tobruk load up his ship with things from a small resistance-led town in greece.. only to find the nazi's had taken it over and the place was under lockdown. All good fun, especially when the crates they finally managed to get (After numerous whorehouse 'missions') opened up to rather illegal amounts of gold plates, paintings and other things stolen from greek temples around the place.
It was good fun overall, but now I'm taking a break. Next up will be in late 42 or early 43 where the guys will be TOG commando's in PNG.
Aaron2:
IF Britain lost the BoB, I would have to ask how partially we are talking. All factories bombed into oblivion? Ships destroyed? Etc?
What would Australia do, hey. Well - first priority is protection of allies. The Desert conflict would have to be left to rot, which would mean full Italian control in the area unless the Italians manage to stuff up even that. Australia would attempt to help Britain, but how exactly would be a question of how destroyed it was. Remember that the Yellow Peril will soon start to happen, leaving half Australias troops halfway across the globe. What would the british troops in Singapore and so on do? Ship out to britain, leaving the way to australia paved with gold. I'd say America would join the war much earlier, Unless my reading of Hitler is true and he merely smashes the military might of Britain, leaving his push for Russia a lot more troops. America joining the war early would still have it's problems - time to reach and so on. Lightning attacks with greater numbers and fuel would probably be able to get to Moscow and take Stalingrad.
Hmmmmm...
But I think I got off the topic. Have fun with your game
India/South Africa - also a fair bit of british sentiment, but to be honest I don't know enough to make a judgement.
*Edit. I doubt any australian could have bayonetted any germans in trenches in WW2.*
lots of sand, bad chlorinated tea, their efforts really not amounting to all that much (I know, this may seem bad. But High Realism, folks. A single australian in WW1 bayoneted 2 whole trenches of Germans in flanders before they had him at gunpoint, where they surrendered. How much did it do to end the war? not a lot.) was all good. As a bit of fun for the last mission I had them all off helping the Pirate of Tobruk load up his ship with things from a small resistance-led town in greece.. only to find the nazi's had taken it over and the place was under lockdown. All good fun, especially when the crates they finally managed to get (After numerous whorehouse 'missions') opened up to rather illegal amounts of gold plates, paintings and other things stolen from greek temples around the place
.It was good fun overall, but now I'm taking a break. Next up will be in late 42 or early 43 where the guys will be TOG commando's in PNG.
Aaron2:
IF Britain lost the BoB, I would have to ask how partially we are talking. All factories bombed into oblivion? Ships destroyed? Etc?
What would Australia do, hey. Well - first priority is protection of allies. The Desert conflict would have to be left to rot, which would mean full Italian control in the area unless the Italians manage to stuff up even that. Australia would attempt to help Britain, but how exactly would be a question of how destroyed it was. Remember that the Yellow Peril will soon start to happen, leaving half Australias troops halfway across the globe. What would the british troops in Singapore and so on do? Ship out to britain, leaving the way to australia paved with gold. I'd say America would join the war much earlier, Unless my reading of Hitler is true and he merely smashes the military might of Britain, leaving his push for Russia a lot more troops. America joining the war early would still have it's problems - time to reach and so on. Lightning attacks with greater numbers and fuel would probably be able to get to Moscow and take Stalingrad.
Hmmmmm...
But I think I got off the topic. Have fun with your game
India/South Africa - also a fair bit of british sentiment, but to be honest I don't know enough to make a judgement.
*Edit. I doubt any australian could have bayonetted any germans in trenches in WW2.*
Last edited:
ledded
Herder of monkies
I've followed this thread for a while and this game sounded like a ton of fun. I run an occasional WW2-supers game that I never knew would be as much fun as it has turned out to be.
Want to share any details about the upcoming commando work in PNG? Just curious to see what kind of general scenarios you've come up with.
Also, just as a question, but how much research do you put into the setting you have for this game? It sounds like you've really done your work, but I wanted to get your thoughts.
Want to share any details about the upcoming commando work in PNG? Just curious to see what kind of general scenarios you've come up with.
Also, just as a question, but how much research do you put into the setting you have for this game? It sounds like you've really done your work, but I wanted to get your thoughts.
Aaron2
Explorer
Arrgh! Mark! said:
In my Alt Hist, German launches a semi-successful Sea Lion and, although the Brits would have beaten them back eventually, the Parliment panics, boots Churchill and makes Lord Halifax PM. He proceeds to negotiate a peace between England and Germany. So England is out of the war but relatively intact. Much of the RAF and RN was lost in the battle over the straits. As a guarantee of peace, the Germans "lease" a large area of land near Hastings to base the 3rd panzer. The war in North Africa doesn't really happen. Hitler refuse to offer his support and the Italians are afraid to fight the British by themselves. Large number of british soldiers emmigrate to South Africa or Canada to stay in the fight.
I'm not sure what to do about Japan.
Option A: With a safe backyard and Rommel leading the 1rst Panzer Army into Russian, Germany does a little better in Barbarrossa. Plus, Russia is without Zukov who died at Nomanhan (which almost happened IRL). Japan decides to attack Russia from behind and leaves SE Asia alone. The pacific war become more of a cold war with America supporting the Chinese to a much greater extent.
Option B: Without the successful carrier attack on the Italian fleet at Taranto as an example, Yamamoto is not convinced a aircraft-only attack on Pearl Harbor will be effective. Thus the Japanese instead use a large fleet of carrier and battleships to pound Pearl for hours. The US carriers who avoided the initial strike rush back to fight the IJN and are destroyed in the worlds first carrier v. carrier duel. The pacific fleet is no more and the US begins its island hopping campaign starting with the islands of Hawaii.
Aaron
Arrgh! Mark!
First Post
Ledded: As much as I'm comfortable with - as an avid history buff regardless, I do like to do a bit of reading. To be honest, choosing Tobruk ended up quite difficult - theres bugger all books in my area on the topic and internet searching gives you that feeling of unsatisfied boredom. Eventually I lucked out and managed to find two personal histories of soldiers from the 9th division both with maps and one with dates of german attacks.
I can't tell you how useful that one was
Aaron2: While it is an alt history, don't forget Nanshin or Nanyo - the japanese version of Lebensraum. These philosophical ideas always pressed southwards - possibly the reason why the Japanese never did attack Russia. Asia, historically, is what the Japanese want control of - China, all of those nifty south islands filled with phosphate (Angaur and..er, the other one.)
Also, remember that the Japs got shafted after the great war, or at least thought they got shafted. The beginnings of racial japanese superiority came after the russo-japanese war, but when the apparent treaties were ignored by the paternal british the japanese started to get iffy.
Remember though, if Russia is attacked Pearl Harbour is not attacked. Fighting commies is a *good thing. Hitler was liked because he was apparently the end to communism.
I can't tell you how useful that one was
Aaron2: While it is an alt history, don't forget Nanshin or Nanyo - the japanese version of Lebensraum. These philosophical ideas always pressed southwards - possibly the reason why the Japanese never did attack Russia. Asia, historically, is what the Japanese want control of - China, all of those nifty south islands filled with phosphate (Angaur and..er, the other one.)
Also, remember that the Japs got shafted after the great war, or at least thought they got shafted. The beginnings of racial japanese superiority came after the russo-japanese war, but when the apparent treaties were ignored by the paternal british the japanese started to get iffy.
Remember though, if Russia is attacked Pearl Harbour is not attacked. Fighting commies is a *good thing. Hitler was liked because he was apparently the end to communism.
ledded
Herder of monkies
I understand. One of the reasons I chose the ETO for my game was the proliferation of good references for that arena.Arrgh! Mark! said:
Sweet. References like those are priceless. I also benefited more out of personal histories than dry tactics/events lectures, particularly by those who are good at weaving the tales of others into a good book (Ambrose) and by actual first-hand accounts (On to Berlin, by James Gavin, was a personal fave among others).Arrgh! Mark! said:Eventually I lucked out and managed to find two personal histories of soldiers from the 9th division both with maps and one with dates of german attacks.
I can't tell you how useful that one was
And don't forget that there was a small provision that the Japanese requested be made to the Treaty of Versailles to endorse the principle of the equality of all races, which was flatly scratched by the US and Britain, and is thought by many to have been that slap in the face that further pushed feelings of racial japanese superiority. Plus, there were several factions with power in Japanese government that saw the US as a direct threat; an imperialist nation creeping ever closer to Japan's imperial ambitions while using treaty to limit Japan's expansion (while similarly expanding nearly unabated into areas that Japan coveted). Of course, that last part I'm not stating as 'truth', but as a definite impression represented by several in power in the years preceding WWII, whether out of actual belief or as fuel for imperialism expansionism.Arrgh! Mark! said:
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