Originally posted by Magocrat:
Tome of Battle Q&A
People frequently come to this forum with questions regarding the Tome of Battle. This is similar to psionics. However, the Psionics board has a FAQ thread, maintained by Tempest Stormwind. People can often find the answers to their questions in that thread. Because of the popularity of the Tome of Battle, I would like to maintain a FAQ thread regarding questions about the Tome of Battle. However, those frequently asked questions haven't been recorded yet. Therefore, I would like everyone to ask their questions about the Tome of Battle, so that it can be documented in one, handy thread. Even if you already know the answer to a tricky topic, you could do everyone a favor by providing the question and the answer.
Please note that, beside the categorization and subcategorization in the Martial Adept Questions and Martial Maneuver and Stance Questions, the questions aren't sorted, so you may have to look closely for the answer to your question. Of course, if it hasn't been answered yet, you can always ask us or Customer Service. Usually, I will try to answer questions that arise because of vagueness in the rules as soon as I can (unless another helpful patron will answer it for you), but questions that can't be answered by studying the Tome of Battle at all will usually have to be answered by Customer Service. If necessary, I will do that.
On a somewhat unrelated note, this is the second thread for the Tome of Battle Q&A, because the first was becoming rather murky because everything was in a single post. Now, I've ordered everything into several posts, each with its own link, so that people can browse them with less brain ache. If you happen to have the old Q&A linked, please change the link to this thread, because this Q&A is here to stay.
Links
CUSTOMER SERVICE
If you have a question that hasn't been answered here, you can ask Customer Service. These people can ask the writers of the Tome of Battle (Richard Baker, Matt Sernett, and Frank Brunner) or provide questions on their own. This means that, in most cases, Customer Service will provide you with the correct answer to whatever questions you may have. If you ask Customer Service a question regarding the Tome of Battle, please provide the question and answer here, so that we can document it. (Please keep in mind that you must register separately to Customer Service in order to ask questions.)
MARTIAL COMPENDIUM
If you're looking for something homebrewn regarding the Tome of Battle, chances are you'll find it here. This thread is kept up-to-date by me, with the help of attentive patrons of the Wizards Community. This is also the ideal thread to let your Tome of Battle material get the attention that it deserves to become as qualitative as it can be.
TOME OF BATTLE CUSTOMER SERVICE Q&A
This thread documents the answers given by Customer Service, and is as close to an official FAQ as we currently have. If a question isn't answered here, you'll probably find an answer in this thread. However, I don't know whether the thread is still maintained, given the last date of maintenance. The questions that are answered in the Tome of Battle Customer Service Q&A thread have been copied into this Q&A.
Linked Table of Contents
Originally posted by Magocrat:
General Tome of Battle Questions
Q: Dear Sage
Can a martial adept (Tome of Battle) initiate a maneuver or change a stance while grappling? While pinned?
--Alan
A: The grapple rules provide a list of actions available to a grappling character, but it’s obviously not an exhaustive list. (It doesn’t, for example, mention “speaking” as an option.) It’s really intended more as a description of how grappling alters many normal actions available to characters (such as attacking and moving). Thus, the DM must apply a bit of his own common sense when adjudicating any grapple situation.
Any maneuver that involves an attack may be used while grappling, as long as it’s made with an unarmed strike, natural weapon, or light weapon against another character you are grappling (PHB p156).
It’s easiest to rule that other maneuvers and stances can be initiated normally while grappling unless something intrinsic to the maneuver indicates otherwise. (For example, a maneuver that requires movement can’t normally be initiated while in a grapple because the grappling character can’t move freely.) Many maneuvers and stances are designed for use by grappling characters, and it seems counterintuitive to restrict those options. A grappling character is somewhat limited in his physical mobility, but to prevent him from initiating a maneuver or stance seems unreasonably limiting.
The Sage strongly recommends that a pinned character not be allowed to initiate a maneuver or stance. The rules clearly state that “to initiate a maneuver or stance, you must be able to move” (ToB p38), which suggests that a pinned character shouldn’t be able to accomplish this.
Q: When it comes to initiator levels, do you round down or up when you have half initiator levels, such as when you multiclass into other classes?
A: You round down, to a minumum of initiator level 1st.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Adept Questions
General Questions
Q: How do you calculate initiator level if you have multiple martial adept classes (from Tome of Battle) and/or prestige classes?
A: Calculating initiator level for multiclass characters or characters with prestige classes can be a little tricky. Basically, you calculate the initiator level of each martial adept class separately. Your initiator level for a specific martial adept class is your level in that class + 1/2 your levels in all other classes. A 10th-level swordsage/5th-level warblade would have an initiator level of 12th for all swordsage maneuvers and for determining the maximum maneuver level that this character could learn as a swordsage. The same character would have an initiator level of 10th for determining the same effects of his warblade levels.
Prestige classes are generally treated just like multiclassing, adding 1/2 the level unless the prestige class specifically states otherwise, as do most of the prestige classes found in Tome of Battle.
Q: If you are a multiclass martial adept (from Tome of Battle), a swordsage/warblade for example, do you have to keep your maneuvers known and maneuvers readied separate for each class?
A: If a character has multiple martial adept base classes, the maneuvers known and readied from each class are kept separate. Knowing a maneuver for one class does not mean you can ready it for the other, or vice versa.
Q: If you have levels in two different martial adept classes (from Tome of Battle), such as swordsage and warblade for example, can you use maneuvers that you have for one class to meet the prereqs for a maneuver in your other class?
A: If a maneuver has a prerequisite that requires you to have a certain number of maneuvers from a certain martial discipline, then it only matters if you have that many maneuvers of that discipline. It does not matter if the maneuvers all belong to the same class.
For example, a swordsage 3/warblade 2 has a single Diamond Mind maneuver from the swordsage class. When this character takes a 3rd level of warblade, they gain another maneuver known and can choose Emerald Razor, using the Diamond Mind maneuver known from the Swordsage levels to qualify.
Q: The maneuvers known description of the crusader, swordsage, and warblade (in the Tome of Battle) state that you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you already know. However, these descriptions are unclear about whether you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you learned through another class. Can you swap maneuvers gained through different classes?
To clarify this with an example, can a crusader 4/warblade 3 who has taken an additional level in the warblade class and learned a maneuver as a result 'forget' a maneuver that he learned through his crusader levels and learn a warblade maneuver in place of that maneuver?
A: Yes, these abilities do not care what the origin of the replaced maneuver is.
Q: Can my warblade delay acquiring his stance so that he can gain a 2nd-level stance at a later level?
A: No, because you can't delay acquiring class features.
Crusader Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
If a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) has damage reduction, does that apply before or after damage goes into my steely resolve damage pool?
--Fetch
A: Apply damage reduction or any other effect that would reduce the incoming damage before it goes into the damage pool.
If your DR reduces the incoming damage to 0, no damage goes into your damage pool.
Q: Dear Sage,
If my crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) receives more healing from an effect that he needs to return to maximum hit points, do I have to apply the remainder to my damage pool?
--Antheric
A: No.
You can split the amount of incoming healing between your hit points and damage pool however you wish. You can even apply more healing than you actually need to either category.
For example, imagine if you had 26 points of damage and 10 points in your damage pool, and the cleric cast cure critical wounds to restore 28 hit points. Since reducing your damage pool by even a point would lessen your furious counterstrike bonus, you could apply all 28 points of healing to your hit points, even though 2 points of that healing is wasted.
Q: Dear Sage,
Could a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) choose to learn or ready fewer maneuvers than he or she would be entitled to?
--Joe & Sam
A: No.
You must learn and ready the full number of maneuvers entitled to you by your level.
Otherwise, you’d be able to cycle through your favorites faster, which defeats the purpose of the crusader’s unique recharge mechanic.
Q: Dear Sage,
Can a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) delay learning a new stance to a later level? If not, how can he ever learn an 8th- or 9th-level stance, since his last stance is gained at only 14th level?
--Horst
A: As a general rule, you can’t ever delay gaining any feature that comes from reaching a new level, whether that’s a feat, skill points, class feature, or anything else.
The crusader’s stances are no different; at 14th level, the crusader must select a new stance of 7th level or less.
However, at 15th level the crusader could select the Martial Stance feat (p.31) in order to choose an 8th-level stance. At 18th level, he could use that feat to choose a 9th-level stance.
Q: Dear Sage,
When a crusader's maneuver recovery mechanic (Tome of Battle, p.9) activates, what happens to any maneuvers he still had ready and granted?
--Dan
A: If at the end of the crusader’s turn he cannot be granted a maneuver because he has no withheld maneuvers remaining, the process starts over from scratch. All maneuvers (whether expended or not) once again become withheld, and two of those maneuvers are randomly granted.
Q: Dear Sage,
As part of his discipline focus class feature, the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) gains the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat for a set of weapons. Does he also gain proficiency in the listed weapons?
--Daniel
A: According to a strict reading of the rules, no. A swordsage who wants to avoid the non-proficiency penalty for such weapons must gain proficiency in those weapons normally.
Q: Dear Sage
If a crusader (Tome of Battle) of a good-aligned deity were to "fall" and become a blackguard, would he gain blackguard powers in a manner analogous to a fallen paladin who becomes a blackguard?
--Mark
A: That falls squarely into the domain of "house rules."
It certainly seems like a cool variant of that aspect of the blackguard, but you would need to work with your DM to come up with appropriate changes to the list of special blackguard features to make them match the crusader class.
Swordsage Questions
Q: When a swordsage (from Tome of Battle) takes a level in the master of nine prestige class, they can now learn a maneuver from any discipline. If the same character later gains a new maneuver by taking a level of swordsage, can it be of any discipline, or can it only be from the normal swordsage disciplines?
A: When a character gains a new maneuver from taking a level in the master of nine prestige class, that character can choose a maneuver from any discipline. If that same character later takes a level in swordsage or any other martial adept class, the character could only choose a maneuver belonging to a discipline available to that class.
Q: The swordsage’s Discipline Focus (from Tome of Battle, pg. 16) states that you gain the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat for a specific group of weapons. Does this mean you count as having Weapon Focus for any feat or prestige class that has it as a prerequisite?
A: Discipline Focus gives you the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat, and would allow a character to qualify for a feat or prestige class as if he/she had Weapon Focus.
Q: How often can you use the swordsage’s Sense Magic ability (from Tome of Battle, pg. 16) on a particular weapon or armor?
A: A swordsage may only use Sense Magic on a particular armor or weapon once. You can think of this as similar to using a Spellcraft check to identify a spell that’s already in place, or to identify a potion. You can try again when you gain your next level.
Q: Does the AC bonus of the swordsage (from Tome of Battle) stack with the AC bonus of the monk, even though they are both based on Wisdom modifier?
A: No. The swordsage’s AC bonus, allowing the swordsage to apply her Wisdom bonus to her armor class, mimics the ability of the monk’s AC bonus. Since these abilities share the same name and have the same effect, they will not stack.
Q: Dear Sage,
Does the discipline focus class feature of the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) apply just to maneuvers gained from that class?
--Ann Marie
A: No.
The benefits of this class feature apply to all maneuvers of the chosen discipline, regardless of how you acquired the maneuver.
Q: Dear Sage,
Can the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) apply the insightful strike benefit of his discipline focus class feature to the same discipline twice?
--Ben
A: No.
When you gain this benefit a second time at 12th level, you must apply this to a second, different discipline.
Q: Dear Sage,
How often can a swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) use his Sense Magic class feature on a particular weapon or armor?
--Sammy
A: A swordsage may only use Sense Magic on a particular armor or weapon once.
You can think of this as similar to using a Spellcraft check to identify a spell that’s already in place, or to identify a potion.
At the DM’s discretion, you can try again after you gain a new level.
Q: If you have one level in Swordsage (which grants you Weapon Focus in the weapons associated with one discipline) and take a level of Warblade (which grants you the Weapon Aptitude ability), can you use the latter to switch your Weapon Focus to other weapons outside of the former's weapon group?
A: No. The warblade ability allows you to change “any feat you have that applies only to a single weapon.” The swordsage ability applies to several weapons.
Q: The Swordsage's chart (ToB p.16) lists skills as "6 + Int modifier per level, x6 at first level". Should that be "x4 at first level", instead?
A: Correct!
Q: Alright, so the Swordsage's AC Bonus ability states "Starting at 2nd level, you can add you Wisdom modifier as a bonus to Armor Class, so long as you wear light armor, are encumbered, and do not use a shield."
Does this mean that you can't use this ability when you are unarmored, ONLY in light armor? By RAW it does but... is it a mistake for errata, should I inform my DM that it works with no armor as well?
A: The intent is that you get this benefit whether you are wearing light armor or are unarmored. I will pass this issue along to the appropriate departments for potential errata treatment. Of course your DM is allowed to rule however he/she wishes. Thank you for bringing this to our attention!
Q: Do you add any bonus to the swordsage's sense magic class feature?
A: Yes, you add your swordsage level to the level check, as usual.
Warblade Questions
Q: The warblade’s Weapon Aptitude ability (from Tome of Battle, pg. 22) states that any feat you have that applies to a single weapon can be applied to any other weapon as long as you spend the 1 hour practicing. Does this mean if you have Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), you can change it to Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain) as long as you spend the required time in weapon practice?
A: Weapon Aptitude works on any feat focus on a single weapon, such as Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. Exotic Weapon Proficiency is one of those feats that works for a single weapon, so a warblade would be able to use the Weapon Aptitude ability to switch which weapon Exotic Weapon Proficiency applies to.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Skills and Feats Questions
Q: If you take the Adaptive Style feat (Tome of Battle, pg. 28), can you pick new maneuvers and/or ready all maneuvers by spending a full-round action in the middle of combat?
A: Yes, you can use Adaptive Style to pick new maneuvers in the middle of combat. Since you are picking new maneuvers, they would all be readied. This is a clear advantage for a class such as the swordsage, who normally has to spend a full round action to recover a single maneuver, and would be a great feat to pick up.
Q: Let's say you're a level 12 character getting ready to take the Superior Unarmed Strike feat (ToB). If you take Superior Unarmed Strike, does having a single monk level amongst those 12 character levels force Superior Unarmed Strike to give you the UA attack dice of a monk 5, or do you still get the UA attack dice in the provided table according to character level?
A: You're forced to use the unarmed attack dice of a 5th-level monk.
Q: Would you be able to stack the monk bonus and the swordsage bonus if you altered one or the other via a feat, such as Kung-Fu Genius or Ascetic Mage?
A: Ascetic Mage only allows you to add your Charisma bonus to AC where you would normally be allowed to apply your Wisdom bonus, and does not discriminate between the source of the bonus. Kung-Fu Genius, however, does apply, because it specifically states that it affects your monk class features, thereby not applying to your swordsage AC bonus.
Q: Dear Sage
Can a monk use the Snap Kick feat (Tome of Battle p32) as part of a flurry of blows?
--Alexander
A: Yes. Apply both penalties to all attack rolls made during the flurry of blows.
Q: The Adaptive Style feat in Tome of Battle allows you to change your readied maneuvers as a full round action rather than spending five minutes to do so. Does this...
A) Allow a martial adept to regain and change all of their maneuvers with a single full round action
or
B) Allow them to change the maneuver that is readied in their unexpended "slots".
A: Adaptive Style will actually let you perform option A) from your list. So as a full round action, you can choose a new set of readied maneuvers, and in doing so, reset all of your maneuvers. I hope that clears things up. Have fun and good gaming!
A: Yes, it refreshes all the maneuvers of all your classes. Evasive Reflexes [feat] - limits on 5' steps taken
Q: The Tome of Battle includes a feat named "Evasive Reflexes". This feat is raising a lot of questions on the message boards. Here are the main questions that I hope you can shed some light on:
1. If I have both Evasive Reflexes and Combat Reflexes, and I am normally entitled to four attacks of opportunity per round, what is the maximum number of 5-foot-steps per round that I can make using Evasive Reflexes?
2. Do the 5-foot-step(s) that I make using Evasive Reflexes count against the total number of attacks of opportunity that I can make in a single round?
Thanks in advance.
A:1) 4. You can take a five foot step each time an enemy provokes.
2) Yes they do! Essentially you are replacing the attack with the move, but it still uses up an attack of opportunity!
Q: When the Snap Kick feat mentions "When you make a melee attack with one or more melee weapons" is unarmed strike considered a "melee weapon" for the purposes of activating snap kick?
A: Yes indeed, unarmed strike would count.
Q: When using the Stormguard Warrior combat rhythm ability, is it possible to score critical hits with the touch attacks (still dealing no damage however) ? This comes into play when using the Tiger Claw blood in the water stance which adds to your to hit and damage when you score a critical.
A: Yes, it sure is.
Q: Dear Sage
If a character uses the Adaptive Style feat (Tome of Battle p28) after he has expended some of his readied maneuvers, does he choose new readied maneuvers equal to the maximum number he can ready, or equal to the number he hasn’t yet expended?
--Matt
A: Using the Adaptive Style feat completely resets the character’s readied maneuvers, making them all available for use.
If you’re a crusader, you also reset your granted maneuvers.
Q: The Clarion Commander tactical feat requires you make a DC 20 intimidate and then make an attack on the next turn. The result is flanking for all allies for one minute, does this allow a character with a ranged weapon to flank?
A: It just simply states the enemy counts as flanked for you and your allies, so while you normally wouldn't be able to flank with a bow, it looks like you can with this feat!
Q: The benefit of the Shadow Blade feat as listed on Table 2-1: New Feats (TOB 30) wildly differs from the benefit as listed in the feat entry. Which is correct?
A: In this case, text trumps tables; the Shadow Blade entry is correct. (However, the benefit as listed on the table could be a good feat on its own.)
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Maneuvers and Stances Questions
General Maneuver Questions
Q: Can you know the same maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) more than once? Can you ready the same maneuver more than once at a time?
A: Actually no, you cannot learn the same maneuvers more than once, nor can you ready the same maneuver more than once at a time.
Q: Can a barbarian use maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) while raging? What about Diamond Mind maneuvers that require a Concentration check to use? What about to recover maneuvers in the middle of combat?
A: According to the text under the Concentration heading on page 39 of Tome of Battle, the text states “unlike with spells or psionic powers, you need not concentrate to initiate a maneuver or stance.” Because initiating a maneuver does not require concentration, you would be able to perform most maneuvers while in a barbarian’s Rage, or in any other condition which mimics the restrictions or raging. While raging, a character would not be able to use any Diamond Mind maneuver that requires a concentration check. Using a special action to recover an expended maneuver would fall into the category of “any abilities that require patience or concentration,” so a character would not be able to recover maneuvers in this way while raging.
Q: When you gain a new maneuver (from Tome of Battle), can you choose to learn a new stance as it counts as a maneuver for some purposes?
A: No, you can only learn stances when your class table states that you gain a new stance known. (You can also gain new stances by taking the Martial Stance feat, or taking levels in a prestige class that gives you a new stance.) You can’t use new Maneuver Known choices to pick stances.
Q: When you gain a new maneuver (from Tome of Battle) known from a prestige class, does it get grouped with maneuvers known from your base martial adept class, or are they kept separate? What happens if you have the base martial adept classes and you take a prestige class gives you more maneuvers known?
A: This is actually covered in the rules, though with all the crunchy bits in the book it’s easy to miss! When you gain additional maneuvers known from a prestige class, you choose one of the martial adept classes that you have and add it to the maneuvers known of that class. When a prestige class gives you the ability to ready one or more maneuver, you treat this in a similar fashion, choosing one of your base classes that already has a martial maneuver progression and add the additional readied maneuver slot to that class. You make these choices each time you take a level in a prestige class that grants new maneuvers known or maneuvers readied, so you’re not locked into advancing a specific base class when you take your first level in these prestige classes. You can find more information concerning this on page 96 of Tome of Battle.
Q: There are a couple maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) that state they have a save, but no save DC is listed: i.e., Inferno Blast (pg. 55). What should the save DCs be?
A: In general, the save DC for a maneuver is 10 + the maneuver level + your key ability score modifier (which depends on the discipline).
Q: Dear Sage,
Can I use enter a stance or use a boost in the middle of taking another action? For instance, can I charge up to a foe, enter a stance (Tome of Battle p43), and then make the attack granted by the charge? Or can I activate a boost such as burning blade (ToB p52) after I’ve made the attack roll?
--Taylor & Mike
A: No.
As a general rule, you can’t interrupt one of your actions with another action. The Player’s Handbook provides various exceptions (drawing a weapon while moving, the Shot on the Run feat, and so on). However, you can take a swift action any time you would normally be allowed to take a free action, and you can perform a free action in conjunction with actions of other types.
You could enter the stance before beginning the charge, or after resolving the attack(s) granted by the charge, or in between. Alternatively, you could just move up to the foe, then enter the stance, and then make the attack, but this wouldn’t be a charge.
You must activate a boost before you begin an attack if you want to apply it to that attack. Once you’ve rolled, you can’t activate the boost.
Q: Dear Sage,
If a martial maneuver states that it allows a save but doesn’t list the save DC, how do I calculate it?
--Sammy
A: If a maneuver doesn’t list a DC, it is equal to 10 + the maneuver’s level + an ability score modifier based on the discipline:
Q: Can you switch maneuvers that you know for ones that you don't know?
A: Yes. The crusader, swordsage, and warblade can trade one maneuver known for another at certain levels (see their respective descriptions in the Tome of Battle). (Prestige classes that grant maneuvers can't trade maneuvers known.) However, you may only trade one maneuver known for another at a time.
Q: If you are in a stance and initiate a maneuver that both add additional damage die, such us punishing stance and mountain hammer, does the additional damage stack?
A: Yes, because page 40 of the Tome of Battle says that bonuses do not stack, and additional damage die aren't considered bonuses.
Q: Can a Swordsage or a Warblade ready more than one "copy" of the same maneuver so that he can use the maneuver more than once per encounter without having to spend actions to regain his maneuver(s)?
A: Unfortunately not. Readying a maneuver isn't like preparing a spell. You are either Ready to use the maneuver or you aren't! You can't "Double Ready" a Maneuver! You can only use a given maneuver once per encounter unless you Recover it during the fight!
Q: Another multiclass question. Can a multiclassed martial adept (eg. Swordsage/Warblade) choose/and or ready the same maneuver for each of it's classes (provided you have access to the same maneuver)? And if you gain a maneuver in one class, can you use it as a prerequisite in gaining a maneuver in the other class?
A: No, you can only ever learn/ready a maneuver once. If you gain a maneuver in one class it can indeed fulfill prerequisites in another class!
Q: The "preferred weapons" of each discipline seem to serve very little function, except for a couple of feats and the Discipline Focus feature. Can you perform any maneuver with any weapon? Similarly, for "key skills," it seems like most maneuvers can be performed perfectly well without the relevant skill. Are these correct?
A: Your assumptions are correct. The preferred weapons are just that, preferred, and there are some feats and other abilities that you can build around such weapons, but they are not required for using maneuvers from that discipline. The key skills are the same way. While there are some maneuvers that use the key skill to determine their effects, this is not always the case. There are plenty of maneuvers that you do not need the key skill for at all.
Q: Alot of feats and maneuvers in this book refer to weapons, as in the case of snap-kick (which refers to a melee attack with one or two melee weapons) and maneuvers, as in the Tiger Claw's 1st level maneuver wolf fang strike. My confusion arises from the fact that unarmed strike is referred to as a favored weapon in the description of some of the schools of combat (Setting sun, tiger claw, shadow Hand). Does that mean that unarmed strike counts as a weapon when the word weapon is used in the description of a maneuver? Does it make a difference if the character has the improved unarmed strike feat? I'd just like to clear up this confusion.
A: Yes your unarmed strike counts as a weapon when the word weapon is used in the description of the maneuver. Yes it makes a difference if you have improved unarmed strike feat, as you will provoke if you do not.
Q: Just because it isn't really clear in the book: a maneuver that misses is still expended, correct? You can't "hold the charge" like with a touch spell?
A: You are correct. A maneuver that misses is still expended, unless of course that particular maneuver states otherwise (currently I don't believe any maneuvers state otherwise, but if more maneuvers are created in the future, it is possible they could have additional rules text that could specify such a thing).
Q: And finally, let's say someone is a multiclass swordsage/warblade. Can a maneuver from Diamond Mind picked from their swordsage maneuvers forfill the prerequisites for a maneuver from Diamond Mind picked by their warblade maneuvers? From what I seen, this looks like how it works, but I figured I'd ask just to be sure.
A: Yes Maneuvers taken from one Adept class can fulfill prerequisites for maneuvers taken in another Adept Class. If you have a diamond mind maneuver as a sword sage maneuver, and you gain a maneuver as a warblade, you could Choose Emerald Razor as your Sword Sage Diamond Mind maneuver would fulfill the Pre-requisite.
Q: I have a PC who is a 16th-level Fighter, and I have recently accrued enough experience points to advance to 17th-level. I would like to take a level in the new Warblade class from Tome of Battle. This entitles me to 3 maneuvers known, and 1 stance known. Because my initiator level is 9, the maximum level of the maneuvers/stances that I can learn is 5th. My question pertains to fulfilling the pre-requisites for different maneuvers and stances. Assuming that I stick to a single discipline when I select my 3 maneuvers known and 1 stance known, Would it be legal for me to acquire one maneuver that has no pre-requisites, a second maneuver that has one maneuver as a pre-requisite, a third maneuver that has two maneuvers as a pre-requisite, and a stance that has three maneuvers as a pre-requisite? In other words, can I use maneuvers/stances as pre-requisites for other maneuvers/stances, even though I am acquiring them all at the same time?
A: Yes, you can certainly do this.
Q: All of the new base classes from Tome of Battle offer the option of swapping out an old maneuver to gain a new maneuver at certain levels.
What happens if, as a result of swapping out an old maneuver, I can no longer meet the pre-requisites for another stance or maneuver that I currently know? Suppose, for instance, that I currently only have the following 2 maneuvers/stances from the Iron Heart discipline: A) Absolute Steel, and B) Disarming Strike. Absolute Steel is a stance that has one Iron Heart maneuver as a pre-requisite. Disarming Strike currently fulfills that pre-requisite for me. Suppose I reach 4th level and decide to swap out Disarming Strike for another maneuver from a different discipline. I no longer meet the pre-requisites for the Absolute Steel stance. Am I still allowed to use the Absolute Steel stance? What if Absolute Steel were a maneuver instead of a stance; would I be allowed to use it?
A: Going with a strict interpretation of the rules, you would only need to have the appropriate number of maneuvers to meet a prerequisite when you needed to learn the maneuver, not if you wanted to use that maneuver later. So the character in question would still be able to use the Absolute Steel stance even though you have given up your only Iron Heart maneuver. So again, you only have to meet the prerequisites when you learn the maneuver or stance, not when you want to use ready or use it. I hope that clears things up.
Q: Dear Sage
Many strikes and maneuvers in Tome of Battle grant a benefit with a successful attack. If a creature’s damage reduction completely negates the damage from the attack, does the benefit still accrue?
--Brian
A: As it turns out, there are four answers to this question: sort of yes, yes, yes, and no.
If the maneuver or stance simply adds to the damage dealt by the attack, add that damage before applying damage reduction (which might in turn reduce or even negate that extra damage). For example, a character in the Punishing Stance adds +1d6 to damage rolls with melee attacks. If you hit a creature with DR 10/— with attack that deals 8 points of damage and an extra 3 points from Punishing Stance, that creature would take 1 point of damage.
If the maneuver or stance adds energy damage to the attack (such as Lightning Throw), damage reduction doesn’t reduce that damage (see Damage Reduction, DMG pp291-2).
If the maneuver or stance simply requires a hit (or “successful attack”) to apply its effect, that effect occurs even if you don’t deal damage with the attack that triggers it. Even if your foe’s DR completely negates the damage from your Leading the Attack strike, your allies still gain the +4 morale bonus on attack rolls and your Martial Spirit stance still allows you to heal 2 points of damage.
If the maneuver or stance requires you to deal damage to the target, damage reduction that completely negates the damage dealt by the attack prevents the special effect from occurring. This is similar to the Stunning Fist feat (which only functions against a foe “damaged by your unarmed attack”) or injury-based disease or poison effects.
Q: Can you use a wondrous martial item, such as shadow hands, to meet the prerequisite for a maneuver?
A: No, because these maneuvers are temporary bonus maneuvers, and do not belong to your actual maneuvers known.
Q: Can I take 2 rounds to initiate two maneuvers and use them both during the same round?
A: No, each maneuver must be resolved during the round in which you initiated it, using the action stated in the initiation time.
Q: When you swap maneuvers and you only just have the number of maneuvers and stances to meet the prerequisite for the new maneuver, can you replace one of that maneuve's discipline's maneuvers or do you have to replace one from another discipline?
A: No, because a maneuver cannot be its own prerequisite. However, if you learn a maneuver (meeting its prerequisites) and swap out another maneuver of that maneuver's discipline, you do not lose the use of that maneuver. Prerequisites only apply to learning maneuvers, not using them.
Q: What is meant by being 'in contact with the ground' for the purpose of the Stone Dragon discipline?
A: There is a lot of debate about this subject, but seeing how the relevant text mentions the 'power of the earth and stone', it is reasonable to assume that the definition of being 'in contact with the ground' is standing on earth or stone. This means that standing on wooden planks (such as when in a building with a wooden floor) or being airborne prevents a martial adept from initiating Stone Dragon maneuvers.
However, your DM may rule otherwise; the rules are vague on this ruling, so it is basically anyone's guess what the correct answer is of this particular question.
Q: Do you need to be lawful in order to learn the law bearer maneuver?
A: Yes, you need to be lawful in order to learn a maneuver with a prerequisite of lawful alignment. However, you do not need to be lawful in order to initiate that maneuver.
General Stance Questions
Q: When you use a stance from Jade Phoenix Mage or one of he other classes that overlays an existing stance, it isn’t clear whether or not you’re still considered to be using a Stance from that Discipline, or any discipline.
For example if you have Shadow Blade active with Assassin's Stance and use Mystic Phoenix Stance over the usual bonus of Assassin’s Stance, is the stance still considered a Shadow Hand stance for purposes of receiving the benefit of the Shadow Blade feat?
Any insight?
A: Yes you are still considered being in your Assassin's Stance even though you are getting the benefit of the Mystic Phoenix Stance, in regards to being in a Shadow Hand Stance for your feat.
Q: When can you initiate a maneuver? Can you initiate a maneuver outside of combat?
A: Yes, because there's no mention of maneuvers (and by extension, stances) only being usable during an encounter.
Specific Maneuver Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
Can my swordsage attack while using ring of fire maneuver (Tome of Battle p55)? What if I have the dervish dance class feature (Complete Warrior p26)?
--Yuukale
A: Almost certainly not.
The ring of fire maneuver requires a full-round action, so the only other actions you could take in conjunction would be free actions and up to one swift action.
Thus, making any kind of attack while using the ring of fire maneuver would be extremely difficult.
The dervish dance also requires a full-round action (because that’s what a full attack action requires), so you can’t use both simultaneously.
Q: Dear Sage,
Does the use of the shield counter maneuver (Tome of Battle p60) incur penalties for two-weapon fighting? If so, do these apply to the next round’s attacks as well?
--Alex Boston
A: No.
The shield bash allowed by this maneuver suffers a –2 penalty on the attack roll (as listed in the maneuver description), but no other penalties for two-weapon fighting apply.
Q: Dear Sage,
What exactly can or can’t iron heart surge (Tome of Battle p68) remove?
--Franco
A: Instantaneous effects can’t be removed by iron heart surge. However, any effect with a duration of 1 or more rounds, including permanent-duration spells or effects, may be removed by iron heart surge, nor does iron heart surge restore damage, ability burn, or ability drain. (Because ability burn can't be healed magically or psionically, it would be safe to assume that it can't be healed through maneuvers either.)
Iron heart surge doesn’t replace lost levels (though it would remove any negative levels resulting from a single spell or effect). It would neutralize a single poison coursing through your system, or a single disease that afflicted you.
Q: Does Leading the Charge and Bolstering Voice affect the User of the stance/maneuver?
A: Considering that a Bard counts as his own ally, and thus gains benefit from his own Bardic song abilities, I'd say yes.
Q: Does the 5-foot step granted by the tactical strike maneuver count against the limit of one 5-foot step per round? If it does, what happens when an ally has already taken a 5-foot step in that round before you initiated the maneuver?
A: No, it does not count against it. So if they have already taken their 5 foot step, they can immediately make another.
Q: I see nothing in Tome of Battle that specifies how often (if at all) you can use maneuvers out of combat... specifically the Shadow Blink/Jaunt/Stride maneuvers. How often can you use them out of battle?
A: According to page 40 of the Tome of Battle: "In the case of a long, drawn out series of fights, or if an adept is out of combat entirely, assume that if a character makes no attacks of any kind, initiates no new maneuvers, and is not targeted by any enemy attacks for 1 full minute, he can recover all expended maneuvers." Thanks to Warlawk for pointing this error out.
Q: Can the counters that replace Saving Throws with Concentration Checks (eg. Moment of Perfect Mind) be modified by miscellaneous bonuses to saving throws (eg. a magic item or feat that provides you with a bonus to your saving throws)? If not, what happens if there is a penalty to your saving throw, does it apply to the skill check?
A: The Concentration check plus any applicable Concentration skill check modifiers completely replace the Will save and its modifiers. Bonuses and penalties to saving throws or even specifically Will saving throws don't apply.
Q: If you use True Strike with the Avalanche of Blades maneuver from the Tome of Battle, does the +20 benefit the entire maneuver or only the first attack.
A: Only the First Attack roll.
Q: I read on the boards that a forum member asked you how Raging/Dancing Mongoose worked with Time Stand Still, and you replied that you get the extra attacks per full attack action, so you would get double the attacks from Raging/Dancing mongoose using Time Stand Still.
Now I looked the maneuvers over in Tome of Battle, and I can't figure out why that is. The maneuver states that it last until end of turn and you get some extra attacks per weapon wielded (max of 2 or 4), nowhere in the maneuver is it said that the extra attacks come per full attack action. If you read about being hasted, it very specifically says you get the extra attack as part of a full attack action and therefore you will get an extra hasted attack from using Time Stand Still. But I can't see why you would get double bonus from Dancing/Raging Mongoose.
So my question is, why did you rule it that way? Have I overlooked something or?
A: Hmm.. Not sure who answered it that way, but they must have misunderstood the question! You could initiate Time Stands Still and Raging Mongoose, and Raging Mongoose would give you four extra attacks that turn, two with each weapon you wield! But only four. not Eight. You would be able to choose which full attack action to apply the extra attacks to during your turn.
Q: When using the high level diamond mind maneuver Time stands still, you can make two full attack actions in a row separate from each other. Suppose you normally get 5 attacks, three from base attack and two more from two weapon and improved two weapon fighting. You use Raging Mongoose to gain two attacks with each weapon at your highest base attack, this ability lasts for one round. Does Raging mongoose let you make two extra attacks with each weapon for each full attack action, or does the limit of two attacks for each weapon apply only for the first full attack.
A: You can make two extra attacks for each full attack action that you make with this combination. So you would get the extra attacks in the first full attack action, and get them again in the second full attack action.
Q: When using Time stands still can you use a standard action instead of a full attack action?
A: Time Stands Still specifically allows you to make two full attack actions, so you would not be able to use standard or move actions.
Q: In the Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords, the Setting Sun discipline has many throw maneuvers that follow the rule: "as part of this maneuver, you must succeed on a melee touch attack against your foe. Resolve the throw as a trip attempt (PH 158)". Normal tripping can only be done against foes one size category larger than you. Does this size limitation apply to Setting Sun throws as well, or could (for example) a Small sized swordsage use a Mighty Throw on a Large opponent?
A: You are still limited in the sizes of creatures you can trip/throw.
Q: The maneuver Raging Mongoose allows you to make extra attacks with a weapon in each hand, but it mentions nothing about taking the standard two-weapon fighting penalties for doing so.
Are these extra attacks penalized by the normal two-weapon fighting rules?
A: You will indeed incur two weapon fighting penalties if you are wielding two weapons and take your extra attacks with both those weapons!
Q: Can Iron Heart Surge remove:
1. Poison.
2. Disease.
3. The spell "Bestow Curse".
4. Ability score damage.
5. Level drain.
6. The influence of an antimagic field. (*)
7. If you use Iron Heart Surge against an effect which does not solely target you, but also affects an area, do you end the entire effect or do you just dismiss it from yourself?
A:
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes.
4. Ability score damage is not an ongoing effect. It is the result of an attack, spell, or ability. So no - damage, even ability score damage, will not be removed by Iron Heart Surge.
5. In most cases, level drain is similar to damage when determining if Iron Heart Surge removes it from the martial adept. If something level drained you, this is a permanent result, not an effect with an ongoing duration. You would not be able to use Iron Heart Surge to remove level drain.
6. Yes, you would be able to end the antimagic field if you chose to do so with Iron Heart Surge.
7. If the effect does not solely target you, such as the antimagic field in number 6, it will still end the entire effect.
Q: Also I am confused by the Uncanny Dodge-flat foot paradox. I was under the impression that uncanny dodge allowed one to keep the dexterity bonus when caught flat footed - not eliminate the actual condition of being flat footed. I'm looking at the "strike of the broken shield" power on p. 74-75 and it says, "If your target cannot be caught flat-footed (he has uncanny dodge, for example)," which is the source of my confusion. Many of these maneuvers only work vs. flat footed opponents; must they *also* be denied their dexterity bonus?
A: The Strike of the Broken Shield wording is worded improperly because Uncanny Dodge does not make you immune to being flat-footed. But the intent should be clear enough. Characters with Uncanny Dodge or characters that cannot caught flat-footed cannot be made flat-footed by this maneuver. I will pass this miswording along to the appropriate departments for potential errata purposes.
In general, follow the flat-footed rules you know when determining the effects of maneuvers. If a maneuver can be used against a flat-footed person (rather than having their Dex denied to their AC), a character with Uncanny Dodge can still be victim to the maneuver.
Q: Counter Charge: The victim is moved "2 squares in a direction of your choice away from you." Is this 2 squares from your location, or 2 squares from where it began the charge? Also, how can it be "away from you" and also "in a direction of your choice?" "Away from you" is a direction.
A: Again, this is not specifically covered in the text. Simply by reading, it is 2 squares away from you, which could be any two squares that do not pass through you. It does not say 2 squares away from the direction that you came from, only 2 squares away from you. But since it is not specifically covered in the exact terms that you asking for, it is going to be up to your DM to determine exactly how this would work.
Q: Clever Positioning: Lacks the text that says that this movement is not subject to attacks of opportunity. Does this mean that it provokes attacks of opportunity normally?
A: While the flavor text of the maneuver uses the word "moving into his space," the actual rules text of the maneuver never uses the word "move." The rules text of the maneuver simply states that you "swap positions with the target." This seems to show that it is not treated as normal movement and would not provoke. Of course, I see the ambiguity you're speaking of, so in a case like this, it is again going to be up to your DM to determine how he/she thinks the ability should work.
Q: Five-Shadow Creeping Ice Enervation Strike: I don't understand this one at all. The box says the duration is 1 minute, but the text says that the special effects last for 1d6 rounds. Does that mean that the ability damage only lasts one minute? That's not the way abiltity damage usually works. Or does the "freezing" effect not kick in for one full minute after the initial attack? Or does it affect one body part per round for 1 minute? Or is this simply an error, and one or the other of those statements is wrong?
A: In cases where the stat block and full text of an entry disagree, the full entry wins out, unless an errata states otherwise. So in this case, the 1 minute duration is incorrect, and the special effects of each result only last for 1d6 rounds. The ability damage is treated as damage is normally treated and lasts until it is healed. For the time being, just ignore the 1 minute duration, and when the errata file is created, it should have all the new/correct information.
Q: When using the many Setting Sun Maneuvers that require you to make a trip attempt (Tornado throw, ballista throw e.t.c.) can a character with the improved trip feat make an extra melee attack if he succeeds on the trip attempt?
A: This depends upon the maneuver. Some of the maneuvers end with your opponent out of reach, so this wouldn't be possible. I imagine that any maneuver that ended with your opponent in a threatened square would work just fine for this purpose. However, without a specific maneuver to reference it is impossible for me to give a definitive answer.
Q: Say I have an attack which does the following damaged on a successful hit: 2d6 (from weapon + 5 (from Str) + 5 (from Power Attack) + 1d6 (Fire) (from the Flaming enhancement) + 10 (extra damage provided by the Stormguard Warrior Tactical feat). Which damage is multiplied if I hit my target using the Diamond Nightmare Blade maneuver?
A: You will not get the Fire damage dice multiplied, but the integer modifiers to your damage from Str, Power Attack, and your Tactical Feat will be, along with your weapons base damage.
Q: The Desert Wind maneuver, Firesnake, has a duration of Instantaneous listed in its stat block. However, the game mechanics text refers to how far the snake can move in a round and how damage is handled from round to round. Is Firesnake intended to be instantaneous (deal damage once and then disappear)? Or is it intended to be an ongoing effect (deal damage as directed for X number of rounds)? If it is intended to be an ongoing effect, what should its duration be?
A: It seems that the description that allows the snake to move around round after round is incorrect. the maneuver is instantaneous, in that you assign a line for the snake to follow, and it does so instantaneously and is done. Errata has not been put up for this yet, and until it is, it is up to your DM to adjudicate the effect of this spell as he or she sees fit.
Q: The Level 9 Maneuver for the Stone Dragon Style is listed as 'Mountain Tombstone Strike' (p84). I note that this maneuver (unlike all the other L9 maneuvers) has no prerequisite maneuvers. Could you confirm whether this is intentional, or is an omission?
A: It is indeed intended as written for the time being. I am passing it along to the appropriate departments for review regardless. If any Errata is printed it will be posted to the Errata section of the site!
Q: Dear Sage
If I use Mighty Throw (Tome of Battle p73) or another maneuver that allows me to trip a foe, does the Improved Trip feat grant me an extra attack against that opponent?
--Gerald
A: Yes. The Improved Trip feat applies any time you trip a foe in melee combat, even if that trip comes from a special power.
Q: Dear Sage
Does the Jump check and subsequent jump made as part of the Sudden Leap boost (Tome of Battle p89) count against the initiator's movement as described in the Jump skill?
--Gabe
A: No. Sudden Leap is its own swift action, not part of a move action, so the movement is in addition to any you might make using other actions.
Q: Dear Sage
Does the Wall of Blades maneuver (Tome of Battle p70) work against touch attacks? What about touch attacks from spells?
--Dennis
A: Yes -- this counter works equally well against touch attacks and normal attacks, regardless of their source.
Q: Dear Sage
Can you use White Raven Tactics (Tome of Battle p94) on yourself to gain another turn right after your current initiative score?
--Robert
A: No. White Raven Tactics doesn’t work on the initiator himself.
Q: The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts until the end of the turn. If a swordsage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would using this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
A: The swordsage would remain invisible if he recovered his maneuvers, because a full-round action takes less time than the end of the turn. Effectively, it doesn't matter when you take your full-round action; it never lasts longer than one turn. However, if that swordsage would take an action of 1 round (such as summoning a monster, for example). This answer renders the second question moot, but nonetheless, becoming invisible is almost instantaneous.
Q: Can you score a critical hit with insightful strike (TOB 63)?
A: Yes, the maneuver states that you don't deal any extra damage that you would normally deal. Additionally, the examples listed in the maneuver don't include critical hits.
Specific Stance Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
If a single opponent is affected by multiple iron guard glare stances (Tome of Battle p59), what happens?
--Ken
A: Play it just like it’s written, remembering that the penalties won’t stack (since they’re all from the same effect).
An ogre threatened by two different characters both in the iron guard’s glare stance would take a –4 penalty to attack any ally of either character. Assuming the two threatening characters are allies of each other, the ogre can’t avoid taking a –4 penalty on his attack roll no matter who he swings at (unless he moves to a place where one or the other no longer threatens him).
Q: Does the shifting defense stance grant you a 5-foot step before the attack roll is made, making it miss because of your movement, or after the attack roll is made and consequently results in a failure?
A: The shifting defense maneuver grants you a 5-foot step after you know that the attack misses, because the stance states that it is activated upon a failed attack.
Q: Dance of the Spider: You need one hand free to climb, but do you need one hand free to remain in place while stuck to a wall?
A: The rules don't mention anything anywhere about what you need just to cling to a wall, so this would again be up to your DM.
Q: Giant's Stance: This stance says "to a maximum of Large." But other similar increases have no such text. Could you then choose to use this stance to gain the damage as if you were Large, then subsequently apply an ability (like Improved Natural Attack, Shillelagh, or Powerful Build) to increase your damage die further?
A: The rules are unclear on how this increase would or would not stack with other things that increase you size. So again, it will be up to your DM.
Q: Island of Blades: Does this apply only against exactly one or two opponents, or against any number of opponents to which both you and an ally are adjacent?
A: It can apply to any number of opponents. It simply uses 2 opponents as an example. As long as you and your ally are both adjacent to an enemy, you get the flanking bonuses.
Q: Martial Spirit: This stance lacks the "the foe must pose a threat to you and your allies" text. A literal reading would therefore say that you can make any "opponent," even one who poses no threat, like an ant at a picnic, and gain the benefit of this ability. That can't be right.
A: If we take a literal reading of the text, you are correct, we would have to apply it to any opponent, at any time, even if they pose no threat to you. Hopefully the DM of your campaign can step in and point of what is, and isn't, a reasonable opponent for the use of this maneuver.
Q: Blood in the Water: How does this interact with an opponent who aren’t subject to critical hits, but you have a Flaming Burst weapon? Does that count as a critical hit?
A: The ability doesn't specifically state that it doesn't work on creatures that are immune to critical hit damage, nor is the bonus from the maneuver treated as critical hit damage, so it looks like this maneuver would work on a creature that is immune to critical hits.
Q: If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
A: No, you both need to be adjacent to the enemy you want to flank, not adjacent to each other.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Prestige Class Questions
Q: How do you determine if a prestige class adds 1/2 per prestige level to your initiator level (from Tome of Battle), or if it counts your full prestige class levels for your initiator level?
A: A prestige class only adds 1/2 its levels to your initiator level unless it specifically states otherwise. Currently the bloodclaw master, deepstone sentinel, eternal blade, jade phoenix mage, master of nine, ruby knight vindicator and shadow sun ninja are the only prestige classes that add their full level to a character’s initiator level.
Q: The Thunderous Throw (from Tome of Battle, pg. 101) ability states that you can choose to treat your ranged attack rolls with thrown weapons as melee attacks for the rest of the turn. Does this mean you could use feats that would only apply to melee attacks, such as the Combat Rhythm option of the Stormguard Warrior feat?
A: Thunderous Throw allows you to treat your thrown ranged attacks as melee attacks. Because of this, you would be able to apply any feat that would normally only apply to melee attacks, which includes feats such as Stormguard Warrior and the various options that such a feat provides.
Q: The eternal blade's island in time class feature says that you can use it as an immediate action, but can you use it in the first round of combat and get to go first no matter what?
A: No. Before you take your first action in an encounter, you are considered to be flat-footed. The immediate action description in the glossary says that you cannot take an immediate action while being flat-footed.
Q: Does the uncanny dodge class feature allow you to use the eternal blade's island in time class feature when flat-footed?
A: No. Uncanny dodge allows a character to retain his or her Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, but is treated as flat-footed for all other purposes. Flat-footed characters, even if retaining Dexterity bonuses to AC, can't use immediate (or any other) actions; thus, it's not possible to activate island in time while flat-footed. The scout's class feature states that a scout "cannot be caught flat-footed", but refers to the barbarian class feature of the same name. Therefore, even the scout cannot use an immediate action while 'flat-footed'. (Effectively, uncanny dodge merely negates some of the disadvantages of being flat-footed, but does not negate being flat-footed in and of its own.
Q: All three base initiator classes have a mechanism by which they can replace less powerful lower level maneuvers with higher level ones. (i.e. in the case of the Swordsage they can replace a maneuver at 4th level and every two levels thereafter) (Somewhat akin to a Sorcerer's or a Bard's spellcasting) Yet no provision is similarly given for all the PrCs. Is this on purpose? Are the PrCs meant to stick with all the lower level maneuvers, or does the same mechanism apply to them?
A: At this point there is not provision for changing your lower level maneuvers when advancing in a Prestige Class.
Q: I noticed "Improved Unarmed Strike" in the prerequisites for the Master of the Nine Prestige Class and found that unusual as there is absolutely no Unarmed Combat perks in the class and further, the Martial Adept classes are all really "weapon-focused".
I suspect that it's in error and perhaps they meant "Weapon Focus" or at least something more weapon related.
A: It is not an error. Not all prerequisites for a prestige class lead to a class ability based on that prerequisite.
Q: 'The full prestige class level,' receives no sort of context. My question is thus:
Do all prestige classes work toward this goal, or just the ones that specifically give maneuvers? (Meaning the Bloodstorm Blade wouldn't contribute.) Furthermore, what exactly is the goal? They increase initiator level, sure, but it seems to only indicate it does so with the existence of a martial adept level, which isn't concise with the way other classes work. So do prestige classes have no effect on your initiator level without a martial adept level? Or is it that they just have a greater effect with a martial adept level?
A: Only Prestige Classes that state specifically that they count towards Initiator level do so. This information is given in the specific Prestige Class descriptions. All other prestige classes that lack this distinction would be counted at a 1/2 ratio as per the multiclass rules.
Q: Furthermore, does initiator level impact your ability to swap out maneuvers directly? I ask this, because as you might know, sorcerers can still swap out spells when progressing in a prestige class, based on their 'hard' arcane caster level (as opposed to 'soft,' which can be stuff like Practiced Spellcaster or caster level buffs).
A: Initiator level does have an impact on how high a level of a maneuver you can swap for. But it doesn't NOT effect when you would swap out the maneuver. That is based on class levels only.
Q: If you are a multiclassed martial adept (Swordsage/Warblade for example) and you enter in a Prestige Class (say, the Master of the Nine) do you add the full prestige class level to one class or both when determining Initiator Level?
A: The Prestige class levels would apply to both. When you initiate a maneuver for either of your given classes you would add your levels in that class plus your prestige class levels (So long as that class is one of those that specifically states it adds to initiator levels) and 1/2 your other Martial Adept class levels.
Q: The Eternal Blade PrC has an ability called "Armored Uncanny Dodge" (ToB p.110). It does not state the benefits instead refering the reader to the Player's Handbook. It goes on specify that "You can use Uncanny Dodge or Improved Uncanny Dodge even if you wear medium or heavy armor".
However, uncanny dodge is not restricted by armor worn. Should the Eternal Blade's actual ability instead be Armored Evasion, since evasion is also a rogue ability on the page referenced, also has an improved version that the character could gain if she already had the basic version, but normally doesn't function if the character is wearing medium or heavy armor?
A: Hmm.. interesting. For now, it reads as written, even with that redundant bit at the end. I have submitted this to the appropriate departments for review! Any changes will be posted in the Errata section as soon as they are made available to the public. I am including a link below to the Errata section of the site!
Q: The Eternal Blade's Island in Time ability (ToB p.110-111) lets a 10th level Eternal Blade take an entire turn as an Immediate action. Taking an Immediate action normally prevents a character from taking a Swift action in their following turn. Does the Immediate action of taking a whole turn use up that turn's Swift action, or, since the entire turn is an Immediate action, would the Swift action be lost from the following, normal initiative count turn?
A: Yes indeed it does take up a use of a swift action for that turn.
Q: When a Shadow Sun Monk from the Tome of Battle book reaches 10th level, he/she gains access to The Balance of Light and Dark Supernatural ability that lets him/her bestow one negative level with "each successful unarmed attack you make".
My question is thus, would an unarmed touch attack qualify for the above mentioned unarmed attack? Such that a character could make multiple touch attacks that deal no damage but each inflict a negative level? (with the caveat of course that each negative level will deal you 1 constitution point worth of damage when the state ends.)
For that matter can maneuvers that require successful melee attacks, such as Five Shadow creeping ice enervation strike (from the shadow hand discipline), feral death blow (from the Tiger claw discipline) or the avalanche of blades (from the diamond mind discipline) be done with successful melee touch attacks that deal no damage?
Thanks for your kind consideration,
It might seem that avalanche of blades does nothing if done with touch attacks but try applying the subsequent number of successful touch attacks to the Combat rhythm ability from storm guard warrior and you arrive at a very potent combination. I would like also to ask if this is a possible combination?
A: No. An unarmed strike is not a touch attack.
You cannot use melee touch attacks in place of normal melee attacks unless the ability or maneuver specifically says so.
Q: Dear Customer Service,
Recently on the optimization boards, two of our members sent in queries concerning Tome of Battle and got two seemingly contradictory answers, which one is the correct one?
Q: For the Bloodstorm Blade's Thunderous throw ability, when it says "you can choose to treat your ranged attack rolls with thrown weapons as melee attacks for the rest of your turn" does this apply to all aspects of the ranged attack? I.e. Does the character basically replace all his ranged attacks with melee attacks with respect to feats (combat rythym from the stormguard warrior feat, for example, could the touch attacks for that be made at range with this ability?), damage (do you basically replace the possible ranged damage with melee damage) and things you can do with melee attacks (i.e. tripping, disarming and suchlike, without requiring the ranged disarm or ranged trip feat or ability respectively)?
A: If you couldn't normally do these things at range, then you couldn't now. All this ability does is substitute your Strength bonus for your Dexterity bonus, and allows you to use feats that affect your attack bonus for melee attacks and such. Ultimately all this changes is how you determine your attack bonus. You could use this in conjunction with Stormguard Warrior's, combat rhythm ability, but keep in mind that you do no damage when this occurs (until the next round of course).
Q: Does Stormguard Warrior's Combat Rhythm damage bonus apply to ranged attacks made with Thunderous Throw? Furthermore, are damage rolls when using Thunderous Throw considered melee damage rolls?
A: The answer is yes. Since your Ranged attacks are considered Melee attacks, the damage is Melee damage. With the Combat Rhythm tactical option these attacks would be Melee touch attacks. Thanks for helping to sort out this confusion.
A: Thunderous Throw does allow you to deal melee damage with your ranged attacks rather than ranged damage. That is the intent.
Both those answers state that you can use Thunderous Throw and Combat Rhythm in conjunction with one another. But damage is not dealt when you first use Combat Rhythm with your Thunderous Throws. The fact that Combat Rhythm's states that you don't deal damage with the melee attack trumps the fact that you are dealing melee damage with Thunderous Throw. The bonus to melee damage on the following round does apply to your Thunderous Throw damage, however.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Item Questions
Q: How does the discipline focus weapon special ability work?
A: The discipline focus weapon special ability grants a +1 bonus on attack rolls, which stacks with other enhancements on the weapon. If the wielder initiates a maneuver or a stance of the discipline to which the weapon is keyed, this bonus increases to +3. Using the example on page 149 of the Tome of Battle, a +1 Stone Dragon Shadow Hand weapon gains a +3 bonus on attack rolls (+1 enhancement, +1 Stone Dragon enhancement, +1 Shadow Hand enhancement). While in a Stone Dragon stance with a Shadow Hand stance, this bonus increases to +7 (+1 enhancement, +3 Stone Dragon enhancement, +3 Shadow Hand enhancement). If the wielder were only using one discipline, the bonus would be +5 (+1 enhancement, +1 from the unused discipline, +3 from the used discipline).
Q: Can a weapon with the Aptitude Weapon property be used to execute special class based abilities that are keyed into a certain type of weapon? For example, could a Dervish with an Aptitude Light Mace execute a dervish dance?
A: No, you must still actually wield a slashing weapon to initiate a dervish dance. The aptitude weapon ability only lets you gain benefits that you would've gained from wielding a weapon you have specific feats for. So while you might get the benefits of feats like Weapon Focus (scimitar) and Improved Critical (scimitar), you're not actually wielding a scimitar, but a light mace in your case.
Q: When an item says "for which he meets the prerequisite", I'm assuming this includes Initiator Level as well as maneuvers known. Is this correct?
A: Yes. So if a martial adept with an initiator level of 5th wears an item that grants a 3rd-level maneuver, he must still have the prerequisite number of maneuvers of its discipline, despite having a high enough level to initiate maneuvers of that maneuver level.
Q: Regarding the crown of white ravens, what does "gains knowledge of that maneuver and can use it" really mean?
A: It means that you can initiate that maneuver. For a martial adept who meets its prerequisites, this means that he or she may effectively add it to her list of maneuvers known. For someone who doesn't have martial adept levels, this means that he or she can initiate it once per encounter, without recovery, as per the Martial Study feat.
Q: Can this maneuver you gain knowledge of from the item be changed? If so, how long does that take? Do you need to remove the crown, then take another 24 hours to attune?
A: You can change the maneuver by removing it and then spending another 24 hours to attune. The maneuver must still meet all of the prerequisites of the item that grants it and the initiator must still meet all of the maneuver's prerequisites.
Q: Can you gain knowledge of a stance through a crown of white ravens?
A: The item is vague on that issue, but as maneuvers and stances are mentioned separately in multiple areas of the book, I would rule that you can't, because the item doesn't specifically mention stances.
Q: Can a maneuver known through the crown of white ravens be used as a prerequisite for learning another maneuver?
A: Because abilities and bonuses granted through magic items can be used to meet prerequisites, you can use the granted maneuver to meet prerequisites. You would immediately lose the ability to initiate the maneuver learned through this method if you remove the item, though, unless you have met the prerequisites in another way in the meanwhile.
Q: Can you wear 2 Rings of the Diamond Mind, each granting a different maneuver?
A: Yes, as long as each grants a different maneuver. This is in accordance to the rule that states that you cannot benefit from the same effect twice.
Q: Can these items be custom-made to fill different slots? For example, would a Tigerskin Cloak, Headband of the Setting Sun, or Iron Heart Helm be reasonable?
A: Yes, although you should check with your Dungeon Master to see if he allows it.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Monster Questions
There's nothing here... yet.
Originally posted by wolfie-kun:
This seems like it will be very useful for linking to.
Thanks a ton!
Originally posted by Magocrat:
No problem, it's here for everyone to see. Now, does anyone think that I should subcategorize the Prestige Class Questions for each of the prestige classes in the Tome of Battle, or wouldn't that be necessary?
By the way, I have added colors to the subcategories, to make them stand out better. (Thanks, Tempest Stormwind, for the inspiration!)
Originally posted by aotrscommander:
Nice job, Magocrat.
I already found the answer to one queston that's been bugging me but I've not got round to asking yet...
Originally posted by Magocrat:
That means that the Tome of Battle FAQ does what it's supposed to do, thankfully.
Q: Dear Sage
When a multiclassed martial adept chooses to learn a new maneuver in place of one he already knows, can he choose to “lose” a maneuver from one class and “gain” a maneuver from another class?
--Daniel
A: No. Both maneuvers must be taken from the same class’s list of maneuvers.
Apparently, the Sage seems to contradict the answer given by Customer Service again. Unless someone else can prove me wrong, the answer from Customer Service will stay. (That, and Customer Service has a bit more credibility in my eyes.)
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Q: The Swordsage's Discipline focus ability states "you gain the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat for weapons associated with the chosen discipline." Should this be read as "You gain the benefit of ... the Weapon Focus feat" or "You gain ... the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat"? That is, do you gain the feat itself or just the +1 to attack rolls it gives?
A: You are not considered to have the weapon focus feats. But they can apply the bonus that you would get (as if you had the feat) to all the weapons associated with the chosen discipline.
Which also contradicts the Sage's answer on if a warblade can use weapon aptitude on a wpn focus ability gained from Swordsage.
I tend to agree with my CustServ response - giving you the actual wpn focus feat for several weapons as a class ability at 1st level (and so letting you pre-req from any of them) would be overpowered.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: The maneuvers known description of the crusader, swordsage, and warblade (in the Tome of Battle) state that you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you already know. However, these descriptions are unclear about whether you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you learned through another class. Can you swap maneuvers gained through different classes?
To clarify this with an example, can a crusader 4/warblade 3 who has taken an additional level in the warblade class and learned a maneuver as a result 'forget' a maneuver that he learned through his crusader levels and learn a warblade maneuver in place of that maneuver?
A: Yes, these abilities do not care what the origin of the replaced maneuver is.
Sorry, here's the question answered by Customer Service. Could anyone lend their thoughts on this issue?
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Thoughts... my thought is that the issue of maneuvers over multiple classes is rather confused!
- Maneuvers from one class can pre-req those in another
- If you've learned a maneuver in one class you can't also learn it in another
- (But) you can't ready a maneuver in a class other than the one you learned it in (even if it's in an eligible school)
- Yet now they say (and don't say!) that you can swapout maneuvers across classes
This just seems inconsistent to me - maneuvers should either pool across classes or they shouldn't. A Sorcerer/Wizard can't cast Wizard spells in his sorcerer slots but he can learn the same spell in both classes. Feats cross and pre-req across classes freely but you can only learn them once. Whereas martial adepts have the odd situation where you can only learn a maneuver once (because it's the same maneuver), ready a maneuver once (because it's the same maneuver), pre-req a manever across classes (because it's the same maneuver) but you can't ready it in a class other than that in which you learned it (because that's different!).
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: Dear Sage
If I use Mighty Throw (Tome of Battle p73) or another maneuver that allows me to trip a foe, does the Improved Trip feat grant me an extra attack against that opponent?
--Gerald
A: Yes. The Improved Trip feat applies any time you trip a foe in melee combat, even if that trip comes from a special power.
I'm a little bit iffy about this one, but I'll add it nonetheless.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
This could be abusable by using the Martial Wonderous Items to meet the pre-reqs of a (higher level) maneuver then discarding the item and you would still be able to use the new (higher level) maneuver.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
I'd like to bump this thread with the message that *R*, the thread starter of the Tome of Battle Customer Service Q&A thread, has given me permission to copy the answers of his thread, and he has stated that he doesn't update his thread anymore, so the up-to-date answers can be found here.
And also, mostholy2, I think that your interpretation of using martial wondrous items to fulfill the prerequisites of maneuvers is incorrect. This is for the same reason that you cannot fulfill the prerequisites of a prestige class or a feat when you wear a wondrous item that heightens your abilities to the point of meeting the prerequisites. (For example, a headband of intellect grants bonus spells per day, but doesn't grant extra skill points at new levels.) Hm, let's see...
Q: Can you use a wondrous martial item, such as shadow hands, to meet the prerequisite for a maneuver?
A: No, because these maneuvers are temporary bonus maneuvers, and do not belong to your actual maneuvers known. This follows the general rule that magic items do not contribute to your abilities for the purpose of meeting prerequisites and entry requirements and granting you level-based abilities. For example, a headband of intellect grants you temporary bonus spells if your spellcasting is based on Intelligence, but it doesn't grant you additional skill points, or the ability to take the Combat Expertise feat if your Intelligence is normally 12 or lower.
Originally posted by crashy75:
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
It isn't inconsistent.
For purposes related to *learning* maneuvers, pool all of them (including stances) together, just like feats.
For all other purposes (readying, scaling (on those that scale, such as Leading the Charge), recovery, and so on), keep them separate by class, just like class features.
There, that perfectly explains all your observations while still meeting up with previous game system development standards.
Oh, and as for Mighty Throw, it's actually perfectly legitimate as is. The trick is you resolve the throw first, meaning that if you huck them out of your threatened area, the bonus attack is wasted. See here for more info.
Originally posted by crashy75:
Originally posted by fork:
Originally posted by karui_kage:
I don't see the answer in the FAQ above, but I may have missed it. Can someone answer here for me? The example Warblade (the dwarf) says he has one 1st level stance and one 3rd level stance. The dwarf is listed as 5th level, but the warblade only gets one new stance at 1st, and one new stance at 4th. Since he wouldn't qualify for 3rd level stances until 5th level, but gets the new stance a level before then, how does he get that 3rd level stance?
Is it a mistake in the book, or is there some way around it that I'm missing?
Originally posted by malvoi:
Originally posted by malvoi:
Originally posted by xaxor:
It has finally been answered!
Originally posted by tiwaztyrsfist:
It's not RAW, but the RAW and Errata on this are confusing and self contradictory at points, so this is a good place for LOGIC to be used.
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
Except it's not contradictory nor is it confusing UNLESS you assume you can ready them using another class' readied maneuver "slots".
Originally posted by sleyvas:
Originally posted by ninewaters:
The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts till the end of the Turn if a sword sage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would useing this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
Originally posted by Yue_Ryong:
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
This question may have been asked before but I can't seem to find the page.
If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
--------
---BG--
---F----
----Me-
BG = bad guy
F = friend
Me = Me
Or does the wording "are adjacent to and enemy" pretty clear.
Other wise how would I best activate sneak attack?
Another question. Lets say I have a PC with light sensitivity and is using child of shadow. would he be not dazed in bright sunlight due to the shadows created while moving 10'/round?
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts until the end of the turn. If a swordsage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would using this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
A: The swordsage would remain invisible if he recovered his maneuvers, because a full-round action takes less time than the end of the turn. Effectively, it doesn't matter when you take your full-round action; it never lasts longer than one turn. However, if that swordsage would take an action of 1 round (such as summoning a monster, for example). This answer renders the second question moot, but nonetheless, becoming invisible is almost instantaneous.
Q: If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
A: No, you both need to be adjacent to the enemy you want to flank, not adjacent to each other.
Answered and added. Sorry it took so long.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Originally posted by nephlite:
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Bump to prevent this thread from being archived.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Originally posted by zavia:
just checking:
Lets say theres 2 manuvers that requires a full round action to initiate. Can i take 2 rounds to initiate both, then use em (both are related to charging)?
No duration is given 4 both.
Originally posted by nephlite:
A full round action can only be done in your turn and you have 5 foot left.
Same as a full round attack= full round action.
So you could do one 1 turn than 1 the next, but not in same round because you don't 2 move and 2 standard actions (which is what a full round saction requires as 1 full roumd sction requires 1 move + 1 standard).
It would be better and easier if you name these moanuevers.
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
I think he's saying "Can I use one round to [Pouncing Charge], but not actually charge, and then on the second round [Searing Charge], and let fly with both at once?" (Inserting random charge maneuvers here.)
No. You can't.
Note how both of them say "As part of this maneuver, make a charge attack" or something very similar? That means that when you initiate the maneuver... you make a charge attack. You can't sit back and charge up.
Tome of Battle Q&A
People frequently come to this forum with questions regarding the Tome of Battle. This is similar to psionics. However, the Psionics board has a FAQ thread, maintained by Tempest Stormwind. People can often find the answers to their questions in that thread. Because of the popularity of the Tome of Battle, I would like to maintain a FAQ thread regarding questions about the Tome of Battle. However, those frequently asked questions haven't been recorded yet. Therefore, I would like everyone to ask their questions about the Tome of Battle, so that it can be documented in one, handy thread. Even if you already know the answer to a tricky topic, you could do everyone a favor by providing the question and the answer.
Please note that, beside the categorization and subcategorization in the Martial Adept Questions and Martial Maneuver and Stance Questions, the questions aren't sorted, so you may have to look closely for the answer to your question. Of course, if it hasn't been answered yet, you can always ask us or Customer Service. Usually, I will try to answer questions that arise because of vagueness in the rules as soon as I can (unless another helpful patron will answer it for you), but questions that can't be answered by studying the Tome of Battle at all will usually have to be answered by Customer Service. If necessary, I will do that.
On a somewhat unrelated note, this is the second thread for the Tome of Battle Q&A, because the first was becoming rather murky because everything was in a single post. Now, I've ordered everything into several posts, each with its own link, so that people can browse them with less brain ache. If you happen to have the old Q&A linked, please change the link to this thread, because this Q&A is here to stay.
Links
CUSTOMER SERVICE
If you have a question that hasn't been answered here, you can ask Customer Service. These people can ask the writers of the Tome of Battle (Richard Baker, Matt Sernett, and Frank Brunner) or provide questions on their own. This means that, in most cases, Customer Service will provide you with the correct answer to whatever questions you may have. If you ask Customer Service a question regarding the Tome of Battle, please provide the question and answer here, so that we can document it. (Please keep in mind that you must register separately to Customer Service in order to ask questions.)
MARTIAL COMPENDIUM
If you're looking for something homebrewn regarding the Tome of Battle, chances are you'll find it here. This thread is kept up-to-date by me, with the help of attentive patrons of the Wizards Community. This is also the ideal thread to let your Tome of Battle material get the attention that it deserves to become as qualitative as it can be.
TOME OF BATTLE CUSTOMER SERVICE Q&A
This thread documents the answers given by Customer Service, and is as close to an official FAQ as we currently have. If a question isn't answered here, you'll probably find an answer in this thread. However, I don't know whether the thread is still maintained, given the last date of maintenance. The questions that are answered in the Tome of Battle Customer Service Q&A thread have been copied into this Q&A.
Linked Table of Contents
- Links and Linked Table of Contents
- General Tome of Battle Questions
- Martial Adept Questions
- General Questions
- Crusader Questions
- Swordsage Questions
- Warblade Questions
- General Questions
- Skills and Feats Questions
- Martial Maneuver and Stance Questions
- General Maneuver Questions
- General Stance Questions
- Specific Maneuver Questions
- Specific Stance Questions
- General Maneuver Questions
- Prestige Class Questions
- Martial Item Questions
- Martial Monster Questions
Originally posted by Magocrat:
General Tome of Battle Questions
Q: Dear Sage
Can a martial adept (Tome of Battle) initiate a maneuver or change a stance while grappling? While pinned?
--Alan
A: The grapple rules provide a list of actions available to a grappling character, but it’s obviously not an exhaustive list. (It doesn’t, for example, mention “speaking” as an option.) It’s really intended more as a description of how grappling alters many normal actions available to characters (such as attacking and moving). Thus, the DM must apply a bit of his own common sense when adjudicating any grapple situation.
Any maneuver that involves an attack may be used while grappling, as long as it’s made with an unarmed strike, natural weapon, or light weapon against another character you are grappling (PHB p156).
It’s easiest to rule that other maneuvers and stances can be initiated normally while grappling unless something intrinsic to the maneuver indicates otherwise. (For example, a maneuver that requires movement can’t normally be initiated while in a grapple because the grappling character can’t move freely.) Many maneuvers and stances are designed for use by grappling characters, and it seems counterintuitive to restrict those options. A grappling character is somewhat limited in his physical mobility, but to prevent him from initiating a maneuver or stance seems unreasonably limiting.
The Sage strongly recommends that a pinned character not be allowed to initiate a maneuver or stance. The rules clearly state that “to initiate a maneuver or stance, you must be able to move” (ToB p38), which suggests that a pinned character shouldn’t be able to accomplish this.
Q: When it comes to initiator levels, do you round down or up when you have half initiator levels, such as when you multiclass into other classes?
A: You round down, to a minumum of initiator level 1st.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Adept Questions
General Questions
Q: How do you calculate initiator level if you have multiple martial adept classes (from Tome of Battle) and/or prestige classes?
A: Calculating initiator level for multiclass characters or characters with prestige classes can be a little tricky. Basically, you calculate the initiator level of each martial adept class separately. Your initiator level for a specific martial adept class is your level in that class + 1/2 your levels in all other classes. A 10th-level swordsage/5th-level warblade would have an initiator level of 12th for all swordsage maneuvers and for determining the maximum maneuver level that this character could learn as a swordsage. The same character would have an initiator level of 10th for determining the same effects of his warblade levels.
Prestige classes are generally treated just like multiclassing, adding 1/2 the level unless the prestige class specifically states otherwise, as do most of the prestige classes found in Tome of Battle.
Q: If you are a multiclass martial adept (from Tome of Battle), a swordsage/warblade for example, do you have to keep your maneuvers known and maneuvers readied separate for each class?
A: If a character has multiple martial adept base classes, the maneuvers known and readied from each class are kept separate. Knowing a maneuver for one class does not mean you can ready it for the other, or vice versa.
Q: If you have levels in two different martial adept classes (from Tome of Battle), such as swordsage and warblade for example, can you use maneuvers that you have for one class to meet the prereqs for a maneuver in your other class?
A: If a maneuver has a prerequisite that requires you to have a certain number of maneuvers from a certain martial discipline, then it only matters if you have that many maneuvers of that discipline. It does not matter if the maneuvers all belong to the same class.
For example, a swordsage 3/warblade 2 has a single Diamond Mind maneuver from the swordsage class. When this character takes a 3rd level of warblade, they gain another maneuver known and can choose Emerald Razor, using the Diamond Mind maneuver known from the Swordsage levels to qualify.
Q: The maneuvers known description of the crusader, swordsage, and warblade (in the Tome of Battle) state that you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you already know. However, these descriptions are unclear about whether you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you learned through another class. Can you swap maneuvers gained through different classes?
To clarify this with an example, can a crusader 4/warblade 3 who has taken an additional level in the warblade class and learned a maneuver as a result 'forget' a maneuver that he learned through his crusader levels and learn a warblade maneuver in place of that maneuver?
A: Yes, these abilities do not care what the origin of the replaced maneuver is.
Q: Can my warblade delay acquiring his stance so that he can gain a 2nd-level stance at a later level?
A: No, because you can't delay acquiring class features.
Crusader Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
If a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) has damage reduction, does that apply before or after damage goes into my steely resolve damage pool?
--Fetch
A: Apply damage reduction or any other effect that would reduce the incoming damage before it goes into the damage pool.
If your DR reduces the incoming damage to 0, no damage goes into your damage pool.
Q: Dear Sage,
If my crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) receives more healing from an effect that he needs to return to maximum hit points, do I have to apply the remainder to my damage pool?
--Antheric
A: No.
You can split the amount of incoming healing between your hit points and damage pool however you wish. You can even apply more healing than you actually need to either category.
For example, imagine if you had 26 points of damage and 10 points in your damage pool, and the cleric cast cure critical wounds to restore 28 hit points. Since reducing your damage pool by even a point would lessen your furious counterstrike bonus, you could apply all 28 points of healing to your hit points, even though 2 points of that healing is wasted.
Q: Dear Sage,
Could a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) choose to learn or ready fewer maneuvers than he or she would be entitled to?
--Joe & Sam
A: No.
You must learn and ready the full number of maneuvers entitled to you by your level.
Otherwise, you’d be able to cycle through your favorites faster, which defeats the purpose of the crusader’s unique recharge mechanic.
Q: Dear Sage,
Can a crusader (Tome of Battle, p.8) delay learning a new stance to a later level? If not, how can he ever learn an 8th- or 9th-level stance, since his last stance is gained at only 14th level?
--Horst
A: As a general rule, you can’t ever delay gaining any feature that comes from reaching a new level, whether that’s a feat, skill points, class feature, or anything else.
The crusader’s stances are no different; at 14th level, the crusader must select a new stance of 7th level or less.
However, at 15th level the crusader could select the Martial Stance feat (p.31) in order to choose an 8th-level stance. At 18th level, he could use that feat to choose a 9th-level stance.
Q: Dear Sage,
When a crusader's maneuver recovery mechanic (Tome of Battle, p.9) activates, what happens to any maneuvers he still had ready and granted?
--Dan
A: If at the end of the crusader’s turn he cannot be granted a maneuver because he has no withheld maneuvers remaining, the process starts over from scratch. All maneuvers (whether expended or not) once again become withheld, and two of those maneuvers are randomly granted.
Q: Dear Sage,
As part of his discipline focus class feature, the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) gains the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat for a set of weapons. Does he also gain proficiency in the listed weapons?
--Daniel
A: According to a strict reading of the rules, no. A swordsage who wants to avoid the non-proficiency penalty for such weapons must gain proficiency in those weapons normally.
Q: Dear Sage
If a crusader (Tome of Battle) of a good-aligned deity were to "fall" and become a blackguard, would he gain blackguard powers in a manner analogous to a fallen paladin who becomes a blackguard?
--Mark
A: That falls squarely into the domain of "house rules."
It certainly seems like a cool variant of that aspect of the blackguard, but you would need to work with your DM to come up with appropriate changes to the list of special blackguard features to make them match the crusader class.
Swordsage Questions
Q: When a swordsage (from Tome of Battle) takes a level in the master of nine prestige class, they can now learn a maneuver from any discipline. If the same character later gains a new maneuver by taking a level of swordsage, can it be of any discipline, or can it only be from the normal swordsage disciplines?
A: When a character gains a new maneuver from taking a level in the master of nine prestige class, that character can choose a maneuver from any discipline. If that same character later takes a level in swordsage or any other martial adept class, the character could only choose a maneuver belonging to a discipline available to that class.
Q: The swordsage’s Discipline Focus (from Tome of Battle, pg. 16) states that you gain the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat for a specific group of weapons. Does this mean you count as having Weapon Focus for any feat or prestige class that has it as a prerequisite?
A: Discipline Focus gives you the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat, and would allow a character to qualify for a feat or prestige class as if he/she had Weapon Focus.
Q: How often can you use the swordsage’s Sense Magic ability (from Tome of Battle, pg. 16) on a particular weapon or armor?
A: A swordsage may only use Sense Magic on a particular armor or weapon once. You can think of this as similar to using a Spellcraft check to identify a spell that’s already in place, or to identify a potion. You can try again when you gain your next level.
Q: Does the AC bonus of the swordsage (from Tome of Battle) stack with the AC bonus of the monk, even though they are both based on Wisdom modifier?
A: No. The swordsage’s AC bonus, allowing the swordsage to apply her Wisdom bonus to her armor class, mimics the ability of the monk’s AC bonus. Since these abilities share the same name and have the same effect, they will not stack.
Q: Dear Sage,
Does the discipline focus class feature of the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) apply just to maneuvers gained from that class?
--Ann Marie
A: No.
The benefits of this class feature apply to all maneuvers of the chosen discipline, regardless of how you acquired the maneuver.
Q: Dear Sage,
Can the swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) apply the insightful strike benefit of his discipline focus class feature to the same discipline twice?
--Ben
A: No.
When you gain this benefit a second time at 12th level, you must apply this to a second, different discipline.
Q: Dear Sage,
How often can a swordsage (Tome of Battle p16) use his Sense Magic class feature on a particular weapon or armor?
--Sammy
A: A swordsage may only use Sense Magic on a particular armor or weapon once.
You can think of this as similar to using a Spellcraft check to identify a spell that’s already in place, or to identify a potion.
At the DM’s discretion, you can try again after you gain a new level.
Q: If you have one level in Swordsage (which grants you Weapon Focus in the weapons associated with one discipline) and take a level of Warblade (which grants you the Weapon Aptitude ability), can you use the latter to switch your Weapon Focus to other weapons outside of the former's weapon group?
A: No. The warblade ability allows you to change “any feat you have that applies only to a single weapon.” The swordsage ability applies to several weapons.
Q: The Swordsage's chart (ToB p.16) lists skills as "6 + Int modifier per level, x6 at first level". Should that be "x4 at first level", instead?
A: Correct!
Q: Alright, so the Swordsage's AC Bonus ability states "Starting at 2nd level, you can add you Wisdom modifier as a bonus to Armor Class, so long as you wear light armor, are encumbered, and do not use a shield."
Does this mean that you can't use this ability when you are unarmored, ONLY in light armor? By RAW it does but... is it a mistake for errata, should I inform my DM that it works with no armor as well?
A: The intent is that you get this benefit whether you are wearing light armor or are unarmored. I will pass this issue along to the appropriate departments for potential errata treatment. Of course your DM is allowed to rule however he/she wishes. Thank you for bringing this to our attention!
Q: Do you add any bonus to the swordsage's sense magic class feature?
A: Yes, you add your swordsage level to the level check, as usual.
Warblade Questions
Q: The warblade’s Weapon Aptitude ability (from Tome of Battle, pg. 22) states that any feat you have that applies to a single weapon can be applied to any other weapon as long as you spend the 1 hour practicing. Does this mean if you have Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), you can change it to Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain) as long as you spend the required time in weapon practice?
A: Weapon Aptitude works on any feat focus on a single weapon, such as Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. Exotic Weapon Proficiency is one of those feats that works for a single weapon, so a warblade would be able to use the Weapon Aptitude ability to switch which weapon Exotic Weapon Proficiency applies to.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Skills and Feats Questions
Q: If you take the Adaptive Style feat (Tome of Battle, pg. 28), can you pick new maneuvers and/or ready all maneuvers by spending a full-round action in the middle of combat?
A: Yes, you can use Adaptive Style to pick new maneuvers in the middle of combat. Since you are picking new maneuvers, they would all be readied. This is a clear advantage for a class such as the swordsage, who normally has to spend a full round action to recover a single maneuver, and would be a great feat to pick up.
Q: Let's say you're a level 12 character getting ready to take the Superior Unarmed Strike feat (ToB). If you take Superior Unarmed Strike, does having a single monk level amongst those 12 character levels force Superior Unarmed Strike to give you the UA attack dice of a monk 5, or do you still get the UA attack dice in the provided table according to character level?
A: You're forced to use the unarmed attack dice of a 5th-level monk.
Q: Would you be able to stack the monk bonus and the swordsage bonus if you altered one or the other via a feat, such as Kung-Fu Genius or Ascetic Mage?
A: Ascetic Mage only allows you to add your Charisma bonus to AC where you would normally be allowed to apply your Wisdom bonus, and does not discriminate between the source of the bonus. Kung-Fu Genius, however, does apply, because it specifically states that it affects your monk class features, thereby not applying to your swordsage AC bonus.
Q: Dear Sage
Can a monk use the Snap Kick feat (Tome of Battle p32) as part of a flurry of blows?
--Alexander
A: Yes. Apply both penalties to all attack rolls made during the flurry of blows.
Q: The Adaptive Style feat in Tome of Battle allows you to change your readied maneuvers as a full round action rather than spending five minutes to do so. Does this...
A) Allow a martial adept to regain and change all of their maneuvers with a single full round action
or
B) Allow them to change the maneuver that is readied in their unexpended "slots".
A: Adaptive Style will actually let you perform option A) from your list. So as a full round action, you can choose a new set of readied maneuvers, and in doing so, reset all of your maneuvers. I hope that clears things up. Have fun and good gaming!
A: Yes, it refreshes all the maneuvers of all your classes. Evasive Reflexes [feat] - limits on 5' steps taken
Q: The Tome of Battle includes a feat named "Evasive Reflexes". This feat is raising a lot of questions on the message boards. Here are the main questions that I hope you can shed some light on:
1. If I have both Evasive Reflexes and Combat Reflexes, and I am normally entitled to four attacks of opportunity per round, what is the maximum number of 5-foot-steps per round that I can make using Evasive Reflexes?
2. Do the 5-foot-step(s) that I make using Evasive Reflexes count against the total number of attacks of opportunity that I can make in a single round?
Thanks in advance.
A:1) 4. You can take a five foot step each time an enemy provokes.
2) Yes they do! Essentially you are replacing the attack with the move, but it still uses up an attack of opportunity!
Q: When the Snap Kick feat mentions "When you make a melee attack with one or more melee weapons" is unarmed strike considered a "melee weapon" for the purposes of activating snap kick?
A: Yes indeed, unarmed strike would count.
Q: When using the Stormguard Warrior combat rhythm ability, is it possible to score critical hits with the touch attacks (still dealing no damage however) ? This comes into play when using the Tiger Claw blood in the water stance which adds to your to hit and damage when you score a critical.
A: Yes, it sure is.
Q: Dear Sage
If a character uses the Adaptive Style feat (Tome of Battle p28) after he has expended some of his readied maneuvers, does he choose new readied maneuvers equal to the maximum number he can ready, or equal to the number he hasn’t yet expended?
--Matt
A: Using the Adaptive Style feat completely resets the character’s readied maneuvers, making them all available for use.
If you’re a crusader, you also reset your granted maneuvers.
Q: The Clarion Commander tactical feat requires you make a DC 20 intimidate and then make an attack on the next turn. The result is flanking for all allies for one minute, does this allow a character with a ranged weapon to flank?
A: It just simply states the enemy counts as flanked for you and your allies, so while you normally wouldn't be able to flank with a bow, it looks like you can with this feat!
Q: The benefit of the Shadow Blade feat as listed on Table 2-1: New Feats (TOB 30) wildly differs from the benefit as listed in the feat entry. Which is correct?
A: In this case, text trumps tables; the Shadow Blade entry is correct. (However, the benefit as listed on the table could be a good feat on its own.)
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Maneuvers and Stances Questions
General Maneuver Questions
Q: Can you know the same maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) more than once? Can you ready the same maneuver more than once at a time?
A: Actually no, you cannot learn the same maneuvers more than once, nor can you ready the same maneuver more than once at a time.
Q: Can a barbarian use maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) while raging? What about Diamond Mind maneuvers that require a Concentration check to use? What about to recover maneuvers in the middle of combat?
A: According to the text under the Concentration heading on page 39 of Tome of Battle, the text states “unlike with spells or psionic powers, you need not concentrate to initiate a maneuver or stance.” Because initiating a maneuver does not require concentration, you would be able to perform most maneuvers while in a barbarian’s Rage, or in any other condition which mimics the restrictions or raging. While raging, a character would not be able to use any Diamond Mind maneuver that requires a concentration check. Using a special action to recover an expended maneuver would fall into the category of “any abilities that require patience or concentration,” so a character would not be able to recover maneuvers in this way while raging.
Q: When you gain a new maneuver (from Tome of Battle), can you choose to learn a new stance as it counts as a maneuver for some purposes?
A: No, you can only learn stances when your class table states that you gain a new stance known. (You can also gain new stances by taking the Martial Stance feat, or taking levels in a prestige class that gives you a new stance.) You can’t use new Maneuver Known choices to pick stances.
Q: When you gain a new maneuver (from Tome of Battle) known from a prestige class, does it get grouped with maneuvers known from your base martial adept class, or are they kept separate? What happens if you have the base martial adept classes and you take a prestige class gives you more maneuvers known?
A: This is actually covered in the rules, though with all the crunchy bits in the book it’s easy to miss! When you gain additional maneuvers known from a prestige class, you choose one of the martial adept classes that you have and add it to the maneuvers known of that class. When a prestige class gives you the ability to ready one or more maneuver, you treat this in a similar fashion, choosing one of your base classes that already has a martial maneuver progression and add the additional readied maneuver slot to that class. You make these choices each time you take a level in a prestige class that grants new maneuvers known or maneuvers readied, so you’re not locked into advancing a specific base class when you take your first level in these prestige classes. You can find more information concerning this on page 96 of Tome of Battle.
Q: There are a couple maneuvers (from Tome of Battle) that state they have a save, but no save DC is listed: i.e., Inferno Blast (pg. 55). What should the save DCs be?
A: In general, the save DC for a maneuver is 10 + the maneuver level + your key ability score modifier (which depends on the discipline).
Q: Dear Sage,
Can I use enter a stance or use a boost in the middle of taking another action? For instance, can I charge up to a foe, enter a stance (Tome of Battle p43), and then make the attack granted by the charge? Or can I activate a boost such as burning blade (ToB p52) after I’ve made the attack roll?
--Taylor & Mike
A: No.
As a general rule, you can’t interrupt one of your actions with another action. The Player’s Handbook provides various exceptions (drawing a weapon while moving, the Shot on the Run feat, and so on). However, you can take a swift action any time you would normally be allowed to take a free action, and you can perform a free action in conjunction with actions of other types.
You could enter the stance before beginning the charge, or after resolving the attack(s) granted by the charge, or in between. Alternatively, you could just move up to the foe, then enter the stance, and then make the attack, but this wouldn’t be a charge.
You must activate a boost before you begin an attack if you want to apply it to that attack. Once you’ve rolled, you can’t activate the boost.
Q: Dear Sage,
If a martial maneuver states that it allows a save but doesn’t list the save DC, how do I calculate it?
--Sammy
A: If a maneuver doesn’t list a DC, it is equal to 10 + the maneuver’s level + an ability score modifier based on the discipline:
- Desert Wind: Wisdom
- Devoted Spirit: Charisma
- Diamond Mind: Strength
- Iron Heart: Strength
- Setting Sun: Strength
- Shadow Hand: Wisdom
- Stone Dragon: Strength
- Tiger Claw: Strength
- White Raven: Intelligence
Q: Can you switch maneuvers that you know for ones that you don't know?
A: Yes. The crusader, swordsage, and warblade can trade one maneuver known for another at certain levels (see their respective descriptions in the Tome of Battle). (Prestige classes that grant maneuvers can't trade maneuvers known.) However, you may only trade one maneuver known for another at a time.
Q: If you are in a stance and initiate a maneuver that both add additional damage die, such us punishing stance and mountain hammer, does the additional damage stack?
A: Yes, because page 40 of the Tome of Battle says that bonuses do not stack, and additional damage die aren't considered bonuses.
Q: Can a Swordsage or a Warblade ready more than one "copy" of the same maneuver so that he can use the maneuver more than once per encounter without having to spend actions to regain his maneuver(s)?
A: Unfortunately not. Readying a maneuver isn't like preparing a spell. You are either Ready to use the maneuver or you aren't! You can't "Double Ready" a Maneuver! You can only use a given maneuver once per encounter unless you Recover it during the fight!
Q: Another multiclass question. Can a multiclassed martial adept (eg. Swordsage/Warblade) choose/and or ready the same maneuver for each of it's classes (provided you have access to the same maneuver)? And if you gain a maneuver in one class, can you use it as a prerequisite in gaining a maneuver in the other class?
A: No, you can only ever learn/ready a maneuver once. If you gain a maneuver in one class it can indeed fulfill prerequisites in another class!
Q: The "preferred weapons" of each discipline seem to serve very little function, except for a couple of feats and the Discipline Focus feature. Can you perform any maneuver with any weapon? Similarly, for "key skills," it seems like most maneuvers can be performed perfectly well without the relevant skill. Are these correct?
A: Your assumptions are correct. The preferred weapons are just that, preferred, and there are some feats and other abilities that you can build around such weapons, but they are not required for using maneuvers from that discipline. The key skills are the same way. While there are some maneuvers that use the key skill to determine their effects, this is not always the case. There are plenty of maneuvers that you do not need the key skill for at all.
Q: Alot of feats and maneuvers in this book refer to weapons, as in the case of snap-kick (which refers to a melee attack with one or two melee weapons) and maneuvers, as in the Tiger Claw's 1st level maneuver wolf fang strike. My confusion arises from the fact that unarmed strike is referred to as a favored weapon in the description of some of the schools of combat (Setting sun, tiger claw, shadow Hand). Does that mean that unarmed strike counts as a weapon when the word weapon is used in the description of a maneuver? Does it make a difference if the character has the improved unarmed strike feat? I'd just like to clear up this confusion.
A: Yes your unarmed strike counts as a weapon when the word weapon is used in the description of the maneuver. Yes it makes a difference if you have improved unarmed strike feat, as you will provoke if you do not.
Q: Just because it isn't really clear in the book: a maneuver that misses is still expended, correct? You can't "hold the charge" like with a touch spell?
A: You are correct. A maneuver that misses is still expended, unless of course that particular maneuver states otherwise (currently I don't believe any maneuvers state otherwise, but if more maneuvers are created in the future, it is possible they could have additional rules text that could specify such a thing).
Q: And finally, let's say someone is a multiclass swordsage/warblade. Can a maneuver from Diamond Mind picked from their swordsage maneuvers forfill the prerequisites for a maneuver from Diamond Mind picked by their warblade maneuvers? From what I seen, this looks like how it works, but I figured I'd ask just to be sure.
A: Yes Maneuvers taken from one Adept class can fulfill prerequisites for maneuvers taken in another Adept Class. If you have a diamond mind maneuver as a sword sage maneuver, and you gain a maneuver as a warblade, you could Choose Emerald Razor as your Sword Sage Diamond Mind maneuver would fulfill the Pre-requisite.
Q: I have a PC who is a 16th-level Fighter, and I have recently accrued enough experience points to advance to 17th-level. I would like to take a level in the new Warblade class from Tome of Battle. This entitles me to 3 maneuvers known, and 1 stance known. Because my initiator level is 9, the maximum level of the maneuvers/stances that I can learn is 5th. My question pertains to fulfilling the pre-requisites for different maneuvers and stances. Assuming that I stick to a single discipline when I select my 3 maneuvers known and 1 stance known, Would it be legal for me to acquire one maneuver that has no pre-requisites, a second maneuver that has one maneuver as a pre-requisite, a third maneuver that has two maneuvers as a pre-requisite, and a stance that has three maneuvers as a pre-requisite? In other words, can I use maneuvers/stances as pre-requisites for other maneuvers/stances, even though I am acquiring them all at the same time?
A: Yes, you can certainly do this.
Q: All of the new base classes from Tome of Battle offer the option of swapping out an old maneuver to gain a new maneuver at certain levels.
What happens if, as a result of swapping out an old maneuver, I can no longer meet the pre-requisites for another stance or maneuver that I currently know? Suppose, for instance, that I currently only have the following 2 maneuvers/stances from the Iron Heart discipline: A) Absolute Steel, and B) Disarming Strike. Absolute Steel is a stance that has one Iron Heart maneuver as a pre-requisite. Disarming Strike currently fulfills that pre-requisite for me. Suppose I reach 4th level and decide to swap out Disarming Strike for another maneuver from a different discipline. I no longer meet the pre-requisites for the Absolute Steel stance. Am I still allowed to use the Absolute Steel stance? What if Absolute Steel were a maneuver instead of a stance; would I be allowed to use it?
A: Going with a strict interpretation of the rules, you would only need to have the appropriate number of maneuvers to meet a prerequisite when you needed to learn the maneuver, not if you wanted to use that maneuver later. So the character in question would still be able to use the Absolute Steel stance even though you have given up your only Iron Heart maneuver. So again, you only have to meet the prerequisites when you learn the maneuver or stance, not when you want to use ready or use it. I hope that clears things up.
Q: Dear Sage
Many strikes and maneuvers in Tome of Battle grant a benefit with a successful attack. If a creature’s damage reduction completely negates the damage from the attack, does the benefit still accrue?
--Brian
A: As it turns out, there are four answers to this question: sort of yes, yes, yes, and no.
If the maneuver or stance simply adds to the damage dealt by the attack, add that damage before applying damage reduction (which might in turn reduce or even negate that extra damage). For example, a character in the Punishing Stance adds +1d6 to damage rolls with melee attacks. If you hit a creature with DR 10/— with attack that deals 8 points of damage and an extra 3 points from Punishing Stance, that creature would take 1 point of damage.
If the maneuver or stance adds energy damage to the attack (such as Lightning Throw), damage reduction doesn’t reduce that damage (see Damage Reduction, DMG pp291-2).
If the maneuver or stance simply requires a hit (or “successful attack”) to apply its effect, that effect occurs even if you don’t deal damage with the attack that triggers it. Even if your foe’s DR completely negates the damage from your Leading the Attack strike, your allies still gain the +4 morale bonus on attack rolls and your Martial Spirit stance still allows you to heal 2 points of damage.
If the maneuver or stance requires you to deal damage to the target, damage reduction that completely negates the damage dealt by the attack prevents the special effect from occurring. This is similar to the Stunning Fist feat (which only functions against a foe “damaged by your unarmed attack”) or injury-based disease or poison effects.
Q: Can you use a wondrous martial item, such as shadow hands, to meet the prerequisite for a maneuver?
A: No, because these maneuvers are temporary bonus maneuvers, and do not belong to your actual maneuvers known.
Q: Can I take 2 rounds to initiate two maneuvers and use them both during the same round?
A: No, each maneuver must be resolved during the round in which you initiated it, using the action stated in the initiation time.
Q: When you swap maneuvers and you only just have the number of maneuvers and stances to meet the prerequisite for the new maneuver, can you replace one of that maneuve's discipline's maneuvers or do you have to replace one from another discipline?
A: No, because a maneuver cannot be its own prerequisite. However, if you learn a maneuver (meeting its prerequisites) and swap out another maneuver of that maneuver's discipline, you do not lose the use of that maneuver. Prerequisites only apply to learning maneuvers, not using them.
Q: What is meant by being 'in contact with the ground' for the purpose of the Stone Dragon discipline?
A: There is a lot of debate about this subject, but seeing how the relevant text mentions the 'power of the earth and stone', it is reasonable to assume that the definition of being 'in contact with the ground' is standing on earth or stone. This means that standing on wooden planks (such as when in a building with a wooden floor) or being airborne prevents a martial adept from initiating Stone Dragon maneuvers.
However, your DM may rule otherwise; the rules are vague on this ruling, so it is basically anyone's guess what the correct answer is of this particular question.
Q: Do you need to be lawful in order to learn the law bearer maneuver?
A: Yes, you need to be lawful in order to learn a maneuver with a prerequisite of lawful alignment. However, you do not need to be lawful in order to initiate that maneuver.
General Stance Questions
Q: When you use a stance from Jade Phoenix Mage or one of he other classes that overlays an existing stance, it isn’t clear whether or not you’re still considered to be using a Stance from that Discipline, or any discipline.
For example if you have Shadow Blade active with Assassin's Stance and use Mystic Phoenix Stance over the usual bonus of Assassin’s Stance, is the stance still considered a Shadow Hand stance for purposes of receiving the benefit of the Shadow Blade feat?
Any insight?
A: Yes you are still considered being in your Assassin's Stance even though you are getting the benefit of the Mystic Phoenix Stance, in regards to being in a Shadow Hand Stance for your feat.
Q: When can you initiate a maneuver? Can you initiate a maneuver outside of combat?
A: Yes, because there's no mention of maneuvers (and by extension, stances) only being usable during an encounter.
Specific Maneuver Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
Can my swordsage attack while using ring of fire maneuver (Tome of Battle p55)? What if I have the dervish dance class feature (Complete Warrior p26)?
--Yuukale
A: Almost certainly not.
The ring of fire maneuver requires a full-round action, so the only other actions you could take in conjunction would be free actions and up to one swift action.
Thus, making any kind of attack while using the ring of fire maneuver would be extremely difficult.
The dervish dance also requires a full-round action (because that’s what a full attack action requires), so you can’t use both simultaneously.
Q: Dear Sage,
Does the use of the shield counter maneuver (Tome of Battle p60) incur penalties for two-weapon fighting? If so, do these apply to the next round’s attacks as well?
--Alex Boston
A: No.
The shield bash allowed by this maneuver suffers a –2 penalty on the attack roll (as listed in the maneuver description), but no other penalties for two-weapon fighting apply.
Q: Dear Sage,
What exactly can or can’t iron heart surge (Tome of Battle p68) remove?
--Franco
A: Instantaneous effects can’t be removed by iron heart surge. However, any effect with a duration of 1 or more rounds, including permanent-duration spells or effects, may be removed by iron heart surge, nor does iron heart surge restore damage, ability burn, or ability drain. (Because ability burn can't be healed magically or psionically, it would be safe to assume that it can't be healed through maneuvers either.)
Iron heart surge doesn’t replace lost levels (though it would remove any negative levels resulting from a single spell or effect). It would neutralize a single poison coursing through your system, or a single disease that afflicted you.
Q: Does Leading the Charge and Bolstering Voice affect the User of the stance/maneuver?
A: Considering that a Bard counts as his own ally, and thus gains benefit from his own Bardic song abilities, I'd say yes.
Q: Does the 5-foot step granted by the tactical strike maneuver count against the limit of one 5-foot step per round? If it does, what happens when an ally has already taken a 5-foot step in that round before you initiated the maneuver?
A: No, it does not count against it. So if they have already taken their 5 foot step, they can immediately make another.
Q: I see nothing in Tome of Battle that specifies how often (if at all) you can use maneuvers out of combat... specifically the Shadow Blink/Jaunt/Stride maneuvers. How often can you use them out of battle?
A: According to page 40 of the Tome of Battle: "In the case of a long, drawn out series of fights, or if an adept is out of combat entirely, assume that if a character makes no attacks of any kind, initiates no new maneuvers, and is not targeted by any enemy attacks for 1 full minute, he can recover all expended maneuvers." Thanks to Warlawk for pointing this error out.
Q: Can the counters that replace Saving Throws with Concentration Checks (eg. Moment of Perfect Mind) be modified by miscellaneous bonuses to saving throws (eg. a magic item or feat that provides you with a bonus to your saving throws)? If not, what happens if there is a penalty to your saving throw, does it apply to the skill check?
A: The Concentration check plus any applicable Concentration skill check modifiers completely replace the Will save and its modifiers. Bonuses and penalties to saving throws or even specifically Will saving throws don't apply.
Q: If you use True Strike with the Avalanche of Blades maneuver from the Tome of Battle, does the +20 benefit the entire maneuver or only the first attack.
A: Only the First Attack roll.
Q: I read on the boards that a forum member asked you how Raging/Dancing Mongoose worked with Time Stand Still, and you replied that you get the extra attacks per full attack action, so you would get double the attacks from Raging/Dancing mongoose using Time Stand Still.
Now I looked the maneuvers over in Tome of Battle, and I can't figure out why that is. The maneuver states that it last until end of turn and you get some extra attacks per weapon wielded (max of 2 or 4), nowhere in the maneuver is it said that the extra attacks come per full attack action. If you read about being hasted, it very specifically says you get the extra attack as part of a full attack action and therefore you will get an extra hasted attack from using Time Stand Still. But I can't see why you would get double bonus from Dancing/Raging Mongoose.
So my question is, why did you rule it that way? Have I overlooked something or?
A: Hmm.. Not sure who answered it that way, but they must have misunderstood the question! You could initiate Time Stands Still and Raging Mongoose, and Raging Mongoose would give you four extra attacks that turn, two with each weapon you wield! But only four. not Eight. You would be able to choose which full attack action to apply the extra attacks to during your turn.
Q: When using the high level diamond mind maneuver Time stands still, you can make two full attack actions in a row separate from each other. Suppose you normally get 5 attacks, three from base attack and two more from two weapon and improved two weapon fighting. You use Raging Mongoose to gain two attacks with each weapon at your highest base attack, this ability lasts for one round. Does Raging mongoose let you make two extra attacks with each weapon for each full attack action, or does the limit of two attacks for each weapon apply only for the first full attack.
A: You can make two extra attacks for each full attack action that you make with this combination. So you would get the extra attacks in the first full attack action, and get them again in the second full attack action.
Q: When using Time stands still can you use a standard action instead of a full attack action?
A: Time Stands Still specifically allows you to make two full attack actions, so you would not be able to use standard or move actions.
Q: In the Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords, the Setting Sun discipline has many throw maneuvers that follow the rule: "as part of this maneuver, you must succeed on a melee touch attack against your foe. Resolve the throw as a trip attempt (PH 158)". Normal tripping can only be done against foes one size category larger than you. Does this size limitation apply to Setting Sun throws as well, or could (for example) a Small sized swordsage use a Mighty Throw on a Large opponent?
A: You are still limited in the sizes of creatures you can trip/throw.
Q: The maneuver Raging Mongoose allows you to make extra attacks with a weapon in each hand, but it mentions nothing about taking the standard two-weapon fighting penalties for doing so.
Are these extra attacks penalized by the normal two-weapon fighting rules?
A: You will indeed incur two weapon fighting penalties if you are wielding two weapons and take your extra attacks with both those weapons!
Q: Can Iron Heart Surge remove:
1. Poison.
2. Disease.
3. The spell "Bestow Curse".
4. Ability score damage.
5. Level drain.
6. The influence of an antimagic field. (*)
7. If you use Iron Heart Surge against an effect which does not solely target you, but also affects an area, do you end the entire effect or do you just dismiss it from yourself?
A:
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes.
4. Ability score damage is not an ongoing effect. It is the result of an attack, spell, or ability. So no - damage, even ability score damage, will not be removed by Iron Heart Surge.
5. In most cases, level drain is similar to damage when determining if Iron Heart Surge removes it from the martial adept. If something level drained you, this is a permanent result, not an effect with an ongoing duration. You would not be able to use Iron Heart Surge to remove level drain.
6. Yes, you would be able to end the antimagic field if you chose to do so with Iron Heart Surge.
7. If the effect does not solely target you, such as the antimagic field in number 6, it will still end the entire effect.
Q: Also I am confused by the Uncanny Dodge-flat foot paradox. I was under the impression that uncanny dodge allowed one to keep the dexterity bonus when caught flat footed - not eliminate the actual condition of being flat footed. I'm looking at the "strike of the broken shield" power on p. 74-75 and it says, "If your target cannot be caught flat-footed (he has uncanny dodge, for example)," which is the source of my confusion. Many of these maneuvers only work vs. flat footed opponents; must they *also* be denied their dexterity bonus?
A: The Strike of the Broken Shield wording is worded improperly because Uncanny Dodge does not make you immune to being flat-footed. But the intent should be clear enough. Characters with Uncanny Dodge or characters that cannot caught flat-footed cannot be made flat-footed by this maneuver. I will pass this miswording along to the appropriate departments for potential errata purposes.
In general, follow the flat-footed rules you know when determining the effects of maneuvers. If a maneuver can be used against a flat-footed person (rather than having their Dex denied to their AC), a character with Uncanny Dodge can still be victim to the maneuver.
Q: Counter Charge: The victim is moved "2 squares in a direction of your choice away from you." Is this 2 squares from your location, or 2 squares from where it began the charge? Also, how can it be "away from you" and also "in a direction of your choice?" "Away from you" is a direction.
A: Again, this is not specifically covered in the text. Simply by reading, it is 2 squares away from you, which could be any two squares that do not pass through you. It does not say 2 squares away from the direction that you came from, only 2 squares away from you. But since it is not specifically covered in the exact terms that you asking for, it is going to be up to your DM to determine exactly how this would work.
Q: Clever Positioning: Lacks the text that says that this movement is not subject to attacks of opportunity. Does this mean that it provokes attacks of opportunity normally?
A: While the flavor text of the maneuver uses the word "moving into his space," the actual rules text of the maneuver never uses the word "move." The rules text of the maneuver simply states that you "swap positions with the target." This seems to show that it is not treated as normal movement and would not provoke. Of course, I see the ambiguity you're speaking of, so in a case like this, it is again going to be up to your DM to determine how he/she thinks the ability should work.
Q: Five-Shadow Creeping Ice Enervation Strike: I don't understand this one at all. The box says the duration is 1 minute, but the text says that the special effects last for 1d6 rounds. Does that mean that the ability damage only lasts one minute? That's not the way abiltity damage usually works. Or does the "freezing" effect not kick in for one full minute after the initial attack? Or does it affect one body part per round for 1 minute? Or is this simply an error, and one or the other of those statements is wrong?
A: In cases where the stat block and full text of an entry disagree, the full entry wins out, unless an errata states otherwise. So in this case, the 1 minute duration is incorrect, and the special effects of each result only last for 1d6 rounds. The ability damage is treated as damage is normally treated and lasts until it is healed. For the time being, just ignore the 1 minute duration, and when the errata file is created, it should have all the new/correct information.
Q: When using the many Setting Sun Maneuvers that require you to make a trip attempt (Tornado throw, ballista throw e.t.c.) can a character with the improved trip feat make an extra melee attack if he succeeds on the trip attempt?
A: This depends upon the maneuver. Some of the maneuvers end with your opponent out of reach, so this wouldn't be possible. I imagine that any maneuver that ended with your opponent in a threatened square would work just fine for this purpose. However, without a specific maneuver to reference it is impossible for me to give a definitive answer.
Q: Say I have an attack which does the following damaged on a successful hit: 2d6 (from weapon + 5 (from Str) + 5 (from Power Attack) + 1d6 (Fire) (from the Flaming enhancement) + 10 (extra damage provided by the Stormguard Warrior Tactical feat). Which damage is multiplied if I hit my target using the Diamond Nightmare Blade maneuver?
A: You will not get the Fire damage dice multiplied, but the integer modifiers to your damage from Str, Power Attack, and your Tactical Feat will be, along with your weapons base damage.
Q: The Desert Wind maneuver, Firesnake, has a duration of Instantaneous listed in its stat block. However, the game mechanics text refers to how far the snake can move in a round and how damage is handled from round to round. Is Firesnake intended to be instantaneous (deal damage once and then disappear)? Or is it intended to be an ongoing effect (deal damage as directed for X number of rounds)? If it is intended to be an ongoing effect, what should its duration be?
A: It seems that the description that allows the snake to move around round after round is incorrect. the maneuver is instantaneous, in that you assign a line for the snake to follow, and it does so instantaneously and is done. Errata has not been put up for this yet, and until it is, it is up to your DM to adjudicate the effect of this spell as he or she sees fit.
Q: The Level 9 Maneuver for the Stone Dragon Style is listed as 'Mountain Tombstone Strike' (p84). I note that this maneuver (unlike all the other L9 maneuvers) has no prerequisite maneuvers. Could you confirm whether this is intentional, or is an omission?
A: It is indeed intended as written for the time being. I am passing it along to the appropriate departments for review regardless. If any Errata is printed it will be posted to the Errata section of the site!
Q: Dear Sage
If I use Mighty Throw (Tome of Battle p73) or another maneuver that allows me to trip a foe, does the Improved Trip feat grant me an extra attack against that opponent?
--Gerald
A: Yes. The Improved Trip feat applies any time you trip a foe in melee combat, even if that trip comes from a special power.
Q: Dear Sage
Does the Jump check and subsequent jump made as part of the Sudden Leap boost (Tome of Battle p89) count against the initiator's movement as described in the Jump skill?
--Gabe
A: No. Sudden Leap is its own swift action, not part of a move action, so the movement is in addition to any you might make using other actions.
Q: Dear Sage
Does the Wall of Blades maneuver (Tome of Battle p70) work against touch attacks? What about touch attacks from spells?
--Dennis
A: Yes -- this counter works equally well against touch attacks and normal attacks, regardless of their source.
Q: Dear Sage
Can you use White Raven Tactics (Tome of Battle p94) on yourself to gain another turn right after your current initiative score?
--Robert
A: No. White Raven Tactics doesn’t work on the initiator himself.
Q: The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts until the end of the turn. If a swordsage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would using this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
A: The swordsage would remain invisible if he recovered his maneuvers, because a full-round action takes less time than the end of the turn. Effectively, it doesn't matter when you take your full-round action; it never lasts longer than one turn. However, if that swordsage would take an action of 1 round (such as summoning a monster, for example). This answer renders the second question moot, but nonetheless, becoming invisible is almost instantaneous.
Q: Can you score a critical hit with insightful strike (TOB 63)?
A: Yes, the maneuver states that you don't deal any extra damage that you would normally deal. Additionally, the examples listed in the maneuver don't include critical hits.
Specific Stance Questions
Q: Dear Sage,
If a single opponent is affected by multiple iron guard glare stances (Tome of Battle p59), what happens?
--Ken
A: Play it just like it’s written, remembering that the penalties won’t stack (since they’re all from the same effect).
An ogre threatened by two different characters both in the iron guard’s glare stance would take a –4 penalty to attack any ally of either character. Assuming the two threatening characters are allies of each other, the ogre can’t avoid taking a –4 penalty on his attack roll no matter who he swings at (unless he moves to a place where one or the other no longer threatens him).
Q: Does the shifting defense stance grant you a 5-foot step before the attack roll is made, making it miss because of your movement, or after the attack roll is made and consequently results in a failure?
A: The shifting defense maneuver grants you a 5-foot step after you know that the attack misses, because the stance states that it is activated upon a failed attack.
Q: Dance of the Spider: You need one hand free to climb, but do you need one hand free to remain in place while stuck to a wall?
A: The rules don't mention anything anywhere about what you need just to cling to a wall, so this would again be up to your DM.
Q: Giant's Stance: This stance says "to a maximum of Large." But other similar increases have no such text. Could you then choose to use this stance to gain the damage as if you were Large, then subsequently apply an ability (like Improved Natural Attack, Shillelagh, or Powerful Build) to increase your damage die further?
A: The rules are unclear on how this increase would or would not stack with other things that increase you size. So again, it will be up to your DM.
Q: Island of Blades: Does this apply only against exactly one or two opponents, or against any number of opponents to which both you and an ally are adjacent?
A: It can apply to any number of opponents. It simply uses 2 opponents as an example. As long as you and your ally are both adjacent to an enemy, you get the flanking bonuses.
Q: Martial Spirit: This stance lacks the "the foe must pose a threat to you and your allies" text. A literal reading would therefore say that you can make any "opponent," even one who poses no threat, like an ant at a picnic, and gain the benefit of this ability. That can't be right.
A: If we take a literal reading of the text, you are correct, we would have to apply it to any opponent, at any time, even if they pose no threat to you. Hopefully the DM of your campaign can step in and point of what is, and isn't, a reasonable opponent for the use of this maneuver.
Q: Blood in the Water: How does this interact with an opponent who aren’t subject to critical hits, but you have a Flaming Burst weapon? Does that count as a critical hit?
A: The ability doesn't specifically state that it doesn't work on creatures that are immune to critical hit damage, nor is the bonus from the maneuver treated as critical hit damage, so it looks like this maneuver would work on a creature that is immune to critical hits.
Q: If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
A: No, you both need to be adjacent to the enemy you want to flank, not adjacent to each other.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Prestige Class Questions
Q: How do you determine if a prestige class adds 1/2 per prestige level to your initiator level (from Tome of Battle), or if it counts your full prestige class levels for your initiator level?
A: A prestige class only adds 1/2 its levels to your initiator level unless it specifically states otherwise. Currently the bloodclaw master, deepstone sentinel, eternal blade, jade phoenix mage, master of nine, ruby knight vindicator and shadow sun ninja are the only prestige classes that add their full level to a character’s initiator level.
Q: The Thunderous Throw (from Tome of Battle, pg. 101) ability states that you can choose to treat your ranged attack rolls with thrown weapons as melee attacks for the rest of the turn. Does this mean you could use feats that would only apply to melee attacks, such as the Combat Rhythm option of the Stormguard Warrior feat?
A: Thunderous Throw allows you to treat your thrown ranged attacks as melee attacks. Because of this, you would be able to apply any feat that would normally only apply to melee attacks, which includes feats such as Stormguard Warrior and the various options that such a feat provides.
Q: The eternal blade's island in time class feature says that you can use it as an immediate action, but can you use it in the first round of combat and get to go first no matter what?
A: No. Before you take your first action in an encounter, you are considered to be flat-footed. The immediate action description in the glossary says that you cannot take an immediate action while being flat-footed.
Q: Does the uncanny dodge class feature allow you to use the eternal blade's island in time class feature when flat-footed?
A: No. Uncanny dodge allows a character to retain his or her Dexterity bonus to Armor Class, but is treated as flat-footed for all other purposes. Flat-footed characters, even if retaining Dexterity bonuses to AC, can't use immediate (or any other) actions; thus, it's not possible to activate island in time while flat-footed. The scout's class feature states that a scout "cannot be caught flat-footed", but refers to the barbarian class feature of the same name. Therefore, even the scout cannot use an immediate action while 'flat-footed'. (Effectively, uncanny dodge merely negates some of the disadvantages of being flat-footed, but does not negate being flat-footed in and of its own.
Q: All three base initiator classes have a mechanism by which they can replace less powerful lower level maneuvers with higher level ones. (i.e. in the case of the Swordsage they can replace a maneuver at 4th level and every two levels thereafter) (Somewhat akin to a Sorcerer's or a Bard's spellcasting) Yet no provision is similarly given for all the PrCs. Is this on purpose? Are the PrCs meant to stick with all the lower level maneuvers, or does the same mechanism apply to them?
A: At this point there is not provision for changing your lower level maneuvers when advancing in a Prestige Class.
Q: I noticed "Improved Unarmed Strike" in the prerequisites for the Master of the Nine Prestige Class and found that unusual as there is absolutely no Unarmed Combat perks in the class and further, the Martial Adept classes are all really "weapon-focused".
I suspect that it's in error and perhaps they meant "Weapon Focus" or at least something more weapon related.
A: It is not an error. Not all prerequisites for a prestige class lead to a class ability based on that prerequisite.
Q: 'The full prestige class level,' receives no sort of context. My question is thus:
Do all prestige classes work toward this goal, or just the ones that specifically give maneuvers? (Meaning the Bloodstorm Blade wouldn't contribute.) Furthermore, what exactly is the goal? They increase initiator level, sure, but it seems to only indicate it does so with the existence of a martial adept level, which isn't concise with the way other classes work. So do prestige classes have no effect on your initiator level without a martial adept level? Or is it that they just have a greater effect with a martial adept level?
A: Only Prestige Classes that state specifically that they count towards Initiator level do so. This information is given in the specific Prestige Class descriptions. All other prestige classes that lack this distinction would be counted at a 1/2 ratio as per the multiclass rules.
Q: Furthermore, does initiator level impact your ability to swap out maneuvers directly? I ask this, because as you might know, sorcerers can still swap out spells when progressing in a prestige class, based on their 'hard' arcane caster level (as opposed to 'soft,' which can be stuff like Practiced Spellcaster or caster level buffs).
A: Initiator level does have an impact on how high a level of a maneuver you can swap for. But it doesn't NOT effect when you would swap out the maneuver. That is based on class levels only.
Q: If you are a multiclassed martial adept (Swordsage/Warblade for example) and you enter in a Prestige Class (say, the Master of the Nine) do you add the full prestige class level to one class or both when determining Initiator Level?
A: The Prestige class levels would apply to both. When you initiate a maneuver for either of your given classes you would add your levels in that class plus your prestige class levels (So long as that class is one of those that specifically states it adds to initiator levels) and 1/2 your other Martial Adept class levels.
Q: The Eternal Blade PrC has an ability called "Armored Uncanny Dodge" (ToB p.110). It does not state the benefits instead refering the reader to the Player's Handbook. It goes on specify that "You can use Uncanny Dodge or Improved Uncanny Dodge even if you wear medium or heavy armor".
However, uncanny dodge is not restricted by armor worn. Should the Eternal Blade's actual ability instead be Armored Evasion, since evasion is also a rogue ability on the page referenced, also has an improved version that the character could gain if she already had the basic version, but normally doesn't function if the character is wearing medium or heavy armor?
A: Hmm.. interesting. For now, it reads as written, even with that redundant bit at the end. I have submitted this to the appropriate departments for review! Any changes will be posted in the Errata section as soon as they are made available to the public. I am including a link below to the Errata section of the site!
Q: The Eternal Blade's Island in Time ability (ToB p.110-111) lets a 10th level Eternal Blade take an entire turn as an Immediate action. Taking an Immediate action normally prevents a character from taking a Swift action in their following turn. Does the Immediate action of taking a whole turn use up that turn's Swift action, or, since the entire turn is an Immediate action, would the Swift action be lost from the following, normal initiative count turn?
A: Yes indeed it does take up a use of a swift action for that turn.
Q: When a Shadow Sun Monk from the Tome of Battle book reaches 10th level, he/she gains access to The Balance of Light and Dark Supernatural ability that lets him/her bestow one negative level with "each successful unarmed attack you make".
My question is thus, would an unarmed touch attack qualify for the above mentioned unarmed attack? Such that a character could make multiple touch attacks that deal no damage but each inflict a negative level? (with the caveat of course that each negative level will deal you 1 constitution point worth of damage when the state ends.)
For that matter can maneuvers that require successful melee attacks, such as Five Shadow creeping ice enervation strike (from the shadow hand discipline), feral death blow (from the Tiger claw discipline) or the avalanche of blades (from the diamond mind discipline) be done with successful melee touch attacks that deal no damage?
Thanks for your kind consideration,
It might seem that avalanche of blades does nothing if done with touch attacks but try applying the subsequent number of successful touch attacks to the Combat rhythm ability from storm guard warrior and you arrive at a very potent combination. I would like also to ask if this is a possible combination?
A: No. An unarmed strike is not a touch attack.
You cannot use melee touch attacks in place of normal melee attacks unless the ability or maneuver specifically says so.
Q: Dear Customer Service,
Recently on the optimization boards, two of our members sent in queries concerning Tome of Battle and got two seemingly contradictory answers, which one is the correct one?
Q: For the Bloodstorm Blade's Thunderous throw ability, when it says "you can choose to treat your ranged attack rolls with thrown weapons as melee attacks for the rest of your turn" does this apply to all aspects of the ranged attack? I.e. Does the character basically replace all his ranged attacks with melee attacks with respect to feats (combat rythym from the stormguard warrior feat, for example, could the touch attacks for that be made at range with this ability?), damage (do you basically replace the possible ranged damage with melee damage) and things you can do with melee attacks (i.e. tripping, disarming and suchlike, without requiring the ranged disarm or ranged trip feat or ability respectively)?
A: If you couldn't normally do these things at range, then you couldn't now. All this ability does is substitute your Strength bonus for your Dexterity bonus, and allows you to use feats that affect your attack bonus for melee attacks and such. Ultimately all this changes is how you determine your attack bonus. You could use this in conjunction with Stormguard Warrior's, combat rhythm ability, but keep in mind that you do no damage when this occurs (until the next round of course).
Q: Does Stormguard Warrior's Combat Rhythm damage bonus apply to ranged attacks made with Thunderous Throw? Furthermore, are damage rolls when using Thunderous Throw considered melee damage rolls?
A: The answer is yes. Since your Ranged attacks are considered Melee attacks, the damage is Melee damage. With the Combat Rhythm tactical option these attacks would be Melee touch attacks. Thanks for helping to sort out this confusion.
A: Thunderous Throw does allow you to deal melee damage with your ranged attacks rather than ranged damage. That is the intent.
Both those answers state that you can use Thunderous Throw and Combat Rhythm in conjunction with one another. But damage is not dealt when you first use Combat Rhythm with your Thunderous Throws. The fact that Combat Rhythm's states that you don't deal damage with the melee attack trumps the fact that you are dealing melee damage with Thunderous Throw. The bonus to melee damage on the following round does apply to your Thunderous Throw damage, however.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Item Questions
Q: How does the discipline focus weapon special ability work?
A: The discipline focus weapon special ability grants a +1 bonus on attack rolls, which stacks with other enhancements on the weapon. If the wielder initiates a maneuver or a stance of the discipline to which the weapon is keyed, this bonus increases to +3. Using the example on page 149 of the Tome of Battle, a +1 Stone Dragon Shadow Hand weapon gains a +3 bonus on attack rolls (+1 enhancement, +1 Stone Dragon enhancement, +1 Shadow Hand enhancement). While in a Stone Dragon stance with a Shadow Hand stance, this bonus increases to +7 (+1 enhancement, +3 Stone Dragon enhancement, +3 Shadow Hand enhancement). If the wielder were only using one discipline, the bonus would be +5 (+1 enhancement, +1 from the unused discipline, +3 from the used discipline).
Q: Can a weapon with the Aptitude Weapon property be used to execute special class based abilities that are keyed into a certain type of weapon? For example, could a Dervish with an Aptitude Light Mace execute a dervish dance?
A: No, you must still actually wield a slashing weapon to initiate a dervish dance. The aptitude weapon ability only lets you gain benefits that you would've gained from wielding a weapon you have specific feats for. So while you might get the benefits of feats like Weapon Focus (scimitar) and Improved Critical (scimitar), you're not actually wielding a scimitar, but a light mace in your case.
Q: When an item says "for which he meets the prerequisite", I'm assuming this includes Initiator Level as well as maneuvers known. Is this correct?
A: Yes. So if a martial adept with an initiator level of 5th wears an item that grants a 3rd-level maneuver, he must still have the prerequisite number of maneuvers of its discipline, despite having a high enough level to initiate maneuvers of that maneuver level.
Q: Regarding the crown of white ravens, what does "gains knowledge of that maneuver and can use it" really mean?
A: It means that you can initiate that maneuver. For a martial adept who meets its prerequisites, this means that he or she may effectively add it to her list of maneuvers known. For someone who doesn't have martial adept levels, this means that he or she can initiate it once per encounter, without recovery, as per the Martial Study feat.
Q: Can this maneuver you gain knowledge of from the item be changed? If so, how long does that take? Do you need to remove the crown, then take another 24 hours to attune?
A: You can change the maneuver by removing it and then spending another 24 hours to attune. The maneuver must still meet all of the prerequisites of the item that grants it and the initiator must still meet all of the maneuver's prerequisites.
Q: Can you gain knowledge of a stance through a crown of white ravens?
A: The item is vague on that issue, but as maneuvers and stances are mentioned separately in multiple areas of the book, I would rule that you can't, because the item doesn't specifically mention stances.
Q: Can a maneuver known through the crown of white ravens be used as a prerequisite for learning another maneuver?
A: Because abilities and bonuses granted through magic items can be used to meet prerequisites, you can use the granted maneuver to meet prerequisites. You would immediately lose the ability to initiate the maneuver learned through this method if you remove the item, though, unless you have met the prerequisites in another way in the meanwhile.
Q: Can you wear 2 Rings of the Diamond Mind, each granting a different maneuver?
A: Yes, as long as each grants a different maneuver. This is in accordance to the rule that states that you cannot benefit from the same effect twice.
Q: Can these items be custom-made to fill different slots? For example, would a Tigerskin Cloak, Headband of the Setting Sun, or Iron Heart Helm be reasonable?
A: Yes, although you should check with your Dungeon Master to see if he allows it.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Martial Monster Questions
There's nothing here... yet.
Originally posted by wolfie-kun:
This seems like it will be very useful for linking to.
Thanks a ton!
Originally posted by Magocrat:
No problem, it's here for everyone to see. Now, does anyone think that I should subcategorize the Prestige Class Questions for each of the prestige classes in the Tome of Battle, or wouldn't that be necessary?
By the way, I have added colors to the subcategories, to make them stand out better. (Thanks, Tempest Stormwind, for the inspiration!)
Originally posted by aotrscommander:
Nice job, Magocrat.
I already found the answer to one queston that's been bugging me but I've not got round to asking yet...
Originally posted by Magocrat:
That means that the Tome of Battle FAQ does what it's supposed to do, thankfully.
Q: Dear Sage
When a multiclassed martial adept chooses to learn a new maneuver in place of one he already knows, can he choose to “lose” a maneuver from one class and “gain” a maneuver from another class?
--Daniel
A: No. Both maneuvers must be taken from the same class’s list of maneuvers.
Apparently, the Sage seems to contradict the answer given by Customer Service again. Unless someone else can prove me wrong, the answer from Customer Service will stay. (That, and Customer Service has a bit more credibility in my eyes.)
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
This contradicts the answer I got from CustServ.
Q: The Swordsage's Discipline focus ability states "you gain the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat for weapons associated with the chosen discipline." Should this be read as "You gain the benefit of ... the Weapon Focus feat" or "You gain ... the benefit of the Weapon Focus feat"? That is, do you gain the feat itself or just the +1 to attack rolls it gives?
A: You are not considered to have the weapon focus feats. But they can apply the bonus that you would get (as if you had the feat) to all the weapons associated with the chosen discipline.
Which also contradicts the Sage's answer on if a warblade can use weapon aptitude on a wpn focus ability gained from Swordsage.
I tend to agree with my CustServ response - giving you the actual wpn focus feat for several weapons as a class ability at 1st level (and so letting you pre-req from any of them) would be overpowered.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
I must confess I hadn't seen any custserv ruling contradicting this, and probably wouldn't agree with it if I did! Any other interpretation would allow you to exceed the "known maneuvers/level" for one of your classes.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: The maneuvers known description of the crusader, swordsage, and warblade (in the Tome of Battle) state that you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you already know. However, these descriptions are unclear about whether you can learn a maneuver in place of one that you learned through another class. Can you swap maneuvers gained through different classes?
To clarify this with an example, can a crusader 4/warblade 3 who has taken an additional level in the warblade class and learned a maneuver as a result 'forget' a maneuver that he learned through his crusader levels and learn a warblade maneuver in place of that maneuver?
A: Yes, these abilities do not care what the origin of the replaced maneuver is.
Sorry, here's the question answered by Customer Service. Could anyone lend their thoughts on this issue?
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Thanks for the quote - I've spent far too much time wading through the pages of the CustServ threads to want to repeat it!
Thoughts... my thought is that the issue of maneuvers over multiple classes is rather confused!
- Maneuvers from one class can pre-req those in another
- If you've learned a maneuver in one class you can't also learn it in another
- (But) you can't ready a maneuver in a class other than the one you learned it in (even if it's in an eligible school)
- Yet now they say (and don't say!) that you can swapout maneuvers across classes
This just seems inconsistent to me - maneuvers should either pool across classes or they shouldn't. A Sorcerer/Wizard can't cast Wizard spells in his sorcerer slots but he can learn the same spell in both classes. Feats cross and pre-req across classes freely but you can only learn them once. Whereas martial adepts have the odd situation where you can only learn a maneuver once (because it's the same maneuver), ready a maneuver once (because it's the same maneuver), pre-req a manever across classes (because it's the same maneuver) but you can't ready it in a class other than that in which you learned it (because that's different!).
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: Dear Sage
If I use Mighty Throw (Tome of Battle p73) or another maneuver that allows me to trip a foe, does the Improved Trip feat grant me an extra attack against that opponent?
--Gerald
A: Yes. The Improved Trip feat applies any time you trip a foe in melee combat, even if that trip comes from a special power.
I'm a little bit iffy about this one, but I'll add it nonetheless.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
This is an interesting interpretation of pre-reqs. If maneuver pre-reqs work like feat or prestige class pre-reqs, you would have to still meet all re-reqs for the feat/class to be able to use the feat/PrC abilities. Why are maneuvers different?
This could be abusable by using the Martial Wonderous Items to meet the pre-reqs of a (higher level) maneuver then discarding the item and you would still be able to use the new (higher level) maneuver.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
I'd like to bump this thread with the message that *R*, the thread starter of the Tome of Battle Customer Service Q&A thread, has given me permission to copy the answers of his thread, and he has stated that he doesn't update his thread anymore, so the up-to-date answers can be found here.
And also, mostholy2, I think that your interpretation of using martial wondrous items to fulfill the prerequisites of maneuvers is incorrect. This is for the same reason that you cannot fulfill the prerequisites of a prestige class or a feat when you wear a wondrous item that heightens your abilities to the point of meeting the prerequisites. (For example, a headband of intellect grants bonus spells per day, but doesn't grant extra skill points at new levels.) Hm, let's see...
Q: Can you use a wondrous martial item, such as shadow hands, to meet the prerequisite for a maneuver?
A: No, because these maneuvers are temporary bonus maneuvers, and do not belong to your actual maneuvers known. This follows the general rule that magic items do not contribute to your abilities for the purpose of meeting prerequisites and entry requirements and granting you level-based abilities. For example, a headband of intellect grants you temporary bonus spells if your spellcasting is based on Intelligence, but it doesn't grant you additional skill points, or the ability to take the Combat Expertise feat if your Intelligence is normally 12 or lower.
Originally posted by crashy75:
I think part of it is that you can't ready the same maneuver more than once. If you knew the same maneuver from two different sources, then technically, you probably could ready the same maneuver twice (once per class- re-reading your post I see that's your point). I think the rule to switch out maneuvers from one class for another exists to mitigate the fact that you can't learn the same maneuver for more than one class. I guess it's a bit of a conundrum. I imagine balance is given priority over consistency in this issue. Personally, I like the idea of switching out maneuvers from one class for another. It's very multi-class friendly, and it really helps me out with my swordsage/warblade build.
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
It isn't inconsistent.
For purposes related to *learning* maneuvers, pool all of them (including stances) together, just like feats.
For all other purposes (readying, scaling (on those that scale, such as Leading the Charge), recovery, and so on), keep them separate by class, just like class features.
There, that perfectly explains all your observations while still meeting up with previous game system development standards.
Oh, and as for Mighty Throw, it's actually perfectly legitimate as is. The trick is you resolve the throw first, meaning that if you huck them out of your threatened area, the bonus attack is wasted. See here for more info.
Originally posted by crashy75:
I can't find a hole in this logic. Maneuvers are *different* than both spells and feats so they can have their own standard. It does irk me though. You can know a maneuver *the source doesn't matter- you know the maneuver or you don't* but you can't ready it as you want *the source really does matter- you can only use the maneuver with the class that granted it.* I'm satisfied with the ruling that allows one to switch out maneuvers from one class for another however. That sage ruling really bothers me, but you've clarified it for me. Pool all maneuvers together for the purposes of learning new maneuvers. The sage is wrong. Customer service is right.
Originally posted by fork:
Any word on this Errata? And is it really as the answer states? That you get the bonues even without armor?
Originally posted by karui_kage:
I don't see the answer in the FAQ above, but I may have missed it. Can someone answer here for me? The example Warblade (the dwarf) says he has one 1st level stance and one 3rd level stance. The dwarf is listed as 5th level, but the warblade only gets one new stance at 1st, and one new stance at 4th. Since he wouldn't qualify for 3rd level stances until 5th level, but gets the new stance a level before then, how does he get that 3rd level stance?
Is it a mistake in the book, or is there some way around it that I'm missing?
Originally posted by malvoi:
I think it is a mistake in the book being that the dwarf's initiator level was 4th when he gained his 2nd stance and thus couldn't have taken absolute steel. He had to have chosen a different stance from another discipline whose pre'reqs he would have met.
Originally posted by malvoi:
I never quite understood the purpose of forcing a player to take the Martial Stance feat in order to get your higher level stances as a martial adept who has taken 15+ levels in the crusader class. I figured those feats were created more for the non-ToB classes. It just doesn't make sense to me...
As a DM I would probably have you switch out your current Good-aligned manuevers for evil ones as the opposite of a 'Good-aligned' Crusader is an 'Evil-aligned' Crusader.
Originally posted by xaxor:
It has finally been answered!
Originally posted by tiwaztyrsfist:
I'd say that, if you know a maneuver from a discipline offered by two classes that you have levels in, I.E. you are a Swordsage 5 / Warblade 5 and have Diamond Mind maneuvers, you can prepare/ready the maneuver using either class.
It's not RAW, but the RAW and Errata on this are confusing and self contradictory at points, so this is a good place for LOGIC to be used.
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
Except it's not contradictory nor is it confusing UNLESS you assume you can ready them using another class' readied maneuver "slots".
Originally posted by sleyvas:
There is 1 flaw here and it comes to the section where you get the high level stance. Warblade states "You begin play with knowledge of one 1st lvl stance from any discipline open to warblades". All the other martial adept classes say the same thing. Thus, while you could build up your maneuvers to get a high level maneuver, I don't see where you could get a high level stance just by taking a single level in a martial adept class. In fact, in the case of warblades, it would seem to take a long time to get that second stance, whereas 2 levels of crusader or swordsage would get a second stance at 2nd lvl.
Originally posted by ninewaters:
The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts till the end of the Turn if a sword sage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would useing this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
Originally posted by Yue_Ryong:
True. Of course, there is the infinitely better option of PrCing out into something for a level or two, so that your initiator level is high enough to qualify for the level 8 stances (including the smexy Immortal Fortitude... mm... Immortal Fortitude with Emerald Immolation...).I never quite understood the purpose of forcing a player to take the Martial Stance feat in order to get your higher level stances as a martial adept who has taken 15+ levels in the crusader class. I figured those feats were created more for the non-ToB classes. It just doesn't make sense to me...
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
This question may have been asked before but I can't seem to find the page.
If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
--------
---BG--
---F----
----Me-
BG = bad guy
F = friend
Me = Me
Or does the wording "are adjacent to and enemy" pretty clear.
Other wise how would I best activate sneak attack?
Another question. Lets say I have a PC with light sensitivity and is using child of shadow. would he be not dazed in bright sunlight due to the shadows created while moving 10'/round?
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Q: The second level shadow boost Cloak of Deception is a swift action to activate and lasts until the end of the turn. If a swordsage used their recovery ability to spend a full round action to recover a maneuver could they remain still and invisible for as long as they went first in the following initiatives? If there would be some blinking time would using this maneuver in this way add a circumstance bonus on hideing instead?
A: The swordsage would remain invisible if he recovered his maneuvers, because a full-round action takes less time than the end of the turn. Effectively, it doesn't matter when you take your full-round action; it never lasts longer than one turn. However, if that swordsage would take an action of 1 round (such as summoning a monster, for example). This answer renders the second question moot, but nonetheless, becoming invisible is almost instantaneous.
Q: If i'm the island of blades stance and using spiked chain, and an ally and I are fighting a foe, he is next to him and me only close enough for him to be threatened does island activate?
A: No, you both need to be adjacent to the enemy you want to flank, not adjacent to each other.
Answered and added. Sorry it took so long.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
A very elegant way of conceptualising it, Tempest. Probably more so than they deserve!
Originally posted by nephlite:
Um, you can use Headband to qualify fot Combat Expertise. At least the Sage has ruled you can. As long as you quaklify, but as soon as you stop qualifying you lose the benefit of it.
Originally posted by Magocrat:
Bump to prevent this thread from being archived.
Originally posted by zombiegleemax:
Er, not according to the v3.5 FAQ on the "general rule" part of that, page 26:
Originally posted by zavia:
just checking:
Lets say theres 2 manuvers that requires a full round action to initiate. Can i take 2 rounds to initiate both, then use em (both are related to charging)?
No duration is given 4 both.
Originally posted by nephlite:
Explain...
A full round action can only be done in your turn and you have 5 foot left.
Same as a full round attack= full round action.
So you could do one 1 turn than 1 the next, but not in same round because you don't 2 move and 2 standard actions (which is what a full round saction requires as 1 full roumd sction requires 1 move + 1 standard).
It would be better and easier if you name these moanuevers.
Originally posted by Tempest_Stormwind:
I think he's saying "Can I use one round to [Pouncing Charge], but not actually charge, and then on the second round [Searing Charge], and let fly with both at once?" (Inserting random charge maneuvers here.)
No. You can't.
Note how both of them say "As part of this maneuver, make a charge attack" or something very similar? That means that when you initiate the maneuver... you make a charge attack. You can't sit back and charge up.
