Toning Down Flaming Sphere
- Thread starter Nytmare
- Start date
Ixis
Explorer
I disagree about nerfing Flaming Sphere because it's more useful than overpowered (as almost everyone else is saying.) In the last game I played, we came upon a small tower, and upon opening the door the found the tower filled with ice archons. I casted grasping shadows on the space behind the door, spent an action point and then summoned flaming sphere inside the tower. The next turn we had the meat shields block the door and we were able to kill almost all the ice archons inside the tower (it should be noted that they also had aoe ice attacks, and by the end of the encounter I was the only party member who died because you can't move, attack or spend minor actions with the fireball in play.)
The combat before that, on the previous day I used acid arrow on a goblin hexer to circumvent his damage redirection ability, though acid arrows damage and/or number of targets hit should be inceased. In the end though it should really do more control-wise than damage-wise. Perhaps it gives a penalty to AC on top of the ongoing acid damage?
Sleep is the daily that should be buffed because it really isn't that effective. It should really be that target falls asleep (save ends) and then the target is slowed.
The next daily spell that's pretty cool is Stinking Cloud because it's an AoE attack you can move. Now, I would've prepared Freezing Cloud instead of Flaming Sphere in that first encounter except the fact that we were fighting ice monsters. Freezing cloud by itself is pretty cool, but I think its attacks should only effect any enemies that enter it perhaps. That way it becomes a nice temporary defense for ranged attackers (similar to the drow's shadow aoe racial.) Same for later dailies like stinking cloud.
The combat before that, on the previous day I used acid arrow on a goblin hexer to circumvent his damage redirection ability, though acid arrows damage and/or number of targets hit should be inceased. In the end though it should really do more control-wise than damage-wise. Perhaps it gives a penalty to AC on top of the ongoing acid damage?
Sleep is the daily that should be buffed because it really isn't that effective. It should really be that target falls asleep (save ends) and then the target is slowed.
The next daily spell that's pretty cool is Stinking Cloud because it's an AoE attack you can move. Now, I would've prepared Freezing Cloud instead of Flaming Sphere in that first encounter except the fact that we were fighting ice monsters. Freezing cloud by itself is pretty cool, but I think its attacks should only effect any enemies that enter it perhaps. That way it becomes a nice temporary defense for ranged attackers (similar to the drow's shadow aoe racial.) Same for later dailies like stinking cloud.
WhatGravitas
Explorer
Actually, it's less - your burn up your standard action to do the extra 2d6+Int. Magic Missile does 2d4+Int and doesn't require you to use your move action just to home in with the sphere.
And while the damage aura is neat, it's also hitting allies, so it slightly situational - and you still need to sustain it.
I think you only see here, that one-shot effects are always worse than persisting effects in 4E - it's like that on every level, people almost always pick the perma-effect dailies instead of the single-shot ones. Just go through the levels and you'll see that.
Cheers, LT.
Nytmare
David Jose
I figured that the damage at the beginning of the turn was to entice people to push, pull and throw each other into the sphere's aura in addition to trying to get away from it every turn. Dealing all of the damage on the wizards turn means that you lose that layer of maneuvering.
[EDIT] Ah, I misunderstood what you and Keterys were saying. I thought you were saying it should deal the aura damage on the caster's turn.
PeelSeel2
Explorer
Hmm, Nver thought of it that way. Also then allay can push, pull, slide you out and give you immediate save.
Omnifarious Grey
First Post
Um, I would have to disagree with you on comparing a 4e wizard to a 3e cleric, in fact they had to nerf the cleric in order to make it balanced. As far as damage is concerned, yes the wizard does not do a lot of damage, but you have to look at the options they are given along with the control aspect. The sorcerer is a good example of a damage dealing caster class and if you compare that to wizard of course the wizard will look puny. However, once you get up a few levels most enemies will have to hate on the wizard to stop his amazing orb powers.
What do people think about sleep going to unconscious (save ends) and then to slowed (save ends), with a miss of slow (save ends).
I think this is not a bad option, though you may have to change it to a burst 1 rather than 2 if you do it this way. Thoughts?
PeelSeel2
Explorer
From a selfish DM perspective, I do not like that. When we played that way, your Big Bad solo (Even with +5 to saves) suddenly goes down right away. Putting the shoe on the other foot, the characters would not like that much either. So now we have limited it to that method on a critical with sleep.
Omnifarious Grey
First Post
I understand. I personally see nothing too wrong with sleep IMHO. A burst 2 on at least 5 enemies can end up dropping at least 2 out of the battle for a round or more. This in itself is good and a typical controller power. I feel like it too a while to at least come to some understanding on how powerful most of the spells are, so maybe wizards did take some time to think about the powers before releasing them.
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