Torchbearer

[marune]

Luke Crane (Burning Wheel) new game : Torchbearer, A dungeon crawl roleplaying game and love letter to Basic D&D.

The book production is funded on Kickstarter : http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/burningwheel/torchbearer

 

[Charles Dunwoody]

I pledged and have the character creation rules. Looks like a really interesting game focusing on the deadly dangerous nature of dungeon delving including the need for rest, light, food, and water. At the same time, each PC is driven by instincts and beliefs and even alignment if they so choose.

Your ability and skills go up just by using them. XP is earned from doing things you believe in or having things you believe in used against you.

Quite a take on basic D&D without actually using the d20 rules.

 

[Piratecat]

I'm glad it's funded, but this isn't the game for me. It focuses on the things I like least about gaming: multiple non-unified sub-systems, nitty-gritty logistics and supply management. I think he's making a fabulous games that I probably won't enjoy.

Won't stop me from trying it, though.

 

[Obryn]

I'm backing it for now, but I'm really wondering what it will provide that Dungeon World won't. I'm in the "interested" camp.

A lot of people I often disagree with seem to hate the idea behind the game, which means there's good odds I'll like it.

-O

 

[ExploderWizard]

The premise is pretty funny. A game of dungeon resource management for those that dislike D&D. Everything cycles. Dungeoncrawling goes out of fashion, and is mocked by the indie crowd, then parodied and once again becomes THE thing to do. I am thoroughly amused.

 

[Obryn]

The premise is pretty funny. A game of dungeon resource management for those that dislike D&D. Everything cycles. Dungeoncrawling goes out of fashion, and is mocked by the indie crowd, then parodied and once again becomes THE thing to do. I am thoroughly amused.

I think everyone (or, many people who are in the business of making RPGs) had fun with D&D growing up.

So I don't think it's crazy or ironic to want to play that sort of game and recapture those sorts of experiences while thinking the actual rules of D&D are pretty bad or could be done better. That they don't provide or push towards the sorts of games you thought they did when you were 8 years old.

I mean, I ran Dungeon World recently, and it's amazing how well that system works for D&D's "genre." It's like how I always wished D&D games actually ran, but didn't. And keep in mind - I like D&D, too. (And I'm super thrilled I found a good D&D Rules Cyclopedia for $4; that Amazon seller had no idea what he had. So I finally have a hard copy instead of a PDF, and plan to run some sessions soon.)

But anyway, like I said - the negative buzz from certain corners of the Internet is worth twice its weight in positive buzz from other places, so my attention is certainly grabbed for now. I'm always game for clever and revolutionary attempts at old genres.

-O

 

[marune]

I'm glad it's funded, but this isn't the game for me. It focuses on the things I like least about gaming: multiple non-unified sub-systems, nitty-gritty logistics and supply management. I think he's making a fabulous games that I probably won't enjoy.

Exactly why do you dislike "non-unified sub-systems ? Burning Wheel (one of the other games of Luke Crane) is (in)famous for its sub-systems, so I'm curious

 

[Piratecat]

Exactly why do you dislike "non-unified sub-systems ? Burning Wheel (one of the other games of Luke Crane) is (in)famous for its sub-systems, so I'm curious

Sure. Burning Wheel isn't for me, either, although I've enjoyed MouseGuard. I want a game that I can run without ever pausing to open up a book. I want one where I can reach system mastery for the primary systems, and where those systems are flexible enough to hold up under pressure. I don't tend to be particularly gamist; I stopped loving complicated rules systems for their own sake at some point in the last decade, and now I lean towards more flexible narrative systems.

It's one of the reasons I prefer GUMSHOE's Night's Black Agents over, say, Spycraft -- even with Spycraft being based on d20. Or Trail of Cthulhu over Call of Cthulhu.

I totally get that other people feel differently, and I'll be excited to play in a game of Torchbearer. I'll be surprised if I run one, though. I suspect I'd spend more time annoyed than full of wonder.

 

[Obryn]

[MENTION=2]Piratecat[/MENTION] - I'm often the same way, which is why I'm really taken by games like Fate and Dungeon World. I'm checking the Torchbearer previews, and if it looks too crunchy I'm as likely as not to de-pledge.

Have you checked out DW at all?

 

[marune]

Sure. Burning Wheel isn't for me, either, although I've enjoyed MouseGuard. I want a game that I can run without ever pausing to open up a book. I want one where I can reach system mastery for the primary systems, and where those systems are flexible enough to hold up under pressure. I don't tend to be particularly gamist; I stopped loving complicated rules systems for their own sake at some point in the last decade, and now I lean towards more flexible narrative systems.

I understand, BW is designed with the idea that both the GM and the players will open the book during play. BW is also definitly a gamist-narrativist system, which I also can understand is not for everyone.

I guess that Torchbearer will be more similar to MouseGuard than BW though.

Have you tried The Shadow of Yesterday?