Trying out a super-sale

[jmucchiello]

This suggestion may upset some publishers, but lets not fool ourselves guys, most of us are not a EN Publishing, a Malhavoc, a Ronin Arts, or a Microtactix. When these guys do a sale on their entire line (or the majority of their line) we all benefit. I see no reason why James shouldn't use a big sale like this as advertising, similiar to how he advertises accessibility to the old TSR products or GM's Day Sale. Throw this baby on the front page! Double my sales!

I'm not complaining here but I've had no sales since the ENPub sale started. My flagship product competes directly with a (currently) $1 product that is #16 on the hot list. And so yes, long term, James should jump on board with the ENPub sale and attract more customers. But not everybody benefits from this unless some of those customers become repeat customers.

But as I said in the announce thread for the sale, good luck to ENPub with their sale.

Do the "hot" list rankings based upon the original, non-special, non-sale price (ie. the number in black color). For MMS:WE that would be $10. If i put my PDF up for 1/2 price, i have to sell two to equal one sale for the "hot" list rankings.

So if I want to ensure good ratings I just mess with the list price of the product. When it initially comes out I make the list price $0.50 for a few hours. The system logs that that is the standard price, then I set the price to $5 and then every sale becomes 10 units on the "best sellers" list. Anything that deals with price difference can be abused. And one other fly in the ointment: currently the system does not store the original price of the product.

 

[philreed]

Observations

I've been sitting back quietly watching the effects of this sale for a few days now and have some observations I'd like to share. I'd also like to ramble for a bit so if you're not interested in that please move along.

When I first saw the sale advertised I knew it would have a positive effect on my own sales. I remember GM Day last year and that was a wonderful event that drastically increased my sales. My first action upon seeing the sale was to rush over to RPGNow and place some of my own products on sale. Some at half the list price but nothing like $1. I saw -- and still see -- no reason to try to go head-to-head with ENPublishing's $1 products. Instead I chose to try and catch some of the wave of customers I knew would be flooding RPGNow.

This worked. The products I've seen selling the best since this sale started were those I placed on sale _and_ the often-times complained about Forbidden Arcana series. I've seen other publishers complain about the Forbidden Arcana series, the primary complaint being that they're priced low and could be viewed as chapters of a much larger PDF. Well, the people attracted to this current sale are looking for low-priced items and they found them in the Forbidden Arcana series. I have greatly benefited from this price point for months now and in the last few days the benefits have become strong enough I'm reconsidering some of my thoughts behind PDF sales.

Next we see complaints that the ENPublishing products are knocking other products off of the lists. This is how the lists are built and the way they've functioned since I joined RPGNow. I see no reason any of us should complain about this. I do have an idea I'd like to throw out for these lists, though.

Keep the lists we currently have and add some new ones to the rotation. Just as we have best D20, best non-d20, etc. let's add top ranked d20, top ranked non-d20, top ranked publisher, and etc. RPGNow already has a top/bottom ranked utility so why not use it? By mixing it with the current rotation of right-hand side lists we give it more value than it currently has. And a top ranked publisher listing would be a fabulous way to award those who consistently release good products.

The RPGNow front page has recently changed. At about the same time the ENWorld ad banner price was reduced. The morning the ENPublishing sale started I had intended on buying banner ads at ENWorld. Knowing I couldn't compete with the sale I decided to wait to buy banner ads. Now the last time I bought a banner ad at ENWorld I didn't make enough in sales to cover the cost of the banner. This could happen again but it's a method I want to try and try it I will. Just not right now.

Is the change to the RPGNow front page a bad thing? Not really. I would think the only people that it really hurts are those new PDF publishers who have no existing fanbase or reputation . . . the guys who feel that "if you release it, they will come." This new page forces them, as well as more established PDF publishers, to _work_ at advertising and marketing products. RPGNow has been spending money for years to run ads in Dragon and Dungeon . . . maybe it's time we did the same. Hell, I'd be willing to go in on a co-op ad with some other PDF publishers.

Now I'm really rambling. I'll keep quiet.

 

[Bloodstone Press]

I don't think it is unfair that EN Publishing $1 books are dominating the hot seller's list. I had 2 titles knocked off by this sale (22 Talent Trees and Hell on Earth), and like Joe, I'm happy.

Sales of my titles that cost less than $5 have been very strong and even my more expensive titles have been doing better than average. And I'm not running any sale at all.

My attitude toward the situation is basically that the sale will end soon, and things will get back to normal. Primarily because Morrus can't sustain selling his titles at $1 forever.

Yes it skews the all time best seller list, but again I just accept that as a fact of business. If I had 20 titles out, I'd expect to be able to work the same kind of sale.

Perhaps in the future my attitude will change, but right now I don't see it as unfair. I see it as a boon, actually... and an interesting experiment.

 

[Bloodstone Press]

I and many others here would really like to hear your results at SVGames with regards to units sold.

ditto...

I know its not really the topic, but I'd like to hear a little about your sales at SV Games too. Are you running the $1 sale there too? (you'll have to pardon me for not checking for this at SV myself, there are only so many hours in a day you know )

 

[rpghost]

OK, we can talk about this for sure. I'm a little worried about the effect on my server though - I can't feed the reviews to my own front page because it crashes MYSQL every time.

RPGNow doesn't get nearly the front page traffic you get. We get about 1000 unique vistors which is probably about 1500-2000 requests form your server a day. We can try while you're around to watch the load.

Yup, I see your point. I think we have room to work on this, though. I don't mind stepping up the control over the site for a good reason like this.

If you don't mind taking more editorial control over the news and it's ok if I only display the titles of the news and those titles when clicked open a new browser window when clicked, then I have no problem with ENWorld handling the news. I installthat on the front page today. Send me the code.

James

 

[Dana_Jorgensen]

Well, now that I have finally gotten over the shock from the fact that I have PDFs on RPGnow selling at $30.00, I took a look at something no one else has considered as of yet.

In the two days since the sale started, other publishers have put another 46 items have been on sale. While not many of these additional items are in the $1.00 range of most of the EN World stuff, there are plenty of them available at well under the $5.00 minimum for orders.

 

[SkeletonKey Ed]

In the two days since the sale started, other publishers have put another 46 items have been on sale.

I have only been selling my products on RPGnow since September so I am still finding little things out about the site. After I read Dana's post above, I went looking for the list of sale products (specials) for the first time and found it. If we now know that customers are on the lookout for sale items, perhaps this list could be placed up top with the other new categories. I know this might make publishers start going crazy with the sales but it could perhaps be regulated in some way. Maybe something similar to the highlighted products on the front page but a publisher can promote an entire sale with a link to their publisher page. Perhaps a half dozen of these highlighted sales could come up randomly.

Still thinking out loud.

Ed Bourelle
SkeletonKey Games

 

[Morrus]

RPGNow doesn't get nearly the front page traffic you get. We get about 1000 unique vistors which is probably about 1500-2000 requests form your server a day. We can try while you're around to watch the load.



If you don't mind taking more editorial control over the news and it's ok if I only display the titles of the news and those titles when clicked open a new browser window when clicked, then I have no problem with ENWorld handling the news. I installthat on the front page today. Send me the code.

James

I'll get back to you tomorrow, James. It's Saturday night and I'm off out to have fun!

 

[Monte At Home]

For what it's worth, I certainly am not complaining about the effect the sales items have on the best seller lists. (Although I do think mine was a simple solution--just don't count the sales of sale products for purposes of the list.)

Last year, we had tremendous success with our big sale, and that probably helped our position on the lists. Other publishers have had sales too, and anyone is free to do so, so it seems fine. The only line I'd probably draw is if someone took a for-sale product and made it free.

The lists are important to me because it's the only visibility RPGNow offers my products. [Minor rant coming...] It used to be that when we would release our products, we'd get a front page mention. Now, despite being one of the top selling publishers, we get nothing. I suppose that's the drawback of not being a gold vendor, but like someone pointed out, it seems a shame that those of us who are making RPGNow the most money (as opposed to the highest percentage) aren't getting any kind of reward. WotC and WizKids may not demand that a store display their print products prominently, but stores do because it's good business. [Tangental rant done]

Mostly, though, I'm just thinking, "good for you, Morrus." I'm glad the sale is going well for you and it seems to be benifiting others, including myself, as well.

 

[rpghost]

The only line I'd probably draw is if someone took a for-sale product and made it free.

Actually it's just the opposite that's WAS a problem. Free products are not shown on the lists. So if you make your paid product free, it falls off the list forever. But if on the other hand you make your free product a paid product after getting "bought" a bunch of times, it was putting them right to the top of the list. We did fix this by preventing any product with a current cost of 0 from showing on the list.

It used to be that when we would release our products, we'd get a front page mention. Now, despite being one of the top selling publishers, we get nothing. I suppose that's the drawback of not being a gold vendor, but like someone pointed out, it seems a shame that those of us who are making RPGNow the most money (as opposed to the highest percentage) aren't getting any kind of reward. WotC and WizKids may not demand that a store display their print products prominently, but stores do because it's good business.

This is a touchy point. On one hand I could just concentrate on making the most money and pimp all the best sellers and products and leave it all 100% up to my staff to make choices for the front page. But on the other hand we choose to try to level the field a bit to help new publishers get exposure.

A Malhavoc release dosn't need our help promoting it. People come to get it as soon as they find out it was released. News sites do that for you. An EN World product doesn't need our help either - they run the largest d20 fan site and soon as they mention something, people go to their product to buy it. I guess my point is that front page exposure for these mega pdf houses isn't nearly as important to them as it is for the other publishers.

I'm not against working out deals and special promotions. I do appreciate your business. But you have to ask us if you expect things to happen.

James