Two extra skill points per level (and character backgrounds)

[Ace]

4 'minor' problems stemming from 1 change would send alarm bells ringing in my world. 5 ranks in spot is either a heavy investment in crossclass which will be of little use versus an appropriate challenge; or if in a newly allowed 'class skill' it would tread on the other various class niches. I've only once seen such a fighter build & you're right it is boring. A less dungeoncentric game if mentioned at the start (I'm assuming noone is suggesting a rule change post character generation) will allow the players to choose more skill heavy characters anyway.

Do not underestimate the strong desire for players to choose a combat heavy character, even if the roleplaying is 75% to combat 25%; that is what 3/4 of my players have chosen regardless. Without guidelines these extra skill points would be sunk into UMD, cc Spot & Listen, maybe a social skill like Gather info.

I think part of this topic is a seeming unwillingness to mainly accept a skill that is not max ranked, and the more minor issue of putting ranks in a cross class skill.

No big deal here FTS we have a different game style and very different players -- The last D&D group I was in had IIRC a Warlock, a Temple prostitute, a Ranger, A Dwarf Time Cleric and a Bard. My players and co players often choose low combat roles-- and as far as putting oints into cc Spot, Listen, gather Info and UMD -- what of it ?

I am glad the wizard can notice things, the fighter can bar hop (Gather Info) and I control the magic items in the game anyway -- YMMV of course but a touch of archetype blurring is a good thing

 

[FreeTheSlaves]

...and as far as putting oints into cc Spot, Listen, gather Info and UMD -- what of it ?

I'd only be wary of the cookie cutter problem where everyone has one particular skill, i.e. spot due to an abundance of points. Mind you that can be dealt with by the dm on occasion only calling for the highest roll (i.e. rewarding only the best pc & marginalizing the others regardless of their ability), & limiting the ability points for each character thereby punishing over-duplication that creates a glaring party weakness.

I just remember when I allowed a swap & swap out class skill at 1st level & almost the entire party had spot.

 

[Campbell]

I guess I don't have any issues with most adventurers being relatively perceptive. The limit on cross-class ranks means that most characters won't have it maxed it, and stealthy types can do their thing. It makes sense that anyone who is exposed to the types of dangerous situations most D&D characters are exposed to would become relatively adapt at noticing an ambush coming their way.

 

[Psion]

If the whole party is dumping points into the same skill, that doesn't strike me as a terribly efficient use of resources.

At any rate, the aforementioned backgrounds I spoke of that grant permanent class skills? Skills that are considered highly desirable among adventurers will only be included sparingly.

 

[Ace]

If the whole party is dumping points into the same skill, that doesn't strike me as a terribly efficient use of resources.

At any rate, the aforementioned backgrounds I spoke of that grant permanent class skills? Skills that are considered highly desirable among adventurers will only be included sparingly.

if you have wheel of Time the backgrounds in it can be adapted pretty easily to D&D -- also the basic set up is reasonably generic/historical to fit many setting with a name change

 

[Ace]

I'd only be wary of the cookie cutter problem where everyone has one particular skill, i.e. spot due to an abundance of points. Mind you that can be dealt with by the dm on occasion only calling for the highest roll (i.e. rewarding only the best pc & marginalizing the others regardless of their ability), & limiting the ability points for each character thereby punishing over-duplication that creates a glaring party weakness.

I just remember when I allowed a swap & swap out class skill at 1st level & almost the entire party had spot.

I don't think 2 points is a whole lot -- it might give a smart human fighter a total of 7 points

This would get him Craft or Profession (these are class fr everyone IMC) , Ride, Climb, Swim, Intimidate and a couple of cross class skills -- that seems balanced to me

 

[Psion]

if you have wheel of Time the backgrounds in it can be adapted pretty easily to D&D -- also the basic set up is reasonably generic/historical to fit many setting with a name change

That hadn't occured to me, but I already set my sights on raiding Second World Sourcebook, Black Company, and Goodman Games/Phil Reeds character folio, which have their own spin on backgrounds.

 

[Aus_Snow]

Goodman Games/Phil Reeds character folio

I get sick of google and family sometimes. What is this folio you speak of?

 

[Psion]

I get sick of google and family sometimes. What is this folio you speak of?

Okay, it's proper name is the Player's Archive. I mispoke, it was not Goodman Games; it was MEG's (I think I got confused because Goodman put out phil's campaign planner in print.) It's basically a extra-long-character-sheet product like the one Green Ronin, Goodman, and Mongoose also put out. In the end, it has two pages of fantasy versions of the d20 modern Starting Occupation concept.

 

[Brother Shatterstone]

In the end, it has two pages of fantasy versions of the d20 modern Starting Occupation concept.

Interesting, and off topic, but I will have to look into find me some of those but how good are the fantasy SO anyhow?