Two House Rules

Quantum

First Post
These are a couple of house rules that I've taken from Monte Cook's d20 Call Of Cthulhu book for 3.5 D&D.

For base saves I use his Offense Or Defense option on page 10 in his book. I have no problems in allowing players to choose their own saves. They are Table 1-8 and Table 1-9.

Then I allow players to choose ten class skills. For skill points they get 32 plus Intelligence modifier for first level. Then they get 8 points plus Intelligence modifier for every level after that.

I personally have no problems in allowing players to use this method. In play testing with my friends, it really doesn't change the dynamics of things.
 

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I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with that approach, but it does raise some peculiar issues you will need to keep in mind:

1) Some classes benefit more than others: Cleric comes out the best of all the classes adopting this approach. Rogue comes out the worst, since they lose one of their stronger distinguishing abilities - lots of skills relative to other classes. Considering that Cleric or Druid is already the strongest class, this just makes those classes that much stronger. Rogue is now a marginal class selection at best. More than likely, it's a one level dip at most.
2) Players will be strongly motivated to take the same skills regardless of character: Some skills are just inherently stronger than others. You are pretty much gauranteed that everyone in the party will make spot/listen class skills, take a goodly amount of tumble and if they aren't a spellcaster then take use magic device as a class skill. In fact, I would probably be motivated to take Will or Fort as my strong save regardless of class, and actually I might just take Will as my strong save regardless of class and rely on good Con to make up the gap. (The only exception might be cleric, where I might take Fort and rely on my good Wisdom for Will.) You might actually end up encouraging the uniformity of build that classes are meant to discourage.
3) You risk intelligence being a dump stat: Few classes actually need 8 skill points per level. For many, it's something of a luxury that they can get by without. As such, virtually everyone in the party is likely to have a 10 Int or less if they don't need it for spell casting.
 

Trailblazer does similar things; letting you choose your saves and eliminating class skills. I don't see either one of those things as being a huge problem, and many players will continue to choose whatever their class skills and saves were under the core rules because those make sense anyway.
 

Celebrim has some valid points, but if those issues don't mean anything to your game you're going to keep doing it anyway. I'm not sure what you're wanting to accomplish here either. Most people post suggestions for something or say they are doing something and then ask for opinions, improvements, to point out flaws. You're not doing any of that. You just post, "hey this is what I'm doing."

Are you even wanting anyone to critique your ideas, offer better solutions, reasons to go along with it or stop what you're doing, or are you just throwing that out there for everyone?
 

It works sorta OK for CoC d20, if that's a game you enjoy; it wouldn't work for 3e. Celebrim's covered most of why already.
 

Trailblazer does similar things; ... eliminating class skills.

Actually, they don't. Trailblazer eliminates cross-class skills. Class skills still exist and, like Pathfinder, you get +3 ranks for investing in a class skill.
I vastly prefer it, since it lets you (easily and reasonably) diversify your skill set over several levels, even with a measly 3 skill points per level. (Oh Krom, the 8 Int half-orc Barbarian.)
 

Are you even wanting anyone to critique your ideas, offer better solutions, reasons to go along with it or stop what you're doing, or are you just throwing that out there for everyone?

Mostly for constructive critiques and to throw it out there for everyone to consider.

One of the things I've never like about the earlier Editions is that there was no real customization for the characters allowed. That's one of the strengths of d20, is that it allows for more customization.

And actually, I really haven't seen people take option number two. They did tak the necessary skills for their character, such as the Rouge taking the spot and disarm skills, but for the most part they all did what they could to represent other interests to make their characters unique. For example, the mage in my group took Knowledge: Brewing as a class skill because he wanted to be a world reknown brewer.
 

I'm going to disagree with you on the issue of customization. I've been playing D&D since I got the nice blue and red boxes of the Basic and Expert rules sets. I've never had any problem either as a DM or player or with any of the players in my games customizing their characters. I've built characters that were memorable for who they were and the things they did not their class skills or what skills they invested in.

Customizing characters, at least to me, is not about what feat they get or what special ability at what level, its about what the player does with that character, the time, effort and personality they put into it. In that regard, 3e is very similar to 4e in that it turns the game into more of a combat game where you have to plan out levels, classes and feats far in advance or you somehow end up deficient or less than optimal.

While I like d20 in regard to some of its simplicity (basing the game around a single die, high rolls are always good, etc.), I think that getting rid of a lot of the crap (just plain silly armor class values, feats as more than descriptive text or cool maneuvers, special abilities every level), then you can get back into more of the roleplaying and less worrying about whether you took the right class at the right level, have enough ranks, took the right feat.

And as for the skill thing, that kind of turns things upside down. For one, you're making all the 2 and 4 skill pt/level classes more powerful and you're weakening bards, rangers and rogues, especially bards and rogues whose significant traits of their classes were their class skill selections and their skill points. Are you doing anything to balance out that deficiency or just flipping the bird to those classes? Its irrelevant to whether the players care or not. Of course they won't because now they don't need to be a bard unless they want to sing a song and they don't need to be a rogue unless they want evasion or picking up a little sneak attack.

If you want other classes to have more skills or be more versatile, then consider grouping some redundant skills together (like Listen and Spot, Hide and Move Silently) or make some skills class skills for everyone (like climb, jump and swim). But a blanket change like what you propose only weakens the game when you don't do anything to mitigate the weaknesses you've caused.

I'm not going to comment on the choosing offense or defense stuff since I don't have the material you're referencing.
 

I don't agree with the issue on skills. One of the biggest complaints I've always seen is along the lines of "Why does my class get less skills than the other class" After all, if a fighter is going to go against monsters and such, shouldn't he have a lot of knowledge too? After all, it would be a bad choice for a fighter to attack a wraith without knowing what weaknesses and abilities it has, nd just go in swinging a sword." Giving everyone the same skill points eliminates that complaint.

But yes, I am aware of power gamers who want their character to be Marty Sue types. This option doesn't really hinder them either.

And I cannot agree with the customization is in the personality comment. Different people are going to have different skills and abilities. An English long bowman is very different from a Samurai. And the core rule books never amde that kind of distinction. In terms of skills and abilities every other character is really nothing more than a cardboard cut out of each other because of these kinds of limitations. And under these kinds of limitations, when I first started, all players took the most powerful things they could to deal out the most damage. For example, I never had a fighter that would use anything other either a two handed sword, or a bastard sword and a shield.
 
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I don't agree with the issue on skills. One of the biggest complaints I've always seen is along the lines of "Why does my class get less skills than the other class"

Why does my class get a lower BAB bonus than the other class?

Why does my class get fewer spells than the other class?

Why does my class get fewer hitpoints than the other class?

To answer all of these questions, you have to consider what the game would be like if it was a skill based system.

The answer to the question is essentially, "All classes do get the same amount of skills. You just spent some of your hit points on 'sword swinging' or 'spell casting'."

"After all, if a fighter is going to go against monsters and such, shouldn't he have a lot of knowledge too? After all, it would be a bad choice for a fighter to attack a wraith without knowing what weaknesses and abilities it has, nd just go in swinging a sword."

The problem with this as an answer is that, "If a fighter is going to go against monsters and such, shouldn't he have a lot of spells too? After all, it would be a bad choice for a fighter to attack a monster with high AC/DR/etc. without debuffing it, and instead just go in swinging with a sword.", is just as valid of an answer.

Giving everyone the same skill points eliminates that complaint.

So why can't my fighter get spells? After all, casting spells is just a sort of knowledge too?
 

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