Ultimate combat: Are Airships underpriced or are flying carpets a complete rip off?

[frankthedm]

Seriously, I know there are logistic issues with a ship vs. a 15 lb. carpet, but this kind of price discrepancy is head scratcher.

Carpet of flight
5 ft. by 5 ft. 200 lbs. @ 40 ft speed, 400 lbs. @ 30 ft speed. 8 lbs. 20,000 gp
5 ft. by 10 ft. 400 lbs. @ 40 ft speed, 800 lbs. @ 30 ft speed. 10 lbs. 35,000 gp
10 ft. by 10 ft. 800 lbs. @ 40 ft speed, 1600 lbs. @ 30 ft speed. 15 lbs. 60,000 gp

Airship
(20 ft. by 60 ft.); 30 tons or 100 passengers @ Max Speed 100 ft.; Acceleration 30 ft. Cost 50,000 gp

I can really only guess the price was set low so a party who gets one as loot isn't too tempted to liquidize it for GP.

Oh yeah, the airship has Hardness 5 and 720 HP, while a generous DM might rule a flying carpet is as tough as leather, Hardness 2 and 5 hp per inch of thickness.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I think that the airship is supposed to be a game changer - that settings having them will have radically different ranged economics.

Me, I'd want to make sure that I had a carpet of flying on my airship - sometimes you just need a skiff, not a ship.

The Auld Grump

 

[RangerWickett]

How much crew do you need for the airship?

 

[frankthedm]

How much crew do you need for the airship?

Zero, it is propelled by an "easily controlled magical engine" and there are no drive checks needed either.

[sblock=Airship]Colossal air vehicle
Squares 48 (20 ft. by 60 ft.); Cost 50,000 gp
Defense
AC 2; Hardness 5
hp 720 (359)
Base Save +0
Offense
Maximum Speed 100 ft.; Acceleration 30 ft.
CMB +8; CMD 18
Ramming Damage 8d8
Description
This exotic and expensive vehicle is held aloft by a massive balloon connected by chain to a ship that hangs below. This ship is similar to a sailing ship, complete with an open top, and is propelled by an easily controlled magical engine. Passengers and cargo are carried in the ship. An airship can carry 30 tons of cargo or 100 passengers.
Propulsion current (air; 90 squares of dirigible, hp 450) and magic
Driving Check none (magic)
Forward Facing the ship's forward
Driving Device magic item
Driving Space the nine squares around the controlling magic item that sits at the front of the ship
Crew 0
Decks 2
Weapons Up to 6 Large direct-fire siege engines in banks of 3 positioned on the port and starboard sides of the airship, or up to 4 Huge direct-fire siege engines in banks of two on the port and starboard sides of the ship. The siege engines may only fire out the sides of the ship they are positioned on. They cannot be swiveled to fire toward the forward or aft sides of the ship.[/sblock]

 

[LogantheBard]

Airships are not the same as a flying carpet. I can't take an airship into a dungeon, cave, castle, or through the streets. I can't put an airship in my bag. Airships are a method of overland travel. Flying carpets are a combat/exploration tool.

 

[Squire James]

There is a remaining issue that a "boat" shouldn't cost more than a "ship". Not to mention there are seafaring ships that cost almost as much as an airship, are not much bigger, and can't fly at all!

One solution is to make airships about 150,000 gp and keep the prices of the other stuff about the same.

Another way is to develop a somewhat detailed system of figuring out how much various flying devices cost. My suggestion is that (1) buy the thing that flies, and (2) pay an amount to enchant it to fly.

That amount could be something like 15,000 gp for a 1-square item, plus 5,000 gp more for each doubling in size (count each "floor" as another set of squares, if you want flying buildings or castles). This would place an 128-square airship at 50,000 gp to enchant plus the cost of the ship. A practical limit may be placed on the doubling - perhaps past a certain point the 5,000 gp just adds a certain number of squares instead of doubling them.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

There is a remaining issue that a "boat" shouldn't cost more than a "ship". Not to mention there are seafaring ships that cost almost as much as an airship, are not much bigger, and can't fly at all!

One solution is to make airships about 150,000 gp and keep the prices of the other stuff about the same.

Yeah, I think the airship is woefully underpriced. Sure, the carpet of flying is vastly more convenient for adventuring, but you can't base yourself out of a carpet, can you? Or carry vast amounts of bulky cargo that won't fit in your bag of holding?

Brad

 

[TarionzCousin]

Those were 2011 sale prices to reduce inventory. Airships now cost three times that much.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Thinking through what I would want in an airship, as a GM....

I want the ship to need a crew.

I want it to need maintenance. (Ships are expensive to keep up.)

And, on thinking it through, I want them to be expensive.

I have airships in my steampunk game, the only magic is used to lighten the structure. Design wise they look a bit like a Heavy Lifter, with side mounted sails to use favorable winds.

Ah Hell, I want to play steampunk, not fantasy airships....

In a lot of ways Eberron is more dieselpunk than fantasy. Though in that case airships are more for plot convenience (and fun melee combat) than they are for gear. And they mostly belonged to a Family, not individuals....

The Auld Grump

 

[LogantheBard]

they should definitely have a hefty upkeep price:

(B) ust
(O) ut
(A) nother
(T) housand