Unearthed Arcana Unearthed Arcana: Spirits Bard and Undeath Warlock

We have a new UA release with two subclasses. The College of Spirits Bard is a fortune teller or spirit medium type character with a big random effect table. Meanwhile the Undeath Pact Warlock is a a do-over of the Undying Pact Warlock.

 

[Jeff Albertson]

It's your choice to think what you do. I don't have to agree with your assessment, however.

Nothing to do with accessing, it's simply not up to you to explain racism ("academic" or not) and challenge moderation.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Personally, I would consider a player who was "good at the game" is someone who can immerse themselves in a character and perform them entertainingly.

There is certainly more than one way to be "good at the game", however, and mechanical acumen is just as valid a source of fun as character immersion.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I'm skeptical.

Sure, there are combinations of abilities that require multiclassing. And I can easily imagine somebody complaining that "my concept can't be fulfilled without ability X."

But I'm skeptical that there are narrative concepts that can only be realized through multiclassing.

So how about some examples?

Why does it matter if it can literally only be realized through multiclassing?

Some concepts aren't going to be satisfying for the player without multiclassing. In an edition where MC builds absolutely will not break the game in any way, why do you care?

 

[Blue]

I'm skeptical.

Sure, there are combinations of abilities that require multiclassing. And I can easily imagine somebody complaining that "my concept can't be fulfilled without ability X."

But I'm skeptical that there are narrative concepts that can only be realized through multiclassing.

So how about some examples?

Absolutely, I would be glad to. The classes really are limiting.

Let's take some well known literary characters, like Kvothe from Rothfuss' Kingkiller Chronicles. Or FitzChivalry from multiple trilogies from Robin Hobb.

If you're looking for more universal tropes instead of specific characters, about a year ago I have a thread looking for archetypes that could not be realized under 5e, but in addition to actual archetypes lots of people posted but ideas from earlier editions, many of which can be realized in 5e through multiclassing.

D&D 5E - Archetypes to add to 5e

While talking about the most recent UA, Jeremy Crawford said they have covered most of the standard D&D tropes at this point in the editions life. In a discussion about that UA here it seemed many disagreed with that statement. So, what archetypes do you think needs some subclass support to...

www.enworld.org

Best of all is if you can see for yourself. List your top ten favorite literary or movie characters. Put them in the most obvious D&D class. See if they have iconic abilities that aren't addressed. Many should, they aren't limited to the fetters of having to fit into a class.

 

[Azzy]

Nothing to do with accessing, it's simply not up to you to explain racism ("academic" or not) and challenge moderation.

Since there is no immutable law against attempting to provide perspective to another poster's post when one believes that the poster was being misunderstood, it's not up to you to tell me what I can or cannot do. You are not a moderator.

Also, my post was also not meant as a challenge of moderation, but as an attempt to be informative. If you don't like that, that's entirely on you and not my problem. You obviously have some beef with me, but you're going to have to either let it go or stew on it because I'm not going to be beholden to your ire.

 

[Marandahir]

Why does it matter if it can literally only be realized through multiclassing?

Some concepts aren't going to be satisfying for the player without multiclassing. In an edition where MC builds absolutely will not break the game in any way, why do you care?

The issue is that the MC system is not loved by many tables as it's complicated and feels like a trade off (not getting those 9th level spells or capstone features, etc). Same thing with feats - many tables prefer simpler.

So if there's ways to do MC without MC, they should be strived for. That means MC-lite feats (last month's UA) and MC-lite subclasses (Eldritch Knight Fighter, Arcane Trickster Rogue, Scout Rogue, Wild Soul Barbarian, Bladesinger Wizard, Divine Soul Sorcerer, Celestial Patron Warlock, etc).

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The issue is that the MC system is not loved by many tables as it's complicated and feels like a trade off (not getting those 9th level spells or capstone features, etc). Same thing with feats - many tables prefer simpler.

So if there's ways to do MC without MC, they should be strived for. That means MC-lite feats (last month's UA) and MC-lite subclasses (Eldritch Knight Fighter, Arcane Trickster Rogue, Scout Rogue, Wild Soul Barbarian, Bladesinger Wizard, Divine Soul Sorcerer, Celestial Patron Warlock, etc).

Sure, but that feels like a separate conversation from what I replied to, which was a challenge of multiclass character concepts.

Enough people like MC characters that they have to take it into account when making new options. Alternatives are great, and I vote them up whenever the opportunity arises, but MC is also totally valid and a good part of the game.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

So, a lot of people have mentioned multiclass characters with the Undead Warlock. Any ideas for the Spirit Bards? Maybe with the Stars Druids, as a character who speaks with the stars and spirits of the dead?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

So, a lot of people have mentioned multiclass characters with the Undead Warlock. Any ideas for the Spirit Bards? Maybe with the Stars Druids, as a character who speaks with the stars and spirits of the dead?

Spirit/Totem Bardarian?

 

[Micah Sweet]

Sure, but that feels like a separate conversation from what I replied to, which was a challenge of multiclass character concepts.

Enough people like MC characters that they have to take it into account when making new options. Alternatives are great, and I vote them up whenever the opportunity arises, but MC is also totally valid and a good part of the game.

If they were taking it into account, I doubt we'd have this many multiclassing-related complaints. You can adjust threats to account for more or less powerful PCs. It's much harder to adjust other aspects of the game, particularly player-side options.