D&D 5E Unhappy with Psionics requiring Far Realms flavor

[Moorcrys]

Make your displeasure known in the survey.

I'm personally a fan of them giving you a number of flavor options, referencing various settings if need be - "psionics could be this OR it could be that. In Eberron it's this and in Dark Sun it's that..."

Give new players a number of different possibilities to place psionics in their games and satisfy the folks who want psionics to be the setting specific kind that they remember.

 

[Mistwell]

I don't like the far realms connection either. It makes the entire concept less interesting to me. The Force is a far more compelling source of power than Lovecrafts stuff. At least make that origin more optional, or just one of multiple sources.

 

[Fralex]

I keep hearing this claim, but as far as I can tell it doesn't require Far Realms flavor. The Great Old One pact requires more Far Realm than this does. All the PDF did was mention the Far Realm as one way people get psionics. Then it listed some other ways it happens, like the gods abandoning Athas or even just discovering the technique on your own. It makes sense to at least mention the Far Realm since the previous edition made it a big part of the lore. But that was definitely not all that section of the PDF talked about.

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Far Realms means mothing to me or my group.
As it goes, "mystic" seems ok as a title and fits with D&D speak more than Psion does.
As I understand it the Far Realms = the Squamish haunt of the elder gods and the colour out of space, is that right? In which case, the correct name (as far as everyone else is concerned anyway) would be "Gibbering Mad Bastard", right? The mystic him/herself can call themself what they like but to the general populace they'll be Lovecraftian investigators gone loopy. And possibly possessed of more webbing between their fingers than is entirely necessary.
Not sure that is an entirely comfy fit with D&D myself (though interesting to try).
And as someone else said, if Cthulhoid in nature, um, why the GOO Warlock?
Ah well. Psionics have always been a bit meh for me anyway (in D&D at least).
Reskin it however you like, though. That is the beauty of 5e. Discard that which does not fit and say it's the untapped portion of the brain being awoken with no reference to chitinous chitterings from inside the walls.
If I'm wrong about the Cthulhu flavour by the way, sorry. But not having the background to explain the Far Realms I'm just picking up on the vibe it's giving me.
Or perhaps it's just Nyarlathotep whispering in my mind again.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Far Realms means mothing to me or my group.
As it goes, "mystic" seems ok as a title and fits with D&D speak more than Psion does.

Nod. Back in the day, I made psionics into a School of Mysticism. I guess I've changed my mind somewhere in the last 25 years, but I understand wanting to purge the sci-fi a little, though I'm no longer so fixated on it, myself, and am fine with other's taking psionics that way (or introducing rayguns or whatever), if they like.

As I understand it the Far Realms = the Squamish haunt of the elder gods and the colour out of space, is that right?

Yes.

In which case, the correct name (as far as everyone else is concerned anyway) would be "Gibbering Mad Bastard", right?

Not so much: the idea, as I understand it, is that psionics arise in opposition to the forces of the Far Realm, rather than deriving power from the Far Realm, itself.

The mystic him/herself can call themself what they like but to the general populace they'll be Lovecraftian investigators gone loopy. And possibly possessed of more webbing between their fingers than is entirely necessary.
Not sure that is an entirely comfy fit with D&D myself (though interesting to try).
And as someone else said, if Cthulhoid in nature, um, why the GOO Warlock?

D&D does borrow from Lovecraft just as it does from a wide range of other not-exactly-fantasy sources. Mind Flayers and the like go all the way back, for instance.

And the GOO Warlock, unlike the Psion(icist)/Awakened-Mystic, /is/ drawing power from the Far Realms, and thus, maybe influenced by it the way you're talking about, Insmouth look and all that.

So, really, it's kinda like the difference between, say, a Paladin and an Infernal Warlock. One's opposing diabolical forces, the other is using them, even if not actively/consciously advancing their aims.

 

[Saplatt]

Significant excluded middle here, of those of us who couldn't care less whether or not the fluff ties it to any particular setting.

 

[Jester David]

Psioncs has very little inherent flavour. In past editions (1-3e) it's just been presented as a new rule set. "Here's psionics. You have to figure out how to work it into your world. Go!" 4e introduced the idea of the Far Realm influencing things. Which doesn't fit all worlds, but works in a generic sense.

The thing is, some people need the help. Some DMs might look at psionics and draw a blank on lore. Giving something -anything- in terms of lore helps them work the rules into their setting. If they like the Far Realm hook then the work is done for them. If they hate it, they have a starting point to work away from.

The thing is, ZERO of the Far Realm story touches the crunch. It's all confined to a single small column and doesn't extended beyond that section. (Look for yourself, or do a ctrl-F search for "Realm".) Don't like that story? Take a black sharpie to it. Bam, gone! Or cut-and-paste the the document into a Word, delete that section, and then print.

DMs are busy. They have entire worlds and adventures to create, four or five people to entertain for hours at a time. It's a hard thankless job. Anything that makes it easier is a plus. Not having to make 100% of the lore is a big help. If they want to *choose* to ignore the lore and do their own thing, then that's cool. It doesn't create any more work than they would have done anyway. But if they don't want to write the big explanation for why psionics exists then it saves them a tonn of time and unnecessary work.

 

[Jester David]

Even then, its fairly minor; psionics is a result of thinking in dimensions beyond our own. The far realm is a good example of this, but I doubt it will be the only one. I'm sure that Eberron will retie psionics back to the plane of dreams again, for example. Its just a generic idea in leiu of a more specific one. (See also: Dark Sun and gods, Dragonlance and mages).

Re-read the intro stuff, it calls out Psionics as a reaction to Xoriat, the realm of chaos when psionics was in the realm of Dal Quor before. Hopefully, they fix said oversight, but it wouldn't be the first time Eberron's cosmology got pooped on.

A sidebar of how psionics works in different worlds while providing some alternate fluff/origins would be a sweet idea. Especially as an alternative to trying to force existing worlds to conform to the Far Realm backstory.

Changing and retconning settings to match a new assumed status quo is a mistake.

 

[Patrick McGill]

Psioncs has very little inherent flavour.

I don't necessarily agree with that, though it may have been true in certain editions. To me psionics brings to mind the pulp sci fi and fantasy conventions of the 20s-40s, of authors like Edward Rice Burroughs and L Ron Hubbard (pre cult). I think this has been lost as the game has aged of course. I think it's high time that they cleaved back to those old influences and, well, let the freak flag fly on psionics and the sword and planet gonzo sci-fi it hails from. I think they can do it without being cheesey of course. I mean, Dark Sun is to me the quintessential psionic campaign. It's a sword and planet world for certain.

 

[Mercule]

If I could have named the one thing to avoid in creating psionics for 5E, it would have been tying it to the Far Realms -- actually, there's an 80ish page thread where I said that a couple dozen times.

So, yeah, I'm unhappy. It's stupid and I hate it. I don't really even want to use the Far Realms, but I like psionics. Please don't confuse my new players and make life more difficult for me. Likewise, if I'm playing a psion in someone else's game, please don't have the default flavor be something unsavory. Also, there is no Far Realms in Dark Sun, so why did you just do that?

This is unambiguous, and bad: "Psionics indirectly originates from the Far Realm."

This is better, but still not quite right: "Psionics is more common in worlds where the bounds of reality have been twisted and warped to stray far from the baseline D&D setting."

Let me suggest the following lead paragraph to the Otherworldly Power section:

Not every D&D world features psionics to the same extent. Psionics is most common in places where the bounds of reality have been twisted and warped. The realm of Athas in the Dark Sun campaign setting is the iconic example of a world where psionics is common. The gods are absent, magic has been twisted into an ecological scourge, and the common threads that bind many worlds of D&D have been sundered. By contrast, the world of Eberron is a setting where the bound of reality have been tested but not fully broken. Psionics is not as pervasive in Eberron as in Athas, but the influence of the otherworldly realms of Xoriat and Dal Quor make it a known and studied art. One common catalyst to psionics is the Far Realm, a dimension outside the bounds of the known multiverse. In other settings, psionics may be the result of magical experimentation, exposure to artifacts, or the nascent god-soul possessed by some mortals.

Take everything else about the Far Realms and put it into a sidebar. There's no loss of content or DM aid, but it does take out the hardwiring. (WotC legal: Please, feel free to use the above or some variation of it w/o need for compensation or attribution. I'd rather just have a better product.)

As far as mechanics go, it looks nice. I really like it, which surprised the snot out of me, considering the second big way to screw up psionics (IMO) was to include the "psionics are different" option as the default. I'd still really prefer "psionics are the same", but the way the sample powers are structured are enough like a Monk's ki that it's tolerable. Tolerable, but not great. Easy enough to house rule, though. Tremorsense and seize the initiative are easy enough to see as mundane-ish, but broken will and psionic weapon should cease to function in an anti-magic zone and be dispelable.