Unwritten DMing rules: the use of dice

[Celebrim]

There is a practical way, and that's for the DM to roll physical dice at home rather than rolling on roll20, for rolls the players aren't supposed to see.

That's how our DM does it, anyway.

I mostly play on Discord these days and when I want to conceal a roll I whisper to the dice bot and get a private reply. I'd be really surprised if there isn't a similar concept on Roll20.

But I also do have dice on my desk I can roll in a pinch or if it would be faster than sending a message to the dice app.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

You use dice to be surprised. If you don't want to be surprised, don't roll the dice.

If people start dying, prior choices have been made that led to that.

 

[aramis erak]

Hello, i just wanted to hear the ideas/experiences on some points about what is your though on the use of dice to reach top level of DMing.

1. Do you always keep hidden the dice results? If not, in which circumstances you disclose them?

I roll in the open except for random encounter determination.
And that only when it feels appropriate.

2. Do you cheat to keep "balance" or "consistency"?

No. If I'm going to the dice, I'm letting the dice have a voice... which requires me to have at least two outcomes in mind before going to the dice

3. Do you tend to "overthrow" dice so that you have some results in advance?

No. I only go to dice when the results make a difference in how/if things happen. That quite often requires defining which of the fail states in mind to pick; if I don't have at least one fail state in mind, no roll.
If I can't think of a plausible success state, but the player insists on the attempt, I determine which fail state with the roll. But I tend to discourage such. "You really want to try that?"

 

[overgeeked]

Hello, i just wanted to hear the ideas/experiences on some points about what is your though on the use of dice to reach top level of DMing.

There's no such thing. You're always learning.

1. Do you always keep hidden the dice results? If not, in which circumstances you disclose them?

No. During combat, all dice are rolled in the open. Anything that the player could metagame is rolled by the referee behind the screen. For example, searching for traps or secret doors. If the player rolls low, they can see the dice and will inevitably metagame/cheese the situation or another player will jump in and miraculously decide to search too...for literally no in-game reason. So that stuff is always rolled behind the screen by the referee. I roll dice for lots of things. If the result is something the players will know, then they find out when it comes up in the game. If the result is something the players wouldn't know, then they don't find out.

2. Do you cheat to keep "balance" or "consistency"? Why and in which specific circumstances? Pay attention, please: this question doesn't aim to discuss about adjusting results for railroading purposes.

No. Never. It's not the referee's job to put their thumb on the scales one way or the other. The referee's job is to play the world in response to the players' decisions and the characters' actions combined with the results of the dice. If the world is coherent, the referee's done their job. If the world is incoherent, the referee has failed. If the rules need to be changed to create a coherent world, the referee should change them. Telling the players up front if possible. Pausing the game to talk it over if necessary.

3. Do you tend to "overthrow" dice so that you have some results in advance? It happens a DM needs to have a result without showing to the players that he rolls the dice... Should you not "overthow", how do you manage to have a "secret roll"?

No. Never. If the dice are rolled, the result is respected. If there's a result the referee want ahead of time, they simply decide. Rolling when you already know the outcome is deceptive and a waste of time.

 

[GMMichael]

Hello, i just wanted to hear the ideas/experiences on some points about what is your though on the use of dice to reach top level of DMing.

Well. You asked the right guy for top-level DMing /snark

1. Do you always keep hidden the dice results? If not, in which circumstances you disclose them?

The die stays hidden until the PC has rolled her die, if I want to add extra tension. The reveal (more or less) conveys how the action went.

2. Do you cheat to keep "balance" or "consistency"? Why and in which specific circumstances? Pay attention, please: this question doesn't aim to discuss about adjusting results for railroading purposes.

GMs can't cheat.

3. Do you tend to "overthrow" dice so that you have some results in advance? It happens a DM needs to have a result without showing to the players that he rolls the dice... Should you not "overthow", how do you manage to have a "secret roll"?

I'm hearing "pre-roll" here in place of "overthrow," and no, I don't see the point. Because 1) If I don't want to roll, I can just Take Half of the highest roll, and 2) If I have an outcome determined in advance, there's no die roll required.

I don't need to make secret rolls, because the base d20 roll is always 10, plus whatever the Difficulty seems to be...

Maybe the PCs are in a random encounter that I don't want them to know is random? Ask a player to roll the die for a different reason. Then use the result for your own purposes.

 

[Lanefan]

No. Never. If the dice are rolled, the result is respected. If there's a result the referee want ahead of time, they simply decide. Rolling when you already know the outcome is deceptive and a waste of time.

I'm not sure that's what was being asked here.

I read the question as being to do with "fake" rolls, where you roll dice when you don't need to in order to hide the roll you really do need to make, in order to stop the meta "Uh-oh, the DM's rolling dice, something's going on!" piece. The only roll whose outcome you pay attention to is the one you roll for real; the rest are ignored, despite appearances.

An example: party is sneaking into a castle. I know there's a hidden guard at the top of the stairs; but they don't, and so I'll go through the motions and roll some dice when they go in the door, when they pass through the entry hall, when they go along the main passage toward the great hall, and when they go up the stairs. The only one of those rolls that in fact matters is the last one as that's when the guard might come into play, the rest are just for show and to keep the tension up.

 

[overgeeked]

I'm not sure that's what was being asked here.

I read the question as being to do with "fake" rolls, where you roll dice when you don't need to in order to hide the roll you really do need to make, in order to stop the meta "Uh-oh, the DM's rolling dice, something's going on!" piece. The only roll whose outcome you pay attention to is the one you roll for real; the rest are ignored, despite appearances.

An example: party is sneaking into a castle. I know there's a hidden guard at the top of the stairs; but they don't, and so I'll go through the motions and roll some dice when they go in the door, when they pass through the entry hall, when they go along the main passage toward the great hall, and when they go up the stairs. The only one of those rolls that in fact matters is the last one as that's when the guard might come into play, the rest are just for show and to keep the tension up.

Yeah, I can see that reading of the question. It sounds like you and I are about the same in that. Not every roll is a "real" roll. Sometimes the referee rolls to get the players' attention, sometimes the referee rolls to hear the math rocks go clickity clack.

 

[Li Shenron]

1. Do you always keep hidden the dice results?

Usually yes. I like the idea that players can't immediately tell if a monster succeeds by skill or luck, or fails by lack of either.

If not, in which circumstances you disclose them?

Whenever I feel like. Sometimes a monster's skills have become obvious and I choose to roll in the open so that players can also double-check.

2. Do you cheat to keep "balance" or "consistency"? Why and in which specific circumstances?

No, in no circumstance. I believe that a DM's belief to keep balance against the dice is a delusion.

3. Do you tend to "overthrow" dice so that you have some results in advance? It happens a DM needs to have a result without showing to the players that he rolls the dice... Should you not "overthow", how do you manage to have a "secret roll"?

If you mean roll resolutions or effects in advance, then no. I don't see the fun in that, I roll the dice (and ask players to) because I am undecided about what the results should be, but rolling it outside the game instead of during the game would feel to me like reading the plot before watching a movie.

This doesn't apply to rolling on random tables when designing campaign setting elements (such as quests, locations, NPCs...) and wanting a bit of randomness to avoid gravitating towards my favourites.

In the rare event I might be afraid that hearing me roll a dice behind my DM screen might signal the players that something's happening, I can resort to a few silent tricks: look at the current result shown by the nearest dice, open a book and read the page number, enter a random number in a calculator and do a square root a few times then look at the last digits... all of which give pretty much random results without making it too obvious what you're doing.