Use Magic Device and a Rogue's Skill Mastery

[molonel]

The Skill Mastery special ability, which a Rogue could choose at 10th, 13th, 16th, or 19th level, allows a Rogue to " take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent her from doing so" while using a certain number of skills selected by the Rogue (3 + her Intelligence modifier).

Now, the question:

Can you choose Use Magic Device as one of these skills?

My ruling was no, because while the ability allows you to take 10 even under adverse conditions, it does not allow you to take 10 on a skill which specifically says, "You cannot take 10 with this skill."

Thoughts?

 

[BSF]

I would agree. Any skill where you can neer take 10 is a skill where the random factor is important.

 

[Tonus]

Technically, you *could* choose Use Magic Device as one of the skills -- but it would be a completely wasted choice. You can't take 10 on Use Magic Device because magic is unpredictable, so it really doesn't matter whether you are able to be distracted or not.

 

[ARandomGod]

The Skill Mastery special ability, which a Rogue could choose at 10th, 13th, 16th, or 19th level, allows a Rogue to " take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent her from doing so" while using a certain number of skills selected by the Rogue (3 + her Intelligence modifier).

Now, the question:

Can you choose Use Magic Device as one of these skills?

My ruling was no, because while the ability allows you to take 10 even under adverse conditions, it does not allow you to take 10 on a skill which specifically says, "You cannot take 10 with this skill."

Thoughts?

I'd rule that you could, unless it's specifically ruled against.

Lemme look at the two rules...
Yup, I'd allow it.
I also know that others on EnWorld have allowed it, because I've seen this discussed before... In fact, often UMD is THE reason that was taken.

And besides, you have to be at least tenth level of rogue before you get asccess to this. It's not like it's a general feat or anything.

 

[DanMcS]

The Skill Mastery special ability, which a Rogue could choose at 10th, 13th, 16th, or 19th level, allows a Rogue to " take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent her from doing so" while using a certain number of skills selected by the Rogue (3 + her Intelligence modifier).

Now, the question:

Can you choose Use Magic Device as one of these skills?

No. Stress and distractions are not what prevent you from taking 10 with UMD. Skill Mastery would provide no benefit with UMD.

 

[molonel]

Lemme look at the two rules...
Yup, I'd allow it.
I also know that others on EnWorld have allowed it, because I've seen this discussed before... In fact, often UMD is THE reason that was taken.

Here's how a friend of mine put it:

1.) Unless otherwise noted, all skills allow a character to Take 10, except under certain conditions.
2.) Skill Mastery allows you to modify the Conditions under which you may take 10.
3.) Use Magic Device explicitly states you cannot Take 10

"You cannot take 10 with this skill" seems pretty definitive. Skill Mastery does not provide you with the ability to take 10 with skills that specifically dictate you cannot take 10. It only modifies the conditions under which you may use a skill where you are allowed to take 10.

And besides, you have to be at least tenth level of rogue before you get asccess to this. It's not like it's a general feat or anything.

That's fine reasoning for a house rule. I wanted to know if I'd correctly understood the Rules as Written, and from what I've seen here, I think I did.