Using cards to replace dice

[Asmor]

Here's an idea I just had to use cards to replace a d20 (though the same technique could be used with little modification for any die type). Take a standard deck of playing cards, and get rid of the kings, queens and jokers, leaving you with Ace through 10. Shuffle that deck, and then draw every time you need a die roll.

Red cards add 10, so a 7 of hearts or diamonds is actually a 17.

And thus, with your 40 cards, you have two of every number. Randomness is preserved, but luck is somewhat more even. No longer can you roll consistently well, but nor can you roll consistently poorly.

There is one big problem with this approach, though. It could potentially get a big predictable as the pack thins... Which may or may not be a good thing. In particular, it seems likely that you might draw all your high cards early and then you're stuck with 10-12 more draws that you know are going to suck. That's just not fun.

So here's my solution to that: Shuffle in a joker (or maybe even 2). Treat the joker as a 20 (so you've actually got 3 chances out of 43 of rolling a 20, and shuffle the whole deck whenever you draw one.

This is good for the following reasons. You never know when you're going to draw a joker, taking a lot of the predictability out, and it guarantees that you'll always have something to look forward to pulling. Even if you're down to 12 cards, which you know 11 of are low black cards, there's still the chance that you could pull that 20 and succeed spectacularly!

I recommend using this only for the rolls that really matter, otherwise players could try to game the system by making a lot of inconsequential rolls just to hasten a reshuffle. Let's say a rule of thumb is that you always use it during combat, and you only use it outside of combat if there are consequences for failure (GM's discretion).

 

[Delta]

Your first paragraph needs the key phrase "without replacement" to make it totally clear what you mean (i.e., generally no reshuffles between draws). By the end I figured it out, but that should be a critical part of the initial description.

I just finished grading a big stack of statistics final exams, so maybe I'm a bit touchy on that issue right now. YMMV.

 

[Whisper72]

Well, personally, I love that bouncy sound of dice rolling and the uncertainty as the die flips just one more side before finally stopping, resulting in that collective 'ooohhh...'

The card system would be a good idea though if you play in a place where dice rolling is not possible, either because of space / instability constraints (playing in a car, on a boat etc.) or when the noise of the bouncing dice is too loud (sleeping baby in the room next door or somesuch...)

Just my 2cp

 

[cougent]

Here's an idea I just had to use cards to replace a d20 (though the same technique could be used with little modification for any die type). Take a standard deck of playing cards, and get rid of the kings, queens and jokers, leaving you with Ace through 10. Shuffle that deck, and then draw every time you need a die roll.

Red cards add 10, so a 7 of hearts or diamonds is actually a 17.

And thus, with your 40 cards, you have two of every number. Randomness is preserved, but luck is somewhat more even. No longer can you roll consistently well, but nor can you roll consistently poorly.

There is one big problem with this approach, though. It could potentially get a big predictable as the pack thins... Which may or may not be a good thing. In particular, it seems likely that you might draw all your high cards early and then you're stuck with 10-12 more draws that you know are going to suck. That's just not fun.

So here's my solution to that: Shuffle in a joker (or maybe even 2). Treat the joker as a 20 (so you've actually got 3 chances out of 43 of rolling a 20, and shuffle the whole deck whenever you draw one.

This is good for the following reasons. You never know when you're going to draw a joker, taking a lot of the predictability out, and it guarantees that you'll always have something to look forward to pulling. Even if you're down to 12 cards, which you know 11 of are low black cards, there's still the chance that you could pull that 20 and succeed spectacularly!

I recommend using this only for the rolls that really matter, otherwise players could try to game the system by making a lot of inconsequential rolls just to hasten a reshuffle. Let's say a rule of thumb is that you always use it during combat, and you only use it outside of combat if there are consequences for failure (GM's discretion).

There is only a minor technical fallacy in your idea, and it is in bold above. What you have actually done is create a system and removed randomness from the possible outcomes. true randomness is not an equal spread of numbers in a designated set of roles, true randomness is just the same potential for every number on every role. The system that you are creating has diminishing chances for any number as that number is drawn, and totally eliminates it after 2 draws. In true random rolling you could potentially roll 3, 4, 10 of any given number in a row, in a system you could not.

Instead of using the joker to skew the result of a 20, you could simply use it to shuffle the deck again. That would reduce the predictability of the system, but it would still be a system, not random.

It is a fine substitution method for situations where rolling dice might be impractical, but it does have limitations.

 

[Felon]

One of the versions of the Marvel Superheroes RPG used a similar idea. Attacker and defender would use cards from their hands in a sort of tug-of-war. I thought it worked rather well, as it replaced the randomness of the die with tactical resource management.

 

[Garnfellow]

This basic idea -- and I think it's a pretty nifty one -- is outlined in Green Ronin's Advanced Gamemaster's Manual. An added twist is that all players and the DM are given 5 cards at a time, allowing each person to choose when to play high cards and low cards. When all 5 are played, the character draws 5 more.

I haven't tried this technique, but my hunch is that it would work very well in a story-driven game, allowing participants to play their cards for more dramatic effect.

One could also imagine a whole slew of accompanying mechanics: feats or spells that allow someone to draw more than 5 cards, discard a bad card, and so on.

 

[Aeolius]

Did no one use their chits, from Basic D&D?

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

This basic idea -- and I think it's a pretty nifty one -- is outlined in Green Ronin's Advanced Gamemaster's Manual. An added twist is that all players and the DM are given 5 cards at a time, allowing each person to choose when to play high cards and low cards. When all 5 are played, the character draws 5 more.

I haven't tried this technique, but my hunch is that it would work very well in a story-driven game, allowing participants to play their cards for more dramatic effect.

One could also imagine a whole slew of accompanying mechanics: feats or spells that allow someone to draw more than 5 cards, discard a bad card, and so on.

Sounds interesting! Just hope you don't get 5 bad cards.

 

[Delta]

What you have actually done is create a system and removed randomness from the possible outcomes. true randomness is not an equal spread of numbers in a designated set of roles, true randomness is just the same potential for every number on every role.

I don't think there's an accepted definition of "true randomness" the way you describe. Drawing cards without replacement definitely qualifies as a "random sample". Playing cards are widely accepted as a "physical randomisation device".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_sample

 

[Woas]

Building on the using cards as hero-points idea...

I used to play Magic: The Gathering. I don't anymore. What if you took some of the action-sounding cards like Blood-Lust, Aspect of Wolf, Jump... or just take some and write your own title on them. And then make a sizeable community deck out of them. Players draw a number of cards or maybe the GM gives them out as rewards like hero points. Players can use the cards for specific effects when they need 'em or even use them on allies if need be.
So for example, you find yourself surrounded by enemies and separated from your team mates. Play blood-lust and you get the equivalent of a barbarian rage for a turn or two.