Vancian Magic - Yes or No?
- Thread starter Dark Jezter
- Start date
Trainz
Explorer
I would like the Sorceror and Wizard replaced by something in between. Spontaneous casting, but with more spells known than the Sorceror's. Maybe give a choice of 3 utilitarian spells (Dispel Magic, Detect Magic, Remove Curse, and the like), 2 generic (False Life, Invisibility), and 2 attack (Fireball, Cone of Cold) at each spell level...
But then, I also beleive it could snow in hell...
But then, I also beleive it could snow in hell...
The_lurkeR
First Post
Voted NO
Been with D&D since the beginning but still always thought the magic system was klunky. I know they've tried to make it more flexible of late, but it's still patches on a poor design.
My preferred replacement would be a "mana point" based system.
Briefly...
1) You know all the spells in your spellbook.
2) Each spell you cast has a cost, say for reference 1 mana point for what is now a 1st level spell, 2 for a second.
3) You gain mana points to your pool as you advance levels, and recover mana points like hit points (perhaps faster 1 per hour, 2 per hour of rest etc.)
It would allow for things like meta-magic feats much more fluidly. You could supercharge a spell by spending double the mana-points, or even design the spell so that it does 1d6 per mana point spent etc. You could also do things like take subdual damage on a point for point basis when you've burned through all your mana and still need to cast that last gasp spell. (ie you have 2 mp left and need to cast a 4 mp cost spell, use your last 2 mp and take 2 pt's of subdual damage to get it off.)
Ok maybe that wasn't so brief, ( oh well I can houserule until they adopt the system in 4th ed.)
Been with D&D since the beginning but still always thought the magic system was klunky. I know they've tried to make it more flexible of late, but it's still patches on a poor design.
My preferred replacement would be a "mana point" based system.
Briefly...
1) You know all the spells in your spellbook.
2) Each spell you cast has a cost, say for reference 1 mana point for what is now a 1st level spell, 2 for a second.
3) You gain mana points to your pool as you advance levels, and recover mana points like hit points (perhaps faster 1 per hour, 2 per hour of rest etc.)
It would allow for things like meta-magic feats much more fluidly. You could supercharge a spell by spending double the mana-points, or even design the spell so that it does 1d6 per mana point spent etc. You could also do things like take subdual damage on a point for point basis when you've burned through all your mana and still need to cast that last gasp spell. (ie you have 2 mp left and need to cast a 4 mp cost spell, use your last 2 mp and take 2 pt's of subdual damage to get it off.)
Ok maybe that wasn't so brief, ( oh well I can houserule until they adopt the system in 4th ed.)
Sir Whiskers
First Post
A'koss said:
Agreed, though I have no problem if vancian magic is kept as one option, even the primary option, so long as it's not the only option. And regardless of the system used, magic needs to be toned down in any future edition (IMO).
Last edited:
RedShirtNo5
First Post
"Turjan found a musty portfolio, turned the heavy pages to the spell the Sage had shown him, the Call to the Violent Cloud. He stared down at the characters and they burned with an urgent power, pressing off the page as if frantic to leave the dark solitude of the book."Tuzenbach said:
Jack Vance, The Dying Earth (1950), Chapter I
"Mazirian stroked his chin. ... Later, when black night lay across the forest, he would seek through his books for spells to guard him through the unpredictable glades. They would be poignant corrosive spells, of such a nature that one would daunt the brain of an ordinary man and two render him mad. Mazirian, by dint of stringent exercise, could encompass four of the most formidible, or six of the lesser spells."
Jack Vance, The Dying Earth (1950), Chapter II
I like Vancian magic.
-RedShirt
Ycore Rixle
First Post
Have to go with Merric and Krieg on this one. I have no problems with Vancian magic: it's simple, easy to use, and chock-full of D&D history and flavor. As Peter Adkison pointed out at the dawn of 3E, D&D has its own history and flavor now, and it's important to be true to that.
That said (sorry for going into /hijack mode here), my bone of contention with D&D magic is that it would not generate anything close to the typical medieval setting. If magic were as pervasive and powerful as the core rules present, I think you'd be much more likely to have either a magic-tech world or a post-magical apocalypse world. This is why Eberron is so interesting to me; I think they finally may be making a world that makes sense according to the D&D magic rules. We will see!
That said (sorry for going into /hijack mode here), my bone of contention with D&D magic is that it would not generate anything close to the typical medieval setting. If magic were as pervasive and powerful as the core rules present, I think you'd be much more likely to have either a magic-tech world or a post-magical apocalypse world. This is why Eberron is so interesting to me; I think they finally may be making a world that makes sense according to the D&D magic rules. We will see!
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