Vista: Get it now or wait?

[Aeolius]

I wonder if Vista will actually push a critical mass of people to Linux or perhaps Macs?

http://images.apple.com/movies/us/apple/getamac/apple-getamac-security_480x376.mov

 

[Plane Sailing]

Last weekend I fdisk'd vista and reinstalled winXP and apps. goodness me, how my PC flies now! I really like to see it idling at 'only' 235Mb of memory in use rather than the 980Mb that vista was using! I like the old explorer much better too.

My personal feeling is that the XP ui is better thought out than the Vista UI - which is strange considering the effort put into vista (but then again, maybe not - this blog from the designer of the vista shutdown button is illuminating http://moishelettvin.blogspot.com/2006/11/windows-shutdown-crapfest.html)

Cheers

 

[Psionicist]

Reading this thread makes me happy. People are informed about the drawbacks!

Windows Vista is a paradigm shift that's for sure. Not using Vista is the statement you want to be in charge of your own computer and not hand over control to an unknown entity.

I have this small conspiracy theory Windows Vista is not really the product Microsoft is selling. Douglas Adams once said few businesses know their market, or at least hide it. Epson is not in the market of selling inkjet printers. Epson is in the market of selling ink cartridages. [Your TV network of choice] is not in the market of selling TV channel-access to customers. They are in the market of selling viewers to advertisors.

I think Vista is the platform from which Microsoft will base all their future incomes, and they might as well give it away for free just to get the restriction techniques installed on as many computers as possible. Once Microsoft has the userbase and the locked down/"protected" distribution channel, they can sell the real products. Probably subscription services (so for example you pay to use Office or whatnot for a month a time and then the subscription expires you can't edit yoiur document or something) as well as music and movies. And license fees to other companies.

Not long ago Hollywood admitted up front the restriction techniques (copy protection etc) were not about piracy but control. Related: About half a year ago I read on Ars Technica Warner Bros want to be able to charge customers for fast-forwarding or skipping the ads/trailers in the beginning of DVD:s. Vista can make this happen.

The disturbing thing is Microsoft knows very well (in fact they are responsible) "the masses" has never been in control of their computers, so in a few years when they are using their Vista box and they get a popup stating they are doing something forbidden, they won't be able to tell this is an artificial limitation.

This is not what technology is about.

 

[borc killer]

Last weekend I fdisk'd vista and reinstalled winXP and apps. goodness me, how my PC flies now! I really like to see it idling at 'only' 235Mb of memory in use rather than the 980Mb that vista was using!

Just so you know that is not how much memory Vista took up running on your system. That was an app called SuperFetch and it is actually one of the best features in Vista. Vista automatically loads programs you use often into the available system memory so when you access them it does not need to access the hard drive. This is the opposite of how XP works it is basically a more advanced version of how OSX handles system memory. That is not to say that Vista does not take up more system recourses… but not as much as people lead you to believe.

If you actually care to read about it AnandTech has a good article: http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=2917&p=1

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Good lord, this place is starting to sound like /.

 

[drothgery]

Windows Vista is a paradigm shift that's for sure. Not using Vista is the statement you want to be in charge of your own computer and not hand over control to an unknown entity.

Not using Vista is a statement that you use a Mac, don't plan on buying a new PC anytime soon, or spend too much time reading paranoid conspiracy theories on Slashdot.

 

[borc killer]

http://images.apple.com/movies/us/apple/getamac/apple-getamac-security_480x376.mov

I am sorry but do people see the irony in those spots? That security feature was stolen from Mac… and has been implemented just as well, if not better in some places (and worse in others). I am forever entering user account information on Macs to do even the slightest things… maybe you people just don’t use Macs in a limited user environment. And as someone that has to use both systems every day and support users using all three: Vista is darn nice.

Just to give you an idea, my group has a little over 450 systems we take care of. Roughly 350 of them are PCs running XPsp2, 50 with Vista Enterprise, 20 various distributions of Linux and the rest OS10.4 (broken between G4s and G5s with a few ibooks). My group spends 25-40% of our time each month supporting the Mac users and hardware and about the same on linux. It is absolutely ridiculous that those people require so much more hand holding. Hell most of our new Vista users have request almost 0 support once all there software was patched up to the latest versions.

Macs are great. Great toasters. You plug it in and hit the power button and it does what the toaster manufacture told you do with it. And if that is all you need then you will be the happiest person around. But don’t try to toast bagels in it. And that is not meant as a slam just harsh reality. If you are going to change what OS you are going to use go Linux. At least with that you are allowed to do whatever you want. Just will take you 10 days to figure out how to hit ‘toast’

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Reading this thread makes me happy. People are informed about the drawbacks!

Windows Vista is a paradigm shift that's for sure. Not using Vista is the statement you want to be in charge of your own computer and not hand over control to an unknown entity.

I have this small conspiracy theory Windows Vista is not really the product Microsoft is selling. Douglas Adams once said few businesses know their market, or at least hide it. Epson is not in the market of selling inkjet printers. Epson is in the market of selling ink cartridages. [Your TV network of choice] is not in the market of selling TV channel-access to customers. They are in the market of selling viewers to advertisors.

I think Vista is the platform from which Microsoft will base all their future incomes, and they might as well give it away for free just to get the restriction techniques installed on as many computers as possible. Once Microsoft has the userbase and the locked down/"protected" distribution channel, they can sell the real products. Probably subscription services (so for example you pay to use Office or whatnot for a month a time and then the subscription expires you can't edit yoiur document or something) as well as music and movies. And license fees to other companies.

Not long ago Hollywood admitted up front the restriction techniques (copy protection etc) were not about piracy but control. Related: About half a year ago I read on Ars Technica Warner Bros want to be able to charge customers for fast-forwarding or skipping the ads/trailers in the beginning of DVD:s. Vista can make this happen.

The disturbing thing is Microsoft knows very well (in fact they are responsible) "the masses" has never been in control of their computers, so in a few years when they are using their Vista box and they get a popup stating they are doing something forbidden, they won't be able to tell this is an artificial limitation.

This is not what technology is about.

I agree with a lot of this. Especially the stuff on Hollywood, read the views of network people on DVR and how customers are cheating them by FF through commercials. That's going to change, watch or pay will be the end format. I don't know if Vista will be able to play into that though, with a DVD you can add to the cable bill for use of that functionality. I guess if you had to have a Vista subscription that tracked your usage i could work, but that would probably be a little much.

But your point is true for me. I use Linux because I don't want Microsoft or Apple telling me how to use my computer. That is the point of their trusted computing platform, so the software makers know they can trust your computer to do what they want it to do.

I mean DRM isn't there to empower you, it's there to restrict how you can use something. How is that a good thing?

 

[TwistedBishop]

But your point is true for me. I use Linux because I don't want Microsoft or Apple telling me how to use my computer. That is the point of their trusted computing platform, so the software makers know they can trust your computer to do what they want it to do.

This issue really seems to have split from "Microsoft is crippling BluRay/HD-DVD" (not true) to general Microsoft bashing. Does the internet really need more threads like that?

As to the original question, I can tell you that I'm personally sticking with XP, even when I'm about to build a new computer. I don't see any true advantage from switching to Vista at this time. Let them release whatever service packs they will, let applications catch up, let DX10 start to phase out DX9, let 2GB of ram become the minimum in PCs, then maybe in a couple years it will make sense.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

This issue really seems to have split from "Microsoft is crippling BluRay/HD-DVD" (not true) to general Microsoft bashing. Does the internet really need more threads like that?

I thought we were discussing Vista and core technologies built into it? And how is presenting a negative opinion on how a company designs a product that will have a mega impact on the industry "bashing"?

Your post is pretty much correct though in terms of needing to get Vista now. What is the benefit of it now? None that I can see.






P.S. And the internet needs more threads on it so hopefully enough people would say "we aren't going to buy products with these limitations" and force the industry to change in order to gain their financial support. A pipe dream I know....