Warforged - new benchmark for racial stats/abilities

[Graf]

I agree the new warforged is "fully powered".
I looked at it and thought it may be "overpowered"; a lot of it's powers are "resilience based", maybe the thinking is that that's less sexy?

In an ideal world I think they would have dropped the +2 saves vs ongoing damaging effects.

Honestly though, for serious damage you want bugbear. +2 Str AND Larger sized weapons? + predator's eye for a bit of an extra kick?
And dex/str is better than dex/con.

In 3.x a +2 con is 10 hit points at 10th level, and +1 fort saves.
In 4e a +2 con is 2 hit points (period!), and +1 endurance.

Not equivalent.

 

[Blackbrrd]

Remember that +2 con = 1 healing surge that might be 25% of your hit points in the last encounter of a long day.

 

[theNater]

With what I have said in mind. What race would you say is superior to Warforged when it comes to a damage focused fighter?

How about a Dragonborn? Pick up the Dragonborn Frenzy racial feat and whack yourself over the head a couple times every morning(to get yourself to bloodied). You'll have the same strength as the warforged and a constant +2 bonus to damage on all attacks.

 

[Destil]

If you accept initiative as a slightly wonky skill than the only universal stat is Con, affecting healing surges and total HP. Str helps a little for encumbrance, but come on... bag of holding, done (or just leave heavy things with the party packmule).

Nothing else has any intrinsic value, as your at wills will let you ignore low Str/Dex if those aren't your class stats.

 

[The_Fan]

Staying perma-bloodied is a less attractive option than it looks at first glance, because there are a lot of abilities that work better on a bloodied enemy.

I will put in for "balanced" on the warforged. They get a lot of nice abilities, but their racial stat bonuses are suboptimal because of overlap. In fact, I believe this is discussed in the sidebar. They do make very good fighters and warlocks though.

 

[Final Attack]

Man, I feel like everyone is on the wacky sauce. Maybe I'll wake in the middle of the night yelling "I understand".

Fighter for me
- STR for damage (and grab a nice maul while i'm at it)
- CON for healing surges/health
- +1 will save
- +2 endurance, and intimidate
- Doesn't die easy when down.
- Racial ability that allows about half life healing without any help?
~SOLD~

I don't think that race could look anymore like a fighter to me if it tried. There is nothing wasted in that package. I can live without +2 charisma and +1 when bloodied for everything else.

Bugbear sounds comparable because of the large weapon, but I hate playing monsters as characters and ... I mean racial heal! How useful is that!

 

[breschau]

Honestly though, for serious damage you want bugbear. +2 Str AND Larger sized weapons?

What the hell does "oversized" do considering there are no weapon sizes anymore?

Does that let you wield two-handed weapons as one-handed?

 

[Deverash]

The dragonblooded breath attack is great for a fighter, though. Marking everyone in a 3x3 square as a minor action is awesome.

And oversized would let you use a two-handed weapon in one hand(a ranger dual wielding reach weapons? ), or use Large weapons(sized for giants and such).

 

[Keenath]

Man, I feel like everyone is on the wacky sauce. Maybe I'll wake in the middle of the night yelling "I understand".

Fighter for me
- STR for damage (and grab a nice maul while i'm at it)
- CON for healing surges/health
- +1 will save
- +2 endurance, and intimidate
- Doesn't die easy when down.
- Racial ability that allows about half life healing without any help?
~SOLD~

Well, what we were trying to explain is that the +1 will is only bringing this guy up to on-level with other races, not increasing him above it. Most races get two stat bonuses that apply to different defenses. Con and Str both feed into Fortitude, though, so where a half-elf is essentially getting +1 Fort and +1 Will (for his Con and Cha bonuses, respectively), the warforged is getting only +1 Fort. The Will bonus just equalizes him.

Most races get a +2/+2 to two skills, so no big deal there.

He doesn't die easily, but that should rarely come up -- how often do you spend 3 full turns in the negatives anyway?

I'm not sure what you mean by "half life healing". The amount Resolve heals is strictly second-rate -- 3 or 4 HP early on, maxing out at 18 HP when you're 30th level? It's just not a big deal. That's less than one hit from an on-level enemy.

He's a fine fighter, but he simply doesn't make dwarves, dragonborn, or even elves look bad by comparison.

 

[Cadfan]

Man, I feel like everyone is on the wacky sauce. Maybe I'll wake in the middle of the night yelling "I understand".

Fighter for me
- STR for damage (and grab a nice maul while i'm at it)
- CON for healing surges/health
- +1 will save
- +2 endurance, and intimidate
- Doesn't die easy when down.
- Racial ability that allows about half life healing without any help?
~SOLD~

I don't think that race could look anymore like a fighter to me if it tried. There is nothing wasted in that package. I can live without +2 charisma and +1 when bloodied for everything else.

Bugbear sounds comparable because of the large weapon, but I hate playing monsters as characters and ... I mean racial heal! How useful is that!

I'm with you. Its a great race for fighters. Dwarves and dragonborn are still good, but warforged are a darn good choice as well.