WARSHAPER too strong?

[Mekabar]

One of my players plans to play a Shifter class in the future and mentioned the Warshaper from CW. Is it only my impression that the Warshapers class abilities are way over the top for a shapechanging character? This PRC has no requirements apart from +4 BAB and Shapechanging abilitiy, which isn't a real requirement, since the class offers nothing to a character who can't shift.

To sum it up, only 4 levels of this class give the character:

- Immunity to Critical Hits, Stun, Sneak attack etc.
- +1 size bonus to natural weapon damage
- +4 STR and +4 CON
- +5' Reach
- Fast Healing 2(!) + additional free self healing ability

In fact the fifth level ability is the least attractive, so you can skip that as well.

Granted all those bonuses apply only when the character is shifted, so it isn't excatly that useful for a polymorphing Wizard or Bear Warrior. But for a real shapeshifting class like Druid or Master of many Forms, who can stay shifted indefinitely, this seems way owerpowering to me. Especially considering that Fast Healing is normally an Epic Feat that requires 25 CON...

 

[Vlos]

Our group think it is. Though we allow it in our campaign at EPIC levels. We think it makes a nice EPIC PrC, but getting those powers are "from a players perspective" very very nice.

 

[jRocket]

Considering that they don't advance in spellcasting level, its not that bad. Would you rather take that or have 5 spellcasting levels?

 

[IcyCool]

To sum it up, only 4 levels of this class give the character:

- Immunity to Critical Hits, Stun, Sneak attack etc.
- +1 size bonus to natural weapon damage
- +4 STR and +4 CON
- +5' Reach
- Fast Healing 2(!) + additional free self healing ability

Keep in mind that unless you are going past 20th level, that druid will never get 9th level spells. That's rough to give up.

 

[Chaldfont]

As a DM of in a campaign with a Druid-8/Shifter-3/Warshaper-1, I have seen the devastation this PC can wreak. His favored form is a Dire Ape--the rend damage gets pretty crazy. He can outfight the party's ranger-11 with two-weapon style.

But the every time the character gains a level, the player goes nuts trying to figure out which class to take. It's KILLING him to not gain spellcasting levels in druid. Add to that the in-campaign grief the spirit of his dead mentor gives him for straying from the "true path".

I don't thing this combination is too bad. We have a three character party (ranger, sorcerer, druid) so they can use the extra fighting power.

I still think the best way to control game rules that you percieve to be unbalanced is to give he player the benefit of the doubt and let him play it. Then you control it's practical power level in game. You should see how much fun the player has playing this PC.

 

[Aust Diamondew]

It sounds too powerful but seeing as I don't own the book I couldn't say. It doesn't sound like someone who takes this is going to care much for giving up a few spell caster levels, because who ever takes it becomes a front line fighter type.

 

[Enkhidu]

It sounds too powerful but seeing as I don't own the book I couldn't say. It doesn't sound like someone who takes this is going to care much for giving up a few spell caster levels, because who ever takes it becomes a front line fighter type.

That's pretty much what I think - a Druid/Warshaper/Nature's Warrior frontliner is a real sight to behold and can easily go to to toe with fighters of the same level.

 

[Jdvn1]

As a player of a Druid9/Warshaper4/Nature's Warrior4, I don't think it's overpowered. You become set as a fighting-type (loss of spellcasting levels), you take a hit to Wildshaping (since Warshaper levels don't advance Wildshaping), and you lose out on higher level abilities.

The fast healing doesn't come in all that handy by this level, but it means the Cleric doesn't have to cure me between battles. My spells are mostly worthless except to buff myself. I'm an ineffective caster with a medium BAB (so while I'm a decent fighter, I'm not as good as an actual Fighter).

Losing Wildshape makes a big difference, especially when it delays the better wildshaping forms for many levels.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

As the player of a druid, Warshaper looks appealing (due to DM's super-critical based on the excess of the confirmation roll above AC) but the loss of spellcasting and wildshape progression makes it unappealing.

 

[Caliban]

Don't forget that you only get the class's benefits when you are in a different shape.

So anything that forces you back into your natural shape (or being surprised while in your natural shape) negates all the benefits from the class.