Weird rumor concerning "Book of Vile Darkness"

[Alaric_Prympax]

Unless it has a picture of Erik Estrada on it and the word "Autobiography".

OK, I stand corrected.

But I was and still am a fan of the series CHiPs.

Yeah, I said it.

 

[Dracomancer]

Disclaimer or no, this just might be enough to get the Jack Chick/Pat Robertson types riled up against D&D again, which is going to suck for that population of players which is still young enough that mom and dad can still burn their stuff. But on the other hand, for those of us who missed all the fun in the '80's, and who are generally amused by ignorant zealots, the return of B.A.D.D. and Dark Dungeons tracts might be kinda fun. Besides, the whole "D&D is evil" thing increased sales back then, I'm sure the same trick will work twice. Maybe that's exactly what they're trying to do.

 

[Nightfall]

Ah Pat Robertson can kiss my ass. There's no way I find ANYTHING he says justifiable based on his version of Christianity. I mean he supported the Israeli army for what is basically a massacre. A massacre that cloaked as an attempt to rout out terrorism, by the egomanic and killer named Sharon, when in fact the guy is so wrapped up in trying to prove he and his country is a super power, instead of TRYING to work for peace, it's mind boggling to think they can accomplish ANYTHING using brute force against elements that have become so entrenched on BOTH side. I won't deny that the Palestian have terrorist elements, but so do the Israelis and their factions. Pat Roberson could care less, just believe that prophecy must be fulifuled. Sorry but I believe in less bloody prophecies.

 

[Matafuego]

Besides, the whole "D&D is evil" thing increased sales back then, I'm sure the same trick will work twice. Maybe that's exactly what they're trying to do.

Are you saying that Jack Chick is working alongside with WotC???

 

[Zulkir]

BovD rumour control

>>Apparently the "secret project" was such because there's been a bit of a battle with executives at WotC and Hasbro, who are balking at letting the D&D folks publish the book in the first place. It is a bit too "intense" for their "rather bland tastes" and they are worried about the company's image.

So I guess first quesiton is -- is this true? <<

No, it is not true. Let me address this one issue at a time. First, the only reason it was a "secret project" is that all of our projects are secret until they are in the catalogue. I am responsible for whipping up the winds on this. About 6 months ago there was a post that Monte was working on a project but that he couldn't say anything about it yet because it was too early. I got confused on dates and thought that the next catalogue out would have the product in it so I felt free to fuel the speculation. So the whole "Monte Cook's secret project thing" is a bit out of proportion.

Second, as for "balking," Wizards is running this product through a bit more strenous review as it is the first mature product we have ever done. It's going to get a few more eyes on it, but that's true of every new line we produce.

>>Second question -- if it is, is this what folks were worried about when Hasbro bought WotC way back when? <<

Our processes for deciding on a project are no different now then they were before the buyout.

>>Third -- is such a product even really necessary? (I guess I'd have to know lots more about what's inside to know for sure.) <<

Nothing beyond the Core books is "necessary". The question is, "is it desirable"? Ultimately the consumer will determine the answer. However, the product was conceived because we recognize that our average consumer is in college, probably reads Vertigo comics and/or has a subscription to Maxim. The product is "mature" it is *not* gratitous. It deals with issues which are in a lot of games already but gives the player actual game mechanics to adjudicate the events. It deals with demons and devils as actual beings of evil that lead evil cults (not just monsters with personalities). It is intended primarily as a resource for creating adventures in which heroes can feel absolutely certain that the bad guy must go down for the good of humanity (or other race-anity).

>>Fourth -- Whose brainchild was this product, anyway? Who had to be "convinced" in order to get it even on the schedule? What were the parameters and where did they draw the line when it was in development?<<

The product was conceived by Monte Cook, although I think he was stunned when we said yes. We have learned a lot by doing this product, not the least of which is that everyone's perception of "vile" is vastly different.

One other point. Many people have asked, “will this product carry a warning?” The answer is, yes, it will. There will be a sticker on the cover that will state “mature audiences only.” This will be a peel-off sticker so you don’t need to worry about reading the book on the bus.

Anthony Valterra

 

[Ancalagon]

Thanks for the clarification

As for reading the book on the bus, I think the probably dark and or garish and or bloody and or (insert generaly evil looking adjective here) cover will be more of a "problem"

Ancalagon

 

[Nightfall]

Thanks for dropping Anthony! Btw, any chance we'll get to see the website catalog updated any time soon? I'd just like to have a picture of the cover to show my friends. They might not believe me.

 

[TBoarder]

Disclaimer or no, this just might be enough to get the Jack Chick/Pat Robertson types riled up against D&D again, which is going to suck for that population of players which is still young enough that mom and dad can still burn their stuff.

Seriously, so what? One thing that's changed drastically in the past decade or two is how willing more and more people are to question what is being presented to them as "good" or "evil". If somebody wants to buy the Book of Vile Darkness and somebody calls them on it for religious grounds, I think the majority of people on both sides of the debate are more willing to have a civil open-minded debate about it, rather than falling victim to the closed-minded rhetoric of Jack Chick or Pat Robertson.

I'm not naive enough to believe that this is universal. There's an absolutely hilarious thread on RPG.net right now filled with closed-minded people throwing fits about Avalanche Press' covers. (This'll make me friends REAL quick... ) I'm optimistic enough to believe that the closed-minded people are far more in the minority right now that any protest against a book like this will barely show on the radar. They may be a silent majority. but I believe it'll be enough to ensure that WotC doesn't get too much flak for this book.

Okay, so I'm a hopeless optimist.

 

[TBoarder]

Disclaimer or no, this just might be enough to get the Jack Chick/Pat Robertson types riled up against D&D again, which is going to suck for that population of players which is still young enough that mom and dad can still burn their stuff.

Not a double post. I just want to add that since this IS going to be a labelled Mature Readers book, the kids that you mention have far more to worry about than book-burning parents. Any child with a parent who doesn't pay enough attention to what their children read, watch on TV, or play on their Playstation or computer, who allows others (ie the Religious-Right) to make their child rearing decisions for them and simply reacts to when one of their "TV gods" tells them that something is evil has a hard path ahead, regardless of whether they have a D&D book called the Book of Vile Darkness or a seemingly much tamer D&D book called Deities and Demigods. If we allow those people to run our lives, if we live in fear of what they'll protest against, we'll all have book shelves with exactly one book on them, and it ain't gonna be a role-playing book, I can tell you that much.

 

[Information]

Re: Re: Weird rumor concerning "Book of Vile Darkness"

...but it's something that people have been asking for for a long time" (referring to the stats for demon and devil lords, which really haven't existed since 1E).

Monte...

Will Asmodeus be treated as a deity (DR 0+)? What about his supposed "true" form (sorry, but I absolutely hated this idea from Guide to Hell). Please tell me he isn't a greater deity...with the other archdevils without so much as a 0 in Divine Rank!