Wepon alterations

[Azurewraith]

So weapons in 5e well in most editions of dnd bug me with how it boils down to heavy/finesse 1/2h and a damage dice which makes some Superior to others by long and away so my aim is to add some balance and distinction between weapon groupings. Just thought i would get some feedback before i cause to much havoc reverting changes in my game.

A change i am adding to damage types makes all slashing weapons crit on 19-20 all bludgeon weapons deal have advantage against armoured targets and piercing weapons ignore 1point of armour(essentially a +1 to hit)

1Handed Axes Leaves a wound on the target after dealing a critical hit dealing there con mod in damage for 1d4 rounds.

2Handed Axes can add con mod to damage as well as strength critical hits deal x4 damage

Swords 1Handed can +1 to hit and can cleave adding any left over damage to an adjacent enemy

Swords 2handed(including versatile) can use a bonus action to deal 1d6 damage hilt bash

Crossbows(light/hand) Long/Shortbow gain +2 damage if within 20ft of target

Crossbow heavy if target is stood next a wall etc can pin the target to it.

2H Polearms can use reaction to "set" them against a approaching foe to grant an OA

1H pole arms and quarterstaff can trip as a bonus action
Hammers 1H push target 5ft on successful hit

Hammers 2H DC 13 con save or knock target prone

Dagger Crits on a 18-20 and deals 3x dmg

now im at a loss for the picks the sling,blow gun,whip, dart and sickle. Im lumping the morning star and clubs as hammers.

I do plan on making each weapon unique but thats a tall order for another time
So go for it tear me a new one!

 

[Hawk Diesel]

It's your table, so you can do as you like. While some of these are cool and interesting, I might caution their implementation for a few reasons.

1) It adds a lot of complexity to the game. If this is your goal, that's fine, but 5e has made great efforts to simplify and streamline to avoid bulky tables and things that require such tracking.

2) While this increases the utility of some simple weapons, the whole point of distinction between simple and martial weapons is that martial weapons should always be better. It's a balancing point that some classes get access to martial weapons. By increasing the power of simple weapons, you reduce that differential and thereby increase imbalance between classes where this is an important distinction.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

I think the big question is what are you trying to do with your weapon rules? Several of them change the game in a quite major fashion, and may not make much sense from a realism standpoint, so knowing why you have done what you have done is important to give you suggestions that fit with your particular vision and objectives.

How are you defining "Armoured" targets in relation to giving advantage with bludgeoning weapons? Does a hammer-user have to push his target when she hits it, even if that would mean all the rest of her attacks miss? How do the changes to critical range work with other properties that change critical range?

We can suggest some things for the weapons you're asking about, but until we know what you're aiming for, they might not fit with whatever source you used to come up with the existing changes.

Sling: advantage has always been in the cheapness and availability of the ammunition rather than effectiveness, which is why they were used widely by ancient civilians and military. Ease to conceal/common usage make you able to carry one around where other weapons would be frowned upon.
Maybe an option for lead/metal ammunition with a straight damage increase? Allowing Strength or Dex, whichever is higher for attacks and damage? (I do this with bows as well.)

Blowgun: - making it easier to use one and not reveal your position whilst hiding would be the obvious suggestion.

Whip: - again, not really effective as an actual weapon. Ability to use some maneuvers (pulling/disarming etc) at range/bonuses to intimidate maybe?

Dart: - Ability to hold, draw and perhaps throw multiples? Allowing drawing them to be part of an attack like ammunition, and making an extra attack as a bonus action as if dual-wielding?

Sickle: - Never really intended or used as a dedicated weapon. Bonus when trying to pull/hook your target maybe?

 

[Azurewraith]

The push would be optional. As for crit increase it would be added on to the other effect so a bm at lvl 3 would crit on a 18-20. I was trying to keep them as realstic as I could I know how to swing a sword that's about it. I went for increased crit on slashing weapons due to sharp edges making even on target hits that werent vital strikes devastating. The hammers adv was from the idea of crushing the armour. As for piercing its a puncture thing.

My intentions I'm trying to make weapon choice more meaningful and to help differentiate weapon groups. It was sparked of by a player mentiong how weapons were allways the same picks great sword or maul for 2h and rapier for dex. I'm going to eventually try and make every weapon unique to improve the choices but that's a tall order and need to start some were.

Sorry if non of this makes sense sat in a car being waffled at by my son the usual "are we there yet"

Oh almost forgot armoured would be anything wearing armour made of metal

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Giving increased crit ranges, or automatic advantage against many armours are big changes: Have you considered their effects on the balance of the game?

Different weapons often have different uses. For example a two-handed fighter might want to use a greatsword, but a barbarian would probably do better with a greataxe. This is due to interactions with the rules mechanics and your new rules don't change these since they're still using the same dice.

Some of the rules are a little . . . odd as well. For example while warhammers, maces and poleaxe-type weapons were designed to be effective against metal armour types, clubs and non-metal bludgeoning weapons were rather ineffective.
Why do axes incorporate Con modifier? Is it an endurance thing?

The Ranged weapon bonus to hit: Does that stack with the Archery Fighting style? If so, that synergises with Sharpshooter feat to make it extremely powerful.
Dagger x3 critical makes Assassins a lot nastier as well. (Auto-crit plus 3x sneak attack damage.)

In my games, I generally find the basic weapons table covers everything, and I just have a few houserules to suit personal choice. (Don't need finesse weapon to sneak attack, Bows/slings can use Str mods instead of Dex, GWF style doesn't apply to sneak attack or smites, Quarterstaves are Two-handed, weapons can deal a lower dice of damage of a different type if their design allows.)
I find special capabilities are better given to characters rather than the weapons they use, although the players can justify them as due to their character's weapons.

 

[Azurewraith]

Think I may be going back to the drawing board. With some less dramatic changes

 

[jonathonhawke]

Maybe some weapon mastery feats? Along the lines of GWM, PAM, SS, CE - where a character has trained extensively with a specific group of weapons, and gains some special bonuses from that training.

 

[JValeur]

I can certainly appreciate what you're trying to do. I set out trying to rework the weapons, for added realism, balance and to give different choices more meaning. In the end I might have achieved more realism, but the result was an over-complication reminiscent of 3.5 - and I'm not even sure it was more balanced.

I ended up rolling back most the changes, sticking to minor balance changes only, to make all weapons viable. These changes are made especially to make any weapon a choice for a specific situation, and besides the mace, I think it succeeded. I don't mean to hijack your thread, but figured I'd leave these here, for inspiration. If you want me to remove my post, just say so.

--

I've made a remastered table with changes marked in green (improvements), red (nerfs) and blue (additions/rebalance). I calculate weight in slots (a character has a number of slots equal to their strength score) for simplicity, but just use the weight values from the PHB. [The weight of the Blowgun and the Heavy Crossbow are switched on this table, but I don't have time to fix it at the moment]



Weapon Properties
Large. Substitutes the word heavy, but carries the same impact on gameplay. Additionally, you have disadvantage with large weapons when mounted, while in heavy brush, or similar situations where you wouldn't be able to wield your weapon freely.
Non-lethal. When reducing a creature to 0 hit points with an attack that isn’t a critical hit, you can choose that the creature is stable, instead of dying. [At my table, you have disadvantage on attacks made to drop a foe unconscious, without killing them, unless you have a weapon with the non-lethal property].
Stealth. This weapon can be drawn unseen with a Dexterity (Sleight of hand) check, contested by a Wisdom (Perception) check of any onlooker. If done before combat starts, this can allow the wielder to get the jump on his foe, and therefore obtain a surprise round. If done in the middle of combat, the sudden appearance of an unexpected weapon can give advantage on a single attack.

Special Weapons
Weapons with special rules are described here.
Blowgun. One vial of poison is enough for 10 pieces of blowgun ammunition, instead of just three.
Net. As the Player’s Handbook 148, but you don’t have disadvantage when using a net in melee range of a threatening enemy.
Whip. You have advantage on attacks made to disarm another creature of an object held in one hand, which weighs 5 lbs. or less. If you succeed in disarming the creature, you may place the item it was holding in any square within your reach, including in a free off-hand.

 

[Azurewraith]

I can certainly appreciate what you're trying to do. I set out trying to rework the weapons, for added realism, balance and to give different choices more meaning. In the end I might have achieved more realism, but the result was an over-complication reminiscent of 3.5 - and I'm not even sure it was more balanced.

I ended up rolling back most the changes, sticking to minor balance changes only, to make all weapons viable. These changes are made especially to make any weapon a choice for a specific situation, and besides the mace, I think it succeeded. I don't mean to hijack your thread, but figured I'd leave these here, for inspiration. If you want me to remove my post, just say so.

--

I've made a remastered table with changes marked in green (improvements), red (nerfs) and blue (additions/rebalance). I calculate weight in slots (a character has a number of slots equal to their strength score) for simplicity, but just use the weight values from the PHB. [The weight of the Blowgun and the Heavy Crossbow are switched on this table, but I don't have time to fix it at the moment]

View attachment 73663

Weapon Properties
Large. Substitutes the word heavy, but carries the same impact on gameplay. Additionally, you have disadvantage with large weapons when mounted, while in heavy brush, or similar situations where you wouldn't be able to wield your weapon freely.
Non-lethal. When reducing a creature to 0 hit points with an attack that isn’t a critical hit, you can choose that the creature is stable, instead of dying. [At my table, you have disadvantage on attacks made to drop a foe unconscious, without killing them, unless you have a weapon with the non-lethal property].
Stealth. This weapon can be drawn unseen with a Dexterity (Sleight of hand) check, contested by a Wisdom (Perception) check of any onlooker. If done before combat starts, this can allow the wielder to get the jump on his foe, and therefore obtain a surprise round. If done in the middle of combat, the sudden appearance of an unexpected weapon can give advantage on a single attack.

Special Weapons
Weapons with special rules are described here.
Blowgun. One vial of poison is enough for 10 pieces of blowgun ammunition, instead of just three.
Net. As the Player’s Handbook 148, but you don’t have disadvantage when using a net in melee range of a threatening enemy.
Whip. You have advantage on attacks made to disarm another creature of an object held in one hand, which weighs 5 lbs. or less. If you succeed in disarming the creature, you may place the item it was holding in any square within your reach, including in a free off-hand.

Not hijacking at all ill have to take a look when I'm home may inspire me

 

[akr71]

I like what [MENTION=6795723]JValeur[/MENTION] has done with the weapons table, especially the Stealth property. I wish there was a 'Weapon Specialization' feat - something that says you have practiced with one weapon in particular. Great Weapon Master or Weapon Master doesn't really cover what I am looking for, but Martial Adept comes close. This is just off the top of my head, but something like:

Weapon Specialist
You have practiced extensively with one weapon, gaining the following benefits:
-Critical hit on a natural 18-20
-Some sort of mechanic to improve your chance to hit, whether it is a superiority die, advantage on to hit rolls

(its lunch time and I will re-visit once my grumbling stomach stops interfering with my brain & its word making stuff..)