What do I do now? - A new but related situation

[Torx]

I didn't follow the original thread to completion, so I'm not sure of the extent to which the other players are aware of the Vargus/Cornealius dichotomy. If they are fully aware at this point, I would suggest that you invite them to a quick pre- or post-game discussion about the matter. Perhaps this is just one player's concerns that are not shared by the rest of the group. Or they could all feel the same way (maybe in response to, as you put it, Cornealius "dominating in personality terms").

Personally, I believe that the character concept and execution far outweigh any perceived mechanical benefits. I would love to be playing in a group with a character like this. He does not sound to be any better than any other character and certainly not up to the level of some uber-mensch characters I've been privy to.

As I mentioned above, probably the best solution is to have everyone in on the discussion on an even playing field. If the group decides against the split-personality, there are many creative manners of getting rid of one of the two halves. Best of luck to you!

 

[redwood]

How many of the other players are complaining and is it mainly about Cornealius/Vargus receiving "double experience"? Is there underlying issue like jealousy involved?

From what you've described, the argument that he is multi-classing and getting double experience seems a bit weak since he only benefits from one class at a time. Plus you've already pointed out the weaknesses that Cornealius/Vargus has imposed on himself. Sure you could weaken him even more, perhaps when Cornealius emerges, he automatically dismisses all spells Vargus has running (including anything benefiting the other party members).

Perhaps you could point out that the other players benefit from extra magic equipment since Cornealius gets rid of it.

Have any of your other players suggested what would molify them?

 

[Olaf the Stout]

How many of the other players are complaining and is it mainly about Cornealius/Vargus receiving "double experience"? Is there underlying issue like jealousy involved?

From what you've described, the argument that he is multi-classing and getting double experience seems a bit weak since he only benefits from one class at a time. Plus you've already pointed out the weaknesses that Cornealius/Vargus has imposed on himself. Sure you could weaken him even more, perhaps when Cornealius emerges, he automatically dismisses all spells Vargus has running (including anything benefiting the other party members).

Perhaps you could point out that the other players benefit from extra magic equipment since Cornealius gets rid of it.

Have any of your other players suggested what would molify them?

This is the first time that anyone has said anything in regards to Cornealius/Vargus. I don't think it is jealousy, more just a fairness issue and the player feeling that everyone should be on a level playing field.

While the argument is a bit weak, I do think that the Cornealius/Vargus character is more powerful in some ways than your ordinary character. And if a player perceives that he is getting a raw deal it doesn't really matter what the reality is. Ultimately I don't want this to become a huge issue which is why I plan on discussing everything with the group before the start of next session.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Cedric]

I'm sure that my opinion has a lot to do with the fact that some of the best games I've ever played in didn't have each character on equal footing.

Now, certainly most of our games have featured characters that were on equal footing. However, some of the best had character(s) that were decidedly more powerful than others.

As long as everyone understands that going in and the more powerful character(s) isn't always the ones played by the same player(s)...it can be a great deal of fun.

The difference in power level could be based on stats/levels/abilities, or it could be a difference in political position and power.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I didn't follow the original thread to completion, so I'm not sure of the extent to which the other players are aware of the Vargus/Cornealius dichotomy. If they are fully aware at this point, I would suggest that you invite them to a quick pre- or post-game discussion about the matter. Perhaps this is just one player's concerns that are not shared by the rest of the group. Or they could all feel the same way (maybe in response to, as you put it, Cornealius "dominating in personality terms").

Personally, I believe that the character concept and execution far outweigh any perceived mechanical benefits. I would love to be playing in a group with a character like this. He does not sound to be any better than any other character and certainly not up to the level of some uber-mensch characters I've been privy to.

As I mentioned above, probably the best solution is to have everyone in on the discussion on an even playing field. If the group decides against the split-personality, there are many creative manners of getting rid of one of the two halves. Best of luck to you!

The players know that there are 2 separate characters. They also know that Cornealius has no idea of what happens when Vargus takes over.

Perhaps I mis-stated myself or you misunderstood. I wouldn't say that Cornealius dominates in character terms. I would say that Cornealius' player dominates in character terms. When Cornealius is in control he generally portrays him as the coward that he is. Vargus on the other hand is definitely a dominating character. He quite often gets the group to do things his way (the character as distinct from the player). It could be a possiblity that this is in response to Vargus dominating in terms of personality.

I didn't discuss the mechanical concepts surrounding the 2 character/personalities because I didn't want to ruin the surprise and shock of the other PC's finding out about them in-game. It was definitely fun to watch them try to piece things together.

Now that the cat is out of the bag so to speak it would definitely be a good time to discuss it with the group, including the mechanical rules and details behind it.

Olaf the Stout

 

[pawsplay]

This means that Vargus/Cornealius' player is basically getting twice the XP as everyone else.

He's not. He's getting twice the class features, but only half as often.

Under what conditions does the character's personality change? And do his ability scores change, too?

 

[Olaf the Stout]

This means that Vargus/Cornealius' player is basically getting twice the XP as everyone else.

He's not. He's getting twice the class features, but only half as often.

Under what conditions does the character's personality change? And do his ability scores change, too?

The character's personality changes when Cornealius, the cowardly sorcerer, becomes stressed. When Cornealius becomes stressed Vargus makes a Will save to take control. Cornealius takes control again once he is calm enough or whenever the character wakes up from having a sleep.

They have 2 completely different sets of ability scores.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Papewaio of The Org]

It sounds more powerful. Particularly as the trigger is the optimum time for a barbarian to rage forth... combat. The rest of the time the character would have the utility of a sorceror.

It is about as powerful as the old school DnD elves fighter/mage who leveled up about one level behind straight mages or fighters. I would give it an LA of +1.

If the character somehow gets to do the hulk and unify both sides of the personalities then I would change the LA to +4.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

A Level Adjustment sounds like an interesting solution. Introducing it after the fact may have problems of its own though. Of course Cornealius/Vargus' player may not find that solution particularly appealing and may no longer want to play the multiple personality character. Still an interesting way of dealing with the situation.

Any other thoughts?

Olaf the Stout

 

[nonamazing]

They have 2 completely different sets of ability scores.

This may be your problem. Does the barbarian have higher physical stats and lower mental ones? And is the sorcerer the opposite? Because if so, then the character is always going to shine because he's optimized for each role that he plays.

A typical multi-class character has to deal with balancing his array of statistics to satisfy the demands of each of his classes. Even with all of the other weaknesses, the ability to have an entirely new set of physical stats on demand, and be able to rage on top of that...it seems like a bit too much to me.

The barbarian should have to deal with the physical weakness of the sorceror. After all, they do share the same body. If the barbarian is stronger, it should be because of his rage, not because the body magically changes when his personality takes over. I strongly suspect that this game used either a point buy system or a fixed array for stats. Am I correct? If so, I think that this is the issue that your other players are having the toughest time with. I suggest whittling it down to one set of stats that both characters share.