D&D 5E What Don't You Like About Dungeons?

[Incenjucar]

I'm using how roleplaying is defined in the rules of D&D 5e. It's just the player deciding what their character does, thinks, and says. Whether or not that aligns with somebody's notion of what the character might reasonably do given the context is irrelevant, particularly as anything can be justified in a game based on the childhood game of make-believe. If it does align with the character's personality trait, ideal, bond, or flaw, then that might be worth Inspiration.

But anyway, even if we did go with your definition, there's nothing about a dungeon that inherently prevents someone from "playing your character as a character." If you think that's not true, please tell us how.

Dungeons can have plenty of roleplaying. Dungeons do tend to lead to more meta play, but it's certainly not required.

 

[iserith]

Dungeons can have plenty of roleplaying. Dungeons do tend to lead to more meta play, but it's certainly not required.

What is "meta play?"

 

[Bill Zebub]

Roleplaying is when the player decides what their character does, so dungeons involve a lot of it since there's lots to do. If you mean social interaction...

There was some back-and-forth on the Shadowdark Discord* about roleplaying in OSR, and I realized partway through that people were using "roleplaying" interchangeably to mean:
a) Acting out the persona of your character
b) Interacting with NPCs

Certainly both of those things can happen simultaneously, but each can also happen independently of the other: you can roleplay swinging your sword, and you can interact with an NPC without expressing your character.

No real insight here, just pointing out that the word can carry both meanings.

*The kind we've all seen, where somebody with 40+ years of experience...like so many of us...comes in thinking that everybody else is just a kid who needs/wants to be edified by a veteran, and proceeds to tell us all how the game "should" be played.

 

[Bill Zebub]

What is "meta play?"

Oh boy.

This is @iserith's version of "Funny how? Like a clown? Ha-ha I make you laugh?"

/popcorn

 

[R_J_K75]

What is "meta play?"

I always took it to mean when a player uses information from the real world or a souecebook that their character wouldnt and shouldnt know to solve a problem

 

[Incenjucar]

What is "meta play?"

It's when players use their personal knowledge specifically instead of playing their character in order to seek their preferred outcome. For example, if they use RL knowledge of explosives to try and invent gun powder to blow a hole in a wall that they know has a treasure behind it because they read the adventure before playing.

 

[iserith]

I always took it to mean when a player uses information from the real world or a souecebook that their character wouldnt and shouldnt know to solve a problem

It's when players use their personal knowledge specifically instead of playing their character in order to seek their preferred outcome. For example, if they use RL knowledge of explosives to try and invent gun powder to blow a hole in a wall that they know has a treasure behind it because they read the adventure before playing.

The tricky bit here is that particular knowledge isn't really necessary to take action, and the DM is only tasked with adjudicating action, so we really can't sit in judgment of what a character "wouldn't" or "shouldn't" know. It's really more like "might" or "could" know anyway since anything can be fictionally justified up to and including "Bruenor just felt like doing that, okay?" That may not be as satisfying as justifying it with Bruenor's extensive and ponderous backstory, but it is what it is, and is in my view no more inherent to dungeons than other venues.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

It's when players use their personal knowledge specifically instead of playing their character in order to seek their preferred outcome. For example, if they use RL knowledge of explosives to try and invent gun powder to blow a hole in a wall that they know has a treasure behind it because they read the adventure before playing.

I waarn you he doesn't believe in separating character and player skills

 

[iserith]

I waarn you he doesn't believe in separating character and player skills

I believe it's nobody's business but the player of that character. If they do or don't want to do that, it's not my concern. But anyway the assertion is that this happens more in dungeons than elsewhere, and I disagree. There's nothing about dungeons that makes this more prevalent in my view.

 

[Incenjucar]

The tricky bit here is that particular knowledge isn't really necessary to take action, and the DM is only tasked with adjudicating action, so we really can't sit in judgment of what a character "wouldn't" or "shouldn't" know. It's really more like "might" or "could" know anyway since anything can be fictionally justified up to and including "Bruenor just felt like doing that, okay?" That may not be as satisfying as justifying it with Bruenor's extensive and ponderous backstory, but it is what it is, and is in my view no more inherent to dungeons than other venues.

I've never struggled with this, but we all have different experiences with the game.