What rules don't work?
- Thread starter RangerWickett
- Start date
Telas said:Wow, sorry I missed all that.I've been dealing in both politics and personal attacks for years....
Telas
I am not sure what he is was talking about. There were no politics there. I said that while army, marines, navy, etc. All talk trash about each other all the time we still know we are on the same said in the end.
Saeviomagy
Adventurer
My problems with d20
1. The skill system. Most skills have messed up DCs, leading to the skill either being awesome (ie tumble, concentration, diplomacy) or totally worthless (ie balance, jump, swim).
I mean does the average tightrope walker really have a +30 skill check? Is there really one person for each tightrope walker in the world that can talk someone intent on killing them into helping them out, without offering any incentives whatsoever?
Also - the flat d20+mods system doesn't really allow for the "long shot". Either you got a 5% chance of doing it, or it's totally impossible.
2. The CR system. I mean sure - some monsters will do better in certain situations, and you can't take every possibility into account, but have you ever looked at the stats of an erinyes and an 8th level fighter? Let's look at just the combat stats - 21 in all physical stats, all good saves, good BAB, more hit dice, resistances, DR, SR, flight. Add in the SLA's, and you're not even in the same ballpark. I'm not even paying any attention to the mental stats, or skill points, or stuff that's not directly contributing to a fight.
In fact, the only way in which the erinyes isn't vastly superior to the fighter is that it has 2 feats less.
This isn't exactly an uncommon thing either - most outsiders are the same. Many giants are the same. A lot of monstrous humanoids are too. Not only that, but the designers KNOW it - just look at some of those LA's.
1. The skill system. Most skills have messed up DCs, leading to the skill either being awesome (ie tumble, concentration, diplomacy) or totally worthless (ie balance, jump, swim).
I mean does the average tightrope walker really have a +30 skill check? Is there really one person for each tightrope walker in the world that can talk someone intent on killing them into helping them out, without offering any incentives whatsoever?
Also - the flat d20+mods system doesn't really allow for the "long shot". Either you got a 5% chance of doing it, or it's totally impossible.
2. The CR system. I mean sure - some monsters will do better in certain situations, and you can't take every possibility into account, but have you ever looked at the stats of an erinyes and an 8th level fighter? Let's look at just the combat stats - 21 in all physical stats, all good saves, good BAB, more hit dice, resistances, DR, SR, flight. Add in the SLA's, and you're not even in the same ballpark. I'm not even paying any attention to the mental stats, or skill points, or stuff that's not directly contributing to a fight.
In fact, the only way in which the erinyes isn't vastly superior to the fighter is that it has 2 feats less.
This isn't exactly an uncommon thing either - most outsiders are the same. Many giants are the same. A lot of monstrous humanoids are too. Not only that, but the designers KNOW it - just look at some of those LA's.
Particle_Man
Explorer
Saeviomagy said:
I may be wrong, but I thought CR was designed with the idea of fighting a party of 4 individuals (cleric, wizard, fighter, rogue) not just one, so it has to be a bit tougher than any one of the 4.
Telas said:Actually, not really....Anyway, internal bleeding isn't immediately fatal. ... etc. ... death. ...A similar case can be said for cutting the brachial nerve at the groin, but groin shots are notoriously hard to score (especially on guys, who tend to protect the area). :\ ...etc. ....
Your level of knowledge on the art of killing another human being at once amazes and horrifies me.
Good job!
Ds Da Man
First Post
AoO, Flanking, Rogues, HP....
AoO, some make sense, others (running by creatures engaged in combat...etc.)
Flanking....Have you ever seen 2 on 1 swordfights, an experienced fighter will work them to not be directly on each side (though there are abilities which won't allow you to get flanked, although the direct melee fighter doesn't get them.)
Rogues...Explain to me again how they are immune to sneak attacks from everything except higher level rogues, and they aren't damaged by a fireball, even though they maybe in a 10x10 room?
HP....Who cares if you've got me point blank with a gun or x-bow to my head, it only does 1d8 PoD!
Oh yeah, giant creature swings club, hits little man, man doesn't even have to make a strength check to see if he's knocked back.
Oh well, maybe WFRP in 2 more weeks1
AoO, some make sense, others (running by creatures engaged in combat...etc.)
Flanking....Have you ever seen 2 on 1 swordfights, an experienced fighter will work them to not be directly on each side (though there are abilities which won't allow you to get flanked, although the direct melee fighter doesn't get them.)
Rogues...Explain to me again how they are immune to sneak attacks from everything except higher level rogues, and they aren't damaged by a fireball, even though they maybe in a 10x10 room?
HP....Who cares if you've got me point blank with a gun or x-bow to my head, it only does 1d8 PoD!
Oh yeah, giant creature swings club, hits little man, man doesn't even have to make a strength check to see if he's knocked back.
Oh well, maybe WFRP in 2 more weeks1
Laman Stahros
First Post
Gez said:
Thanks, looks cool.
Steverooo said:
It's my main beef with D&D too. Well, the whole "if it's meant for PCs, it's less powerful" thing. For instance, the only things that don't have special vision types are PC races. And small PC races move slowly, but small humanoid monsters rarely do.
Things like that.
It's more of a "mood" thing than a rule that doesn't work, though.
But yeah, why would a human need to learn kung fu to attack someone without attacks of opportunity but things like dogs or zombies (good catch !) don't ? Somehow, I don't see a wolf using elaborate attack techniques to get past someone's guard.
