D&D 4E What Should 4e magic be like?

[Jedi_Solo]

I vote for basing it on the Warlock mechanic. They get a basic attack (the Magic Missile if you will) like they do now that starts at 1d6 and increases every other level. They then get abilities to modify the spell as the Warlocks do; extra range, radius burst, acid based attack, etc.

You want to cast "Fireball"? It's a radius burst with fire damage. Lightning Bolt? A Line attack with electricity damage.

Clerics can work the same way. They heal an amount that increases every other level. Mass heals get the radius burst template. They can then add Divine Fire damage for the attack spells.

And what about the non-combat spells such as Teleport and Scrying? Same as the Warlock abilities. Just as the Warlock can simply fly or see in darkness the wizard can teleport and scrye.

Sure, some spells (Enlarge Person) may need a little work ("so you're a medium sized humanoid who is large twenty-four hours a day?") but I think they have a very solid base to start with and that scales well with level. A little tweak here and a little polish there and I think they have a full blown magic system that would work for any class.

 

[hong]

A divide between "encounter" and "non-encounter" spells.

An "encounter" spell can be used once per encounter (most combat spells would go here).

"Non-combat" spells (teleport, divinations, etc) still have the daily limit.

Casters would prepare spells in the morning as normal, but "encounter" spells are repreparable quickly (a few minutes).

Geoff.

I find your thoughts interesting and would like to play in your campaign.

Wait a minute.

 

[EvilDwarf]

Just off the top my head without thinking it through...

A divide between "encounter" and "non-encounter" spells.

An "encounter" spell can be used once per encounter (most combat spells would go here).

"Non-combat" spells (teleport, divinations, etc) still have the daily limit.

Casters would prepare spells in the morning as normal, but "encounter" spells are repreparable quickly (a few minutes).

Would it be possible to have a mechanic like this that would include some Cantrip-like spells (what 3E calls 0-level spells), but for each level? You could then have a number of, say, 4th level cantrips that you could cast more times per day/encounter, but the more beefy 4th level spells would still keep the spell slot system.

BTW, while I really dislike the prepare-ahead-of-time aspect of Vancian, but I love the simpicity of spell slots and not having the math/bookkeeping of MP, etc. The spontaneous casters are the way to go, but what that iconic wizard?? Hummmm.....

Maybe I should change my avatar to "CrazyDwarf."

 

[Mercule]

I'd like to see wizards (at least) made more psi-like, with points and extra effects for spending more points. There are probably other good changes that I would like.

Two things I most certainly do not want:

* Sorcerer as the standard arcanist. The idea of a spell book and a potentially unlimited list of spells is absolutely, positively required, IMO.

* Encounter-based magic. Don't get me wrong, I loathe slots and x/day mechanics, but I like them no more as x/encounter. In fact, I like them even less.

I would like to see the warlock class made core, though. That's a nice addition to the list of classes. Things like the beguiler, warmage, dread necromancer are also much more interesting as specialists than the current way of doing specialists. Hopefully, they can come up with some unified mechanic for those classes rather than a total of 15 pages.

 

[Wombat]

Colour me "odd", but I'd like to see a magic system where it is possible for the magic to fail on the caster's end (e.g. he didn't do the spell correctly) rather than strictly on the target's end (e.g. failed saving throw).

 

[Kobold Avenger]

I like the "Recharge" mechanic used in some places like the Pact Magic 5 rounds, or the 1d4 round Dragon breath.

I don't know about MP and slots existing together in the new system, like they do now. Some problems that come up with MP are 'the mana potion dependence' I see in many video games, or the psionic problem of "going nova" with spending all your MP really, really fast (yes I'm aware wizards and sorcerers can go nova too, but it's easier with a psion). If they do exist together, power points usually gets left behind. But I wouldn't mind if psions used some combination of 'slots' and warlock abilities, and they just called in psionics in name. But I do hope psionics still exists as a style, which later there's going to be others like shadow, elemental, fey and so on. I guess much like templates from arcana evolved or whatever.

If there's another model I hate about current D&D as is, it's monsters and spell-like abilities per day. I really wish they got something like "paths" or "influences" and can use spells based on those with a certain power level in mind.

I sort of do wish there's free-form magic, much like Ar Magica (I don't know that system, but I know Mage really well) like someone mentioned, but I know it wouldn't happen.

 

[HeavenShallBurn]

Two things I most certainly do not want:

* Sorcerer as the standard arcanist. The idea of a spell book and a potentially unlimited list of spells is absolutely, positively required, IMO.

The first of these I agree with spellcasting needs to use the wizard mechanic of learning them with potentially unlimited list.

* Encounter-based magic. Don't get me wrong, I loathe slots and x/day mechanics, but I like them no more as x/encounter. In fact, I like them even less.

That's a result of your own perceptions. Encounter based balancing doesn't necessarily involve X/per encounter mechanics, that's actually one of the worst ways to do it. There's a post on casting using a token system similar to Iron Heroes in House Rules. I think a variation of this could be the answer to many problems of the current system.

You convert to a magic point system. Then you derive your magic point pool by how much magic in total is roughly balanced in a single enounter. To account for the longest, toughest, and most desperate fights you use a fast-recharge mechanic that is slow enough not to overly impact most combats which are shorter. Now caster's are able to unload but won't entirely run out because of magic recharge.

 

[blargney the second]

I feel like an IT manager who just learned a new buzzword.

Drop everything else - I want Vancian per-encounter magic!
-blarg

 

[Koewn]

True Sorcery.

(It almost looks like d20 Star Wars Saga "Force Use" is going more in that direction already...)

 

[Shade]

Almost identical to 3.5 psionics, but with some sort of recharge mechanic.