What SHOULD be updated in 4.0?

[CleverNickName]

I think I would most like to see some improved Turn Undead rules. I like the idea of replacing them with spells, but they will probably end up in a talent tree. I'm okay with that, too. But the current "roll the dice, add a mod, consult a table, roll a couple more dice, add another mod, and apply the result" mechanic is awful.

 

[KrazyHades]

- I think the game (3e) lacks a stat that is a very, very small value, but still a positive one. Currently Str 0 means the character can't move and str 1 means he only has a -5 penalty against normal human. How do mice factor in this? (before you say it's irrelevant, don't forget polymorphing and such). Answer: there should be something between 1 and 0, perhaps Q which means -50 or something like that.

Uhh...mice are size fine (6 inches or less), which gives -16 on grapple checks. Mice have a -21 penalty against a STR 10 human in a grapple. A human CANNOT physically fail to grapple a mouse unless you count a natural 1 as an auto-fail grapple or natural 20 as an auto-success.

However, I do agree that it seems silly that a mouse with STR 1 would barely be weaker than a human with STR 3 (minimum for a natural human). It just doesn't seem right.

 

[pawsplay]

However, I do agree that it seems silly that a mouse with STR 1 would barely be weaker than a human with STR 3 (minimum for a natural human). It just doesn't seem right.

The mouse can carry less (smaller size), and is worse at grappling and tripping. Seems fine to me. In some abstract way, they have a similar ability to use their Str in combat, but of course, they use Dex and always do minimal damage (if any), so it's kind of moot.

 

[mach1.9pants]

Actually I think that's just about right. Oh it should go up a very little, but in general peasants did exactly that, work all day just so that they could survive to do it all over again tomorrow. Furthermore there's a lot of the world right now where things aren't much different.

Not right I am afraid, a common misconception about the medieval peasant. They were, in general (and I am talking here about in Britain, my area of knowledge), not subsistence farmers. They expected to make a surplus to either sell on for things they could not make/grow themselves or to use as a buffer to take them through hard years. Those hard years were caused by environmental (read famine) conditions mostly.
I would like the mental stats made as clear as the physical ones; cha vs wis for mental strength etc.
Not gonna happen though!

 

[HeavenShallBurn]

Not right I am afraid, a common misconception about the medieval peasant. They were, in general (and I am talking here about in Britain, my area of knowledge), not subsistence farmers. They expected to make a surplus to either sell on for things they could not make/grow themselves or to use as a buffer to take them through hard years. Those hard years were caused by environmental (read famine) conditions mostly.

A good description of the conditions in Britain, there were other regions where things were similar. On the other hand conditions in Britain tended to put their average conditions on the high end of the overall picture. The economic picture could do with some upward adjustment but it should be a rather small one to account for the areas where conditions where generally worse than in Britain.

Really the problem is pricing not the wage of peasants, as labor generally cost roughly one silver penny/pence/equivalent per day unless some special skill was involved. Prices of common goods and mundane items could go down to reflect a somewhat more reasonable state. What kept them artificially inflated was their use as a balancing mechanism for the point buy system that was magic items. The Dungeonominicon on the WoTC site has some good advice about economic factors and models and comes to some intersting conclusions.

To name examples that have probably already been used
Turning-needs a mechanic that doesn't require a chart
Caster Levels-needs a mechanic or patch that meshes better with multiclassing
LA/ECL-Needs to go away permanently. Also in the DMG there should be an explicit section showing how the PHB races were balanced against each other and a guide to creating new races in ways that allows true balance (parity not penalty to encourage core race use) with the standard ones.

 

[Szatany]

Uhh...mice are size fine (6 inches or less), which gives -16 on grapple checks. Mice have a -21 penalty against a STR 10 human in a grapple. A human CANNOT physically fail to grapple a mouse unless you count a natural 1 as an auto-fail grapple or natural 20 as an auto-success.

However, I do agree that it seems silly that a mouse with STR 1 would barely be weaker than a human with STR 3 (minimum for a natural human). It just doesn't seem right.

For grapple you're right, but what about arm-wrestling or rope-pulling?

 

[Li Shenron]

3 things on my mind:

Magic items' christmas tree was on the top of my list. It's been said since the start that this is solved in 4e, however recently they mildly hinted that perhaps it's not so much solved but only slightly edulcorated. If that is enough remains to be seen.

Poisons sucked in 3e, but still suck in 4e, just in a modified way.

Wizard's specialization or more precisely banned schools. It is the only thing in 3e that is forbidden without a reason (ethical or practical).

 

[Xethreau]

- The tradition of naming editions "D&D X.Y" (Wait, didn't they already say they were doing that?)

- in 3e, by second level, you have more money than any normal person would ever see in their entire life. That needs to change.

- A difference in spell casting styles. A wizard and a cleric in 3e both have to say magic words and do funny hand signs. That works fine for a wizard, in some campaigns, but not so often for a cleric.

- Magic that feels magical, please. Pseudo-scientific magic concepts, such as names of the 3e schools of magic, make magic seem more like Science 2e than a powerful, mysterious force.

- Plains for every alignment need to be removed from core.

- Everything Szatany said.

 

[an_idol_mind]

I'm intrigued by the notion that "the math works." There are some progressions in 3rd edition that could use some smoothing out.

I'd like to see Armor Class improve with level, but not render armor as useless (and not force armor to be damage reduction rather than an AC bonus).

I'd like to see magic items become more flavorful. Fewer rings of protection +1, swords +2 and such.

I'd like to drop the assumption that high-level characters are always wealthy. Most probably are, but raw power does not always translate into lots of money.