What We Lose When We Eliminate Controversial Content

[Raunalyn]

I mean, it does, but I don't think you realize saying "But you don't have to play!" misses that prioritizing meaninglessly controversial content sends a message as to what is important in the community and how it views inclusiveness. Just because you aren't saying they aren't welcome doesn't mean they aren't getting that hint.

No, it has nothing to do with me pointing out someone else's intellectual dishonesty.

An argument was made that someone told this particular individual that if they didn't like certain content, then they shouldn't play. I pointed out that this didn't actually happen. It really is as simple as that.

And that's all I have to say on this matter.

 

[MGibster]

I think you are really missing that you are talking about something that makes people, particular groups of minorities, uncomfortable and unwelcome. It's much easier for someone like you to add that sort of thing in than have it standard and force GMs to make the decision to take it out.

Here's the thing, I don't believe most people are really offended by the inclusion of slavery in RPGs. If I showed up to RPG day and ran a scenario where the PCs are tasked with rescuing the prince from the acid mines of the Green Wizards of Tyrannia, it's very, very unlikely any of the players would be offended. I could run it three times for 18 different people, and I don't believe a single one of them is going to think, "This is inappropriate and makes me feel unwelcome."

 

[Justice and Rule]

Here's the thing, I don't believe most people are really offended by the inclusion of slavery in RPGs. If I showed up to RPG day and ran a scenario where the PCs are tasked with rescuing the prince from the acid mines of the Green Wizards of Tyrannia, it's very, very unlikely any of the players would be offended. I could run it three times for 18 different people, and I don't believe a single one of them is going to think, "This is inappropriate and makes me feel unwelcome."

Given that people are saying it feels like this just disproves itself, but I can simply bring up the Pathfinder example again and point out that plenty in that community did not like that being available and part of the game.

 

[AnotherGuy]

Here's the thing, I don't believe most people are really offended by the inclusion of slavery in RPGs. If I showed up to RPG day and ran a scenario where the PCs are tasked with rescuing the prince from the acid mines of the Green Wizards of Tyrannia, it's very, very unlikely any of the players would be offended. I could run it three times for 18 different people, and I don't believe a single one of them is going to think, "This is inappropriate and makes me feel unwelcome."

This is exactly how I feel. When I tell my friends (including PoC) of the perceptions that I've heard here on Enworld about certain topics - they laugh and roll their eyes and tell me to leave Enworld. Literally.

 

[Justice and Rule]

This is exactly how I feel. When I tell my friends (including PoC) of the perceptions that I've heard here on Enworld about certain topics - they laugh and roll their eyes and tell me to leave Enworld. Literally.

I dunno, we literally have a PoC in the thread arguing the opposite, soooooo...

 

[Micah Sweet]

No, I think if you're going to use slavery, that you should address it directly and not use it as set dressing or continue to use because canon dictates you do. I think such things should be examined and you should look whether or not you're just using it for some bit of flavor. For example, there are Delta Green scenarios that use things like child abuse and animal abuse, but also those scenarios go deep in addressing them and make them the focus of such things.

As it stands, I think D&D really doesn't do this sort of thing well and using such things really won't be done well in D&D, especially with the audience it is trying to reach. I think it misses the point of the game and what it is, to be honest.



Yes, but the point is that we're prioritizing the comfort of older players rather than newer ones... or really, not even the "comfort" of older players as much as their demands to keep settings "accurate".



I don't believe I did say that!

I just don't think it's in Wizards's best interests to do so because I don't think they have the chops to do so and their audience is so broad that it's just not a good idea in the same way that I don't want them exploring sexual assault as a setting aspect. Instead, I think that they should smartly consider removing superfluous usages of things like slavery and remove them because if the only reason to keep them around is for "setting accuracy", we've basically conceded how useless they are in actual gameplay.

So just WotC shouldn't touch this kind of content? It's ok with you if other publishers do?

 

[Justice and Rule]

So just WotC shouldn't touch this kind of content? It's ok with you if other publishers do?

Maybe? It depends on the game, how it is handled, who is writing it... there's a lot of context to who is writing and how they are writing it that matters. But just keeping this sort of stuff because it was around in earlier editions, to me, is just incredibly bad reasoning and something Wizards should not do.

 

[Micah Sweet]

This is exactly how I feel. When I tell my friends (including PoC) of the perceptions that I've heard here on Enworld about certain topics - they laugh and roll their eyes and tell me to leave Enworld. Literally.

Have had exactly the same experience.

 

[Raunalyn]

Given that people are saying it feels like this just disproves itself, but I can simply bring up the Pathfinder example again and point out that plenty in that community did not like that being available and part of the game.

Back during the early 90's when the Dark Sun boxed set was released, our DM ran us through Freedom...he is a dear friend of mine who happens to be a person of color. He had no complaints other than the terrible artwork by Baxa.

 

[AnotherGuy]

I dunno, we literally have a PoC in the thread arguing the opposite, soooooo...

I know. True - but I also don't like PoC posting as if that is what everyone who is Non-white thinks.
Think of it like the OGL where we had posters telling us that their tables and others who weren't following the pulse of the hobby couldn't care less of the OGL issue.
Voices here are as anecdotal as voices at home.