What's your attitude towards PVP?

[dragoner]

PVP. Maybe the scariest acronym in tabletop roleplay. Is it too much hassle and stress to try? Will it, without fail, compromise the party?

I enjoy PVP, but only in its time and place. And many campaigns and RPGs just aren't made for it.

So what do you think about PVP in the main TTRPG, Dungeons-N-Hamsters? Ever try an RPG like Paranoia that's super PVP focused? And let's say you were playing Masquerade, a game that is loose about whether or not PVP is a thing: do you stoke those flames occasionally and see what happens?

Always ruins the game.

 

[Umbran]

I don't agree that it can only work in short arcs.

If you are referring to my statement, I would like to note I didn't say it "didn't work". I said that it detracts more than it adds. As in, the effort to make it work costs more than the payoff is worth - which assumes it can, in fact, work.

It is like a Jaguar car - the thing will run, but requires so much money and time in the shop to keep it running, you'd get more overall fun driving out of a reliable used Honda Civic.

 

[nevin]

PVP. Maybe the scariest acronym in tabletop roleplay. Is it too much hassle and stress to try? Will it, without fail, compromise the party?

I enjoy PVP, but only in its time and place. And many campaigns and RPGs just aren't made for it.

So what do you think about PVP in the main TTRPG, Dungeons-N-Hamsters? Ever try an RPG like Paranoia that's super PVP focused? And let's say you were playing Masquerade, a game that is loose about whether or not PVP is a thing: do you stoke those flames occasionally and see what happens?

Don’t like it. As DM and as Player I’ve seen it create very hard feelings thatl persist past the encounter. That being said at the right table with the right people it can be fun if not taken too far. In let my players make thier own decisions but every time I see inter player pvp start I get really nervous wondering if the game is about to end.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Poll is missing: No, no interest in that at all in the game.

 

[cavetroll]

One of the most iconic, enjoyable battles we ever had in 2e was when clones of every player character was created and a PvP battle ensued. It was 30 years ago so I don't remember the specifics of whether it was a 3v3 or every character for themselves, but it was one of the most memorable sessions ever. They were very high level, so the mages (or fighter/mages) couldn't immediately disable the pure fighters, who had boots of flying and ways to counter standard magics.

Of course we didn't do it with their real characters, but regardless they gave it everything they had to win as a point of pride.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Agreed on all counts. Even just butting heads can go pear-shaped really quickly if one or more players doesn't have the skills and trust needed to pull that off.

Paranoia is built with the idea that the game is a fragile balance between working together and sabotaging each other. When a game lacks that expectation and architecture, conflict between characters can easily spill into conflict between players.

Which is why my D&D games always have a rule that you just can't roll against another PC. I do not enjoy refereeing grudge matches or having to make sure PvP conflict doesn't escalate.

To me, PVP is fighting between characters where death is a possibility. A little drama or butting heads is not PVP.

In a game of Paranoia, sure.

In your average D&D game, nope.

 

[Scruffy nerf herder]

If you are referring to my statement, I would like to note I didn't say it "didn't work". I said that it detracts more than it adds. As in, the effort to make it work costs more than the payoff is worth - which assumes it can, in fact, work.

It is like a Jaguar car - the thing will run, but requires so much money and time in the shop to keep it running, you'd get more overall fun driving out of a reliable used Honda Civic.

... It's that difficult? How immature is the average player you guys play with?

 

[Umbran]

... It's that difficult? How immature is the average player you guys play with?

If you had asked, "Gee, that seems strange, to me. What about it takes so much work?" maybe this would have been a constructive conversation.

But, if your starting position is going to be this judgemental, insulting, and disrespectful, I don't see much reason to bother engaging.

 

[Scruffy nerf herder]

If you had asked, "Gee, that seems strange, to me. What about it takes so much work?" maybe this would have been a constructive conversation.

But, if your starting position is going to be this judgemental, insulting, and disrespectful, I don't see much reason to bother engaging.

If that's the case then clearly we had a big text issue based miscommunication, as that wasn't at all my intended tone. And of course I failed to make clear what my question meant and why exactly I asked it that way.

When you described PVP as a Jaguar car, it had me thinking of all of the various responses here saying that they're always nervous there will be genuine player conflict, not PC conflict. So it's as if there's a united front of "my players can't handle it", "they'll be quite cross with each other", which was kind of dissonant with my own experience of shenanigans and players laughing. We're all extremely close knit.

Obviously "immature" wasn't a very good word choice. I'm hardly looking down my nose at anyone, it simply sounded like experiences I've had when playing with strangers, acquaintances, i.e. unknown quantities, or children, etc.

When people say "this is prohibitively difficult" I can't help but wonder about the players. It just hasn't been that hard in my experience.

 

[Li Shenron]

I never like it in D&D or general RPG. I've never seen it work even when everyone was supposedly on board with the idea. Perhaps it might have something to do with the immersive nature of RPGs, but players are going to take it personally. Obviously it is far worse when not everyone is even on board.

As a DM I have been telling players for almost two decades now that I am simply not allowing attacking, stealing, or betraying between them. If they REALLY want it to be part of the story, the whole group must decide the outcome unanimously, NOT THE DICE.

There is of course plenty of adversarial games around (in fact almost all tabletop non-RPG games) so it's not like there is a shortage of opportunities to play that out.