When does a DM Cheat?

[Aaron L]

The DM is responsible for providing a fun atmosphere for the players to adventure in, but one in which he also has fun. I don't think it is possible for the DM to "cheat" unless he is for some reason at odds with the players and is attempting to "beat" them.

The ONLY way I could imagine the DM "cheating" is if he was altering the game so that he was having fun but the players were not.

 

[LostSoul]

Only when the situation requires it. And no, I don't mean a PC dying--I mean whenever plot hooks come unhinged and can't be repair by normal means.

I wouldn't do that. It means that the PCs effectively have no control over the game world unless the DM allows it. Their actions are meaningless unless they jive with the DM's. Taken to extremes (warning: straw man), I could see the PCs not doing anything because whatever they do is already pre-scripted.

This may work for some games, but not for me. It's just as good as long as you still have fun, but I've found that having the players spoiling my "sacred" plotlines makes the game much more interesting for me. That way, I don't know where the game is going to lead.

 

[bwgwl]

i agree with Aaron: i don't see a DM fudging die rolls as "cheating."

when i DM, i'll fudge rolls to make the game more interesting. this isn't quite the same as "protecting the plot" -- if the direction the PCs are going in derails my plot but is more dramatic and interesting, well then, let's see where it goes!

and like Berandor said, making the game more interesting doesn't necessarily always mean fudging rolls in favor of the PCs. like him, i'll also fudge in favor of the big boss monster if i accidentally made him too weak.

 

[Urbannen]

Personally I don't like playing when the DM can alter dice roll on a whim. It just rubs me the wrong way when a player has a great time because he "just" pulled out of a bad situation, when his luck is only due to DM adjudication. It's the thrill of winning at gambling, but the risk of losing is illusory. My personal feeling when I'm DMing is that you shouldn't fake die rolls. Instead, you should give the PCs fate points that they can cash in to avoid tragedy. That way the players still know that the game world's mechanics are consistent, but since they are the heroes of the game, they have special luck. I don't think a lot of people agree with this, or rather, there are a lot of different philosophies concerning DM fudging. I've been told by one player that he didn't like fate points; my impression was he preferred that I fudge and not tell him. As a player it does get old when you cast "save or be incapacitated" spells and important NPCs never ever fail their saves.

 

[Tsyr]

It just rubs me the wrong way when a player has a great time because he "just" pulled out of a bad situation, when his luck is only due to DM adjudication. It's the thrill of winning at gambling, but the risk of losing is illusory.

...So, basicly, it bothers you to see happy players if the DM made them happy?

*boggle*

I thought the game was supposed to be about having a good time... who cares *why* it's a good time, as long as it is...

That's my view, anyhow...

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

When I do my very infrequent DMing, I think I'd cheat to preserve the fun of the game, no other reason.

EG, it's not fun if by a set of fluke rolling the DM wipes out half the group with one spell, or if the players face a foe they can't defeat. But if they have time to prepare and know exactly what they're up against, then the dice fall where they may.

Don't punish player mistakes. The dice will do that by themselves. But if the players do something brilliant, maybe a little extra on the roll might be in order. But don't tell them...

 

[Crothian]

DM's don't cheat, they improvise.

 

[Siridar]

DM's don't cheat, they improvise.

Right! Just what the Oozemaster said.


I "improvise" to make things interesting, keep the game going and to make it fun. I "improvise" for the players and against them, but not to protect any of my plots or NPCs specifically. I can always come up with a new plot hook to go back to an old plot idea or introduce an new master villain NPC.

It's all about having fun, for everyone involved.

If I do something stupid (as the GM) then i should "improvise" to fix my mistake. If my players do something stupid and I give absolutely no warning, then I should fix my mistake. If my players do something stupid and ignore my warnings/advice, then let the dice fall where they may.

 

[S'mon]

When I do my very infrequent DMing, I think I'd cheat to preserve the fun of the game, no other reason.

EG, it's not fun if by a set of fluke rolling the DM wipes out half the group with one spell, or if the players face a foe they can't defeat.

Sometimes it's fun for the DM, though...

 

[Ruined]

I 'cheat' a lot less than I used to. I've run games for many a year, and we've all had a lot of fun. But I step back and realize that I may take it too easy on players at times.

" Ah, you cast that spell that blinds creatures, well it only partially works on the beholder. It blinds two eyes (DM note the Disintegrate eye and the Death ray)".

I'm not out to kill characters - I've never been one to go for body counts like other DMs I know. But I want it to really feel like the characters are risking their lives. I enjoy this in games I play in, and I'm sure the players do as well. So I'm pulling punches less and less, and I think it's working well.