Where is 4E incomplete? Forked: Does 4E have staying power?

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I might WANT a hot topless girl in the back seat of my car at all times ready to give me a neck massage.... But my car still performs all the functions it's designed to perform without said girl.

One wonders what your new wife might say about such an "option package" on your car? ;)
 

If you answer was I didn't "need" them to complete the game in the past, your answer should still be the same.

I didn't need them in the past because the initial 3 books provided the important things. This is no longer the case.

Printing core on the cover doesn't change anything aside from making it more apparent that WoTC thinks these suppliments will add value to your game.


Printing core on the cover doesn't change anything aside from making it more apparent that WoTC thinks that people will be more inclined to buy them.

You might WANT a druid class, but the game does not require one in order to function.

Functionality is a different issue than completeness of what D&D core is supposed to contain. Any given rules set can function without certain D&D elements obviously. Calling these functional rules sets D&D isn't accurate.
 
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Functionality is a different issue than completeness of what D&D core is supposed to contain. Any given rules set can function without certain D&D elements obviously. Calling these functional rules sets D&D isn't accurate.

So which edition of D&D is the only true edition then?? Because, if I recall correctly, they all have different classes and races included in their PHB/MM/DMG set.
 

In 3e (later 3.5e), I ran the game for 8 years mostly in a core-rules-only vein, and didn't feel the game at all lacking. With 4e, I couldn't imagine trying the same - had I been converted I would most certainly have picked up at the very least PHB/DMG/MM 2 and immediately incorporated them into the game.

I won't say that 4e is incomplete, because I don't believe that (it's clearly a complete game, and it includes at least as many options as the BEC (not quite M) D&D which served as my introduction to the game). However, it does seem to be somewhat limited in the range of options that are supported at the outset, and certainly is far more limited than 3e ever did.
 


Where exactly is core 4E incomplete, compared to 3E core?

As you have seen, what constitutes "incomplete" varies from individual to individual. I got the core 4e books when they were released, intent upon using 4e to flesh out a campaign concept I've had on the back-burner for years. Alas, that concept requires greenhags, awakened animals, and druids. Oh well.

The 4e MM seemed immediate incomplete not only in the lack of expected entries (merfolk, locathah, sea elf, greenhag annis, sea hag, etc) but also in the lack of fluff I was accustomed to. To me, the 3.5e MM represents the best Monster Manual ever produced for D&D. the 4e MM looks like a stack of trading cards taped into a blank book.

I could continue, of course; planar changes (I like the ethereal and separate erinyes and succubi), lack of expected races and classes (druids and bards are personal favorites), continued reliance on miniatures, lack of Mac support for elements of the DDI, and the shift away from using monsters as PCs (what drew me to 3e in the first place) are all defects in 4e... in my opinion. Granted, no two DMs run their games the same way. 4e as written may be perfectly fine for some.

I skipped 2e, as I felt 1e was better. I am skipping 4e, as I feel 3e/3.5e/d20 is better.
 

So which edition of D&D is the only true edition then?? Because, if I recall correctly, they all have different classes and races included in their PHB/MM/DMG set.

It isn't about the inclusion or exclusion of any one particular class, spell, creature ect.

Its the cumulative effect of a lot of missing things all at once that changes the feel of the game so much.
 

This is the post that never ends... it just goes on and on my friend... somebody started posting it not knowing what itn was, and they'll continue posting it forever just because this is the post that never ends it just goes on and on my friend...

In that case, in the name of sanity, I'd better bring a stop to it.

Plus it has more than a whiff of edition warring about a number of the posts here.

Clunk.
 

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