D&D 4E Where was 4e headed before it was canned?

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Garthanos]

Martials have extremely well defined options for killing things quite dead

Yes you can kill it. just like that building size tank its your only trick mr one trick pony... let spell casters do every other awesome but you get one. Largely D&D got better at letting them do that one trick at least and you are no longer worse than the Druids bear.

 

[Ratskinner]

Regarding "freeform"

IME. It works, but I think it requires things like a countdown mechanic to work with or things like Fate's aspects that can be created as needed, and be used in a well-defined fashion. (By which I mean, avoiding the "simulative" aspects of typical D&D/rpgs. Lacking that kind of structure (as D&D usually has) just leaves everything hanging in the wind. (Which is not necessarily a bad thing, either.)

Just my $.02

 

[Parmandur]

Yes you can kill it. just like that building size tank its your only trick mr one trick pony... let spell casters do every other awesome but you get one. Largely D&D got better at letting them do that one trick at least and you are no longer worse than the Druids bear.

But again, actual play experience of 5E does show that the Skill system allows for quite a lot of improvisation, moreso than a tightly wound system like spell-casting allows for.

 

[Parmandur]

Regarding "freeform"

IME. It works, but I think it requires things like a countdown mechanic to work with or things like Fate's aspects that can be created as needed, and be used in a well-defined fashion. (By which I mean, avoiding the "simulative" aspects of typical D&D/rpgs. Lacking that kind of structure (as D&D usually has) just leaves everything hanging in the wind. (Which is not necessarily a bad thing, either.)

Just my $.02

There are Inspiration points in 5E, and the elegance of the system does encourage out of the box thinking.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Garthanos]

I really think you are missing some fundamental points (from my perspective).

A negotiation requires that the parties have something they can put forward and invest in the process something to they can do to up the stakes of getting the desired results .... if I am stuck with a very singular difficulty judgement from a DM I didnt really get to negotiate.

I have had people expend an encounter power to help an improvised page 42 maneuver work or base a page 42 style maneuver as a power except kicked up or adjusted by circumstances (ie the powers arent limiting they can be the starting point ).

Inspiration was mentioned as something 5e has it seems little too little but I suppose a table with a generous DM could leverage it a lot more.

 

[Garthanos]

There are Inspiration points in 5E

Sorry it took a while for me to acknowledge those. I have seen them go unused entirely in 2 out of 3 tables I have seen sadly.

 

[Parmandur]

A negotiation requires that the parties have something they can put forward and invest in the process something to they can do to up the stakes of getting the desired results .... if I am stuck with a very singular difficulty judgement from a DM I didnt really get to negotiate.

I have had people expend an encounter power to help an improvised page 42 maneuver work or base a page 42 style maneuver as a power except kicked up or adjusted by circumstances (ie the powers arent limiting they can be the starting point ).

Inspiration was mentioned as something 5e has it seems little too little but I suppose a table with a generous DM could leverage it a lot more.

I think I can see where you are coming from: I play with close family and friends exclusively, so the investment is in my experience is going "Hey, man, I'd love to try this" and the DM saying "I'd love it if you tried, that sounds awesome."

5E works for me in this regard: but in the cases of less personal surroundings, I can understand the advantage of a more rigid system detailing the player's abilities and options.

 

[Parmandur]

Sorry it took a while for me to acknowledge those. I have seen them go unused entirely in 2 out of 3 tables I have seen sadly.

The mechanic is often overlooked, partly I'd say because they aren't usually needed to accomplish cool actions, and require bookkeeping.