D&D 5E (2014) Wherein we discuss spells and other magical things.

[Dannyalcatraz]

The spell description clearly prevents light and sound from reaching the occupant.

...as long as it is damaging. The ORS is a force effect spell- AFAIK, no force effect spell produces an object described as "opaque." Most that do have explicit descriptions are described as "transparent" or "translucent". ORS, though, is silent.

Besides that, if the ORS isn't at least translucent, how will the occupant navigate while hamstring? Why even incorporate that exception to the transferral of energy limitations?

You say energy can't cross the sphere except when it can.

Clearly this is so- the occupant is not rendered weightless, ergo, gravity affects the occupant at least that much.

There is also some benign level transmission of heat energy- the occupant isn't going to roast in there from his own actions.

You say the sphere exerts force, but then deny it can exert force.

Honestly, I do not recall asserting the ORS can exert force. Remind me, if you can?

Edit: is this what you're talking about, where I point this out as an exception to ORS's "nothing can cross the barrier" language?

It is an exception because the force exerted inside the sphere is being transferred to the outside world, creating motion. It is behaving exactly as a hamster ball would.

If the energy were not being transferred outside the sphere, the occupant could run around the inside like motorcycle riders in the Sphere of Death without actually moving the sphere.

To clarify: to move, the sphere has to exert force on the environment. The only source of force to do so when "hamstering" is the sphere's occupant. Therefore force is being transferred across the sphere's barrier.

 

[steeldragons]

Notice, also, that the sphere is "resilient," not "entirely invulnerable in all ways."

Besides that, it's just occurred to me...the occupant is not being "damaged" by hitting the ground. They're being damaged by the strain on their body decelerating from 100 to 0 mph in an instant [which the body can not endure]. That "damaging effect" is not coming from outside the sphere. That's happening inside the sphere, to the occupant themself. Not an arrow or a fireball or a claw swipe, nothing to do with the sphere really at all...the occupant's body going, going, going, stopped...inside the protective sphere that stops everything from OUTSIDE the sphere. Crunch snap gurgle splat.

EDIT: And a dozen orcs dropping to the ground in howls of pain and outrage at the interruption of their smoke break from the energy outside the sphere -that cannot pass inside- shooting out from where the sphere lands...naturally. /EDIT

 

[Cognomen's Cassowary]

What's the alternative? That the sphere just continues moving? Magically engages retro thrusters to have a soft cushioned landing? Bounces? What?

This is exactly my point. We do not know. We cannot know. All we have from the spell description is that the sphere can be moved by creatures inside and out, and that it stops everything from passing through. Beyond that, the possibilities for what happens are infinite, because it's magic.

You keep saying, over and over, this happens and that happens, always treating the sphere as a physical object, even after you have stated that it is not a physical object and has magical properties. It was fun for a while to hash out the potential implications, but your spiraling puerility has put an end to that. What I am saying now is, for actually playing, my interest is in maintaining a consistent behavior of the spell within its intended function, and that means the creature inside the sphere does not take damage from the impact of things outside the sphere.

Rationalize that with psuedo-physical blather like retro-thrusters and inertial dampers all you need to. I am fine saying that the sphere and object simply stop and the sphere absorbs all of the energy from both sides of the would-be impact. That is consistent with the spell as described.

I'll keep this simple. My position is that if the sphere's velocity changes suddenly from 30 mph to 0 mph, the occupant's velocity does not change until they hit the wall of the sphere a few milliseconds later at which point they will decelerate from 30 mph to 0 mph causing appropriate damage. Nothing outside of the sphere can or does affect the interaction of the occupant with the sphere.

Yes, you have stated your position dozens of times. One more won't fix it. There is nothing in the spell description which says that the interaction happens the way you describe at all. You are treating the sphere as an ordinary physical object, when it is not one. Does the occupant rapidly decelerate? We don't know. Will the occupant forcefully hit the wall of the sphere? We don't know. Will the sphere rapidly decelerate? We don't know. Does the sphere forcefully hit the ground? We don't know. Do the sphere and its occupant accelerate as they fall? We don't know. Do they fall at all? We don't know.

Your entire position is predicated on treating this as a series of ordinary physical interactions, when it is not one. Because there is so much we do not know about how this works, a DM could play it in a variety of ways. I would look at the intent of the spell, which is, again, that the creature inside the sphere takes no damage from things hitting the outside.

I don't see anything that contradicts that. The spell does not state that the occupant is weightless, nor does it state that the occupant cannot gain momentum or be affected by gravity. The spell does not state that the sphere has effects similar to feather fall. The sphere stops all physical objects, including the occupant.

The question has never been whether the sphere stops all physical objects, including the occupant. The question has been whether the occupant takes falling damage. Your position, that the occupant takes falling damage from hitting the inside of the sphere, relies on treating the sphere as an ordinary physical object that has ordinary physical interactions. That is your ruling to make, but because it is not explicit in the spell, you cannot state definitively that it is the way the situation would play out. I would make a contrary ruling, because I think that yours runs counter to the described function and intended use of the spell.

ROFL! You are SO cute when you get snarky like that! It's just adorable. I bet you are one of the cutest little twelve year olds!

Yup, still pissier. Congratulations! You win the pissing contest. All you had to do was spoil the discussion.

 

[Oofta]

Notice, also, that the sphere is "resilient," not "entirely invulnerable in all ways."

Besides that, it's just occurred to me...the occupant is not being "damaged" by hitting the ground. They're being damaged by the strain on their body decelerating from 100 to 0 mph in an instant [which the body can not endure]. That "damaging effect" is not coming from outside the sphere. That's happening inside the sphere, to the occupant themself. Not an arrow or a fireball or a claw swipe, nothing to do with the sphere really at all...the occupant's body going, going, going, stopped...inside the protective sphere that stops everything from OUTSIDE the sphere. Crunch snap gurgle splat.

EDIT: And a dozen orcs dropping to the ground in howls of pain and outrage at the interruption of their smoke break from the energy outside the sphere -that cannot pass inside- shooting out from where the sphere lands...naturally. /EDIT

Which has been my point. The sphere no more prevents damage from sudden deceleration than it would if the occupant pulled out a hammer and hit themselves on the head with it.

 

[steeldragons]

This is exactly my point. We do not know. We cannot know. All we have from the spell description is that the sphere can be moved by creatures inside and out, and that it stops everything from passing through. Beyond that, the possibilities for what happens are infinite, because it's magic.

EUREKA!

So, the sphere continues "falling" into the ground, so the ground is then INSIDE the sphere...crack snap gurgle splat...and then pressed into jelly by the back end of the sphere continuing into the ground until it is stopped by smushing the occupants remains into something reminiscent of a fruit rollup!

Whew! Glad we cleared this all up.

Well done, all around.

 

[Oofta]

This is exactly my point. We do not know. We cannot know. All we have from the spell description is that the sphere can be moved by creatures inside and out, and that it stops everything from passing through. Beyond that, the possibilities for what happens are infinite, because it's magic.

I make the assumption that unless specifically overridden by the rules the world works like the real world. I don't know how you could run a consistent believable game otherwise.

If someone walks over a cliff edge they fall. If someone in the sphere hamster balls over a cliff edge, I see no reason to believe they would not fall since it's established that the sphere can be moved by the occupant and other creatures outside the sphere.

Your entire position is predicated on treating this as a series of ordinary physical interactions

Unless the rules specifically say not to, yes. The rules override very specific aspects of the real world, in this case encasing the target in an impenetrable sphere that can be moved. It does not say it protects the occupant from all damage, just damage that originates from outside the sphere.

What happens if the sphere falls off a cliff is not covered in the spell description. I've given my reasons for why I would rule the way I do, and attempted to civilly discuss those reasons. I see a few viable alternatives, the most logical is the one I've stated.

I've repeatedly stated that other options are viable only to be met with YOU F'IN IDJUT YOU'RE WRONG!

Yup, still pissier. Congratulations! You win the pissing contest. All you had to do was spoil the discussion.

It's good to know I can rely on some things. The sun rising in the east, the sky being blue, you insulting me no matter what I say. Good times.

 

[Lanefan]

Fair answer, but two things. First, your position still requires a fairly big assumption about how the gravitational interaction passes a barrier that either cannot be modeled in physics or has exceptional physical properties with unknowable ramifications. The occupant only accelerates downward if the force of gravity is acting on it (and perhaps only if he or she uses an action to push the sphere downward).

If gravity doesn't pass through the sphere to affect the occupant then there goes hamstering; but the spell allows for hamstering therefore gravity must affect the occupant.

Can we all agree on that much?

Good.

Next: as gravity affects the occupant when the sphere is on the ground it naturally follows that gravity affects the occupant when the sphere is not on the ground; thus meaning either the sphere has to replace the ground or that both occupant and sphere are going to fall toward the ground (for the sake of this I'll ignore crosswinds). Again due to the spell allowing hamstering, thus meaning the occupant can exert physical pressure on the sphere in order to make it move, it's logical that the downward pressure exerted by the occupant on the sphere "floor" due to gravity is going to push the sphere down, and both will fall.

Everyone still with me? If not, say so.

Now, at what speed they fall is very much open to debate; but again due to logic I'm going to go with the about-30-mph terminal velocity* from Cognomen's calculations, and here's why. It's known that the sphere is affected by outside agencies in that it sits on the ground (rather than plummet into it) and that it can be moved by external physical forces e.g. giants playing football. Therefore the air will also affect it as wind resistance when it tries to fall, slowing it down considerably from the terminal velocity of just the occupant alone.

* - one variable not discussed is the weight of the occupant; terminal velocity for a sphere containing a Hobbit will be considerably less than for a sphere containing a rhino.

Does anyone disagree yet? Speak up if you do.

So, the primary question: what happens when an occupied sphere impacts something else at speed? This one, as we've seen, is open to interpretation and might have to be ruled on table by table.

And a secondary question: if the sphere ends up rolling or tumbling, what happens to the occupant? Do they always stay upright? Do they roll or tumble also; and if yes are they protected from damage or not; and are they protected from motion sickness or not?

For my own part, I answer both primary and secondary questions with "ouch" while well realizing others' mileage may vary.

Lan-"still wondering what happens if someone hamsters a sphere out into a lake"-efan

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Lan-"still wondering what happens if someone hamsters a sphere out into a lake"-efan

They continue moving at the same hamsterball pace, until after @1 minute, they get very, very wet.

 

[Lanefan]

They continue moving at the same hamsterball pace, until after @1 minute, they get very, very wet.

Moving at the same pace on the surface? Partly submerged based on the weight of the occupant? Along the lake bottom?

In other words, is the sphere supposed to be airtight and-or watertight?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Moving at the same pace on the surface? Partly submerged based on the weight of the occupant? Along the lake bottom?

In other words, is the sphere supposed to be airtight and-or watertight?

Well...

Nothing---not physical objects, energy, or other spell effects---can pass through the barrier, in or out, though a creature in the sphere can breathe there.

Water is a physical object, so cannot get in- it is watertight. So it should be buoyant.

The occupant can breathe, presumably as long as there is air around the ORS- it says nothing about generating air.*

Which means it might get weird is if the spell were cast underwater around an air-breather, or if the occupant opened a decanter of endless water within it...


* of course, as it is an absolute flat statement, perhaps the occupant CAN breathe in there, regardless of the environment outside or within, via magic.