Which game would you recommend?

[Bluenose]

You could give Legends of Anglerre a try, it's based in the FATE system. Very few rules, a lot of customization for characters and a lot of power for the GM and the players at the same time to craft a great story.

An advantage of this option is that once you get used to how the rules work there are a lot of other FATE-based games that work the same way, and which cover different genres to fantasy. Starblazer Adventures, Strands of Fate, Dresden Files. One thing worth noting is that it also has rules for vehicles, organisations, and nations all in one book, as well as advice on setting creation. The actual rules are quite slim.

Another potentially low-combat, simple rules system is HeroQuest. Characters are highly customisable, although there is no "minigame" of building characters - it's not as if the customisation makes your character stronger or weaker in the game.

HeroQuest does need a GM whose good at kicking things off with compelling situations, and whose good at adjudicating the outcomes of PC actions on the fly. A GM who ran good skill challenges in 4e would probably be a good HeroQuest GM,

Heroquest (I recommend version 2 strongly) is a system which takes some getting used to, for both GMs and players. If you take to it, the sky is the limit, but a lot of people don't or won't. It's not a system where the detail of how something is done usually matters, just what the results are. I've seen a two-weeek seige resolved in two dice rolls, and if that isn't to your taste it probably isn't for you.

 

[Ariosto]

one of us has played traveler, another shadowrun, another the savage adventure thing, another rifts and another some awesome sounding tmnt rpg.

As far as I know, the only one legally licensed was Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness, by estimable Erick Wujcik, published by Palladium Books.

That's just one of a number of games Palladium has published with variations on the same basic rules. Rifts is another. If you're looking for a "sword and sorcery" or "D&D-ish" kind of thing, then The Palladium Fantasy RPG might be worth a look. Many people love the setting, but are not so enthusiastic about the rules. I personally enjoyed the first edition and first few books, but am not familiar with more recent developments.

Having greatly enjoyed another game by the designer (the original Fields of Honor), I picked up Savage Worlds. It seemed just "meh" to me, and that one copy on a remainders sale shelf is all I've seen of it in my neighborhood. SW is a "general purpose" design, with special flavors apparently coming in from setting supplements (more or less on generic lines, e.g., "steampunk" or "supernatural gothic").

It seems to be very popular elsewhere, though, and its fans are probably better equipped to explain why.

Castles & Crusades is basically the same story, less recognizing the author's name. I don't know how much work it would be to mix in 4e "character customization", but bits from 2e and 3e look to be fairly easy to borrow. It doesn't seem to have an impressive setting attached.

Earthdawn was -- and is? -- a D&D-ish game descended from Shadowrun, another with a strongly developed setting.

Mongoose Traveller is a new game somewhat evocative of the original rules set (YMMV as to how much). It is primarily aimed at high-tech interstellar adventures, although (as on, e.g., "Star Trek") one might encounter some mighty fantastic things among the far-flung worlds of the galaxy. One difference from "Classic" Traveller is the line of supplements detailing various settings. The licensed ones so far include (IIRC) Babylon 5, Judge Dredd and Strontium Dog.

Stars Without Number is the latest sci-fi take on old D&D. It's a free PDF download from DriveThruRPG or RPGNow, so maybe worth a download if the general concept is appealing. It comes with a setting in which (from my brief skim of the book) interstellar commerce depends on psychics -- magician/cleric equivalents -- able to open space-warp "gates". Some generations ago, a psychic "scream" from beyond known space wiped out that civilization.

 

[Ariosto]

I don't know what for you makes 4e "too much like a skirmish game". However, for me I would say that the amount of time (an hour or more) that a fight takes up in 4e is a key factor. In my experience, 3e tends also to be a drag that way.

In games such as Traveller and RuneQuest, a single hit is often enough to put someone hors de combat. That alone tends to make for briefer (and perhaps fewer) fights, even if the resolution of each shot is done with bells and whistles.

In old D&D, 1st-level characters are normally in that position, but high-level ones tend to avoid getting into it. They start with a lot of points, and usually magical healing resources, and get worn down gradually. (Magic-users and thieves are more vulnerable.)

Rarely (in my experience) does the game feature a drawn out duel to the death between figures with 40+ hit points. Moreover, such figures tend to land weapon hits (as opposed to spells) on each other more often, so the rate of taking damage goes up along with the capacity to take it. (YMMV, depending on what kind of defenses you have afoot in your campaign.)

Above all, the default "combat system" is extremely minimal. The normal scale of resolution is 10 foot (roughly 3 meter) or 10 yard (about 10 meter) increments, versus (e.g.) five-foot squares in 4e. Most of what other games treat in discrete detail gets assumed in a nominal minute of activity, subsumed in a simple roll "to hit" and another for "damage" -- both of which are by default thoroughly abstract, rather than modeling the process blow by blow.

 

[beldar1215]

I would also put a vote in for Savage Worlds. I currently run 2 SW games. I'm running Deadlands and Evernight (Fantasy game). The rules are easy to pick-up. Character creation is short, but I think you can get a very wide variety of characters. Savage Worlds is a great system for so many different types of games. A huge plus is the core rulebook is only $10!!!


Beldar

 

[bruce_lombardo]

I would recommend Pathfinder. My group has been with it for over 2 years. Since Alpha. We note on our character sheets and spell sheets what type of bonuses are given so we're not rule lawyering all the damn time.

But the game is enjoyable and backwards compatible if you really want to break your game. Please be aware that you will break it with the introduction with everything that even WOTC did.

It is a tight system and requires little management to keep your players under wraps. Or if you want them to go all out, let them. Then just adjust your monsters and tactics accordingly.

I'm just saying.

-BL

 

[GeorgeFields]

HackMaster!

I'll second this one, but I'll elaborate a bit more on it.

HackMaster Basic is an introductory to the new version of HackMaster.

It's a modern throwback to AD&D, but the character power level is about half of what AD&D had. A 6th level fighter in HM is about equivalent to a 3rd level fighter from AD&D.

Combat is very similar except that AC is gone. Attack rolls are opposed by defense rolls. Armor gives you a defense penalty but absorbs damage. Shield, OTOH, give a defense bonus AND absorb damage.
Even though hit points act as in AD&D, all wound heal separately. A 1 hp wound takes a day to heal while a 2 hp wound will become a 1 hp wound in 2 days and heal in one more. So, a character with 5 wounds of 1 hp each will have them all heal in one day as opposed to a character having a 5 hit point wound healing in 15 (5+4+3+2+1). Magical healing affects one wound, but any excess will roll over to another wound.

Skills are %-based and not tied to your character level. It is possible, however unlikely, that a character could have a score of 100% in a skill.

Most dice 'penetrate'. If you roll the maximum, you roll again at '-1' and keep doing so as long as you keep rolling maximum on the die.
My last session, I had an orc 'penetrate' on his 2d8 damage roll for a total of 38 damage. The player burned off 10 'honor points' to force a damage re-roll.

Honor is an in-game mechanic that helps the players survive, but don't let it get too low, or you'll be looked down upon and have in-game penalties if it gets extremely low.

Mages use a combination of spell points and memorization. Any mage a spell knows can be cast without being memorized, but it costs twice as many spell points. Spell points can also be used to increase the effectiveness of a spell.

It has something of a learning curve; but after a year of playing it, our group rarely has to look up a rule. In fact, I don't recall any of my players even opening their book this last session.

I was ready to stop playing RPGs altogether until I found this game. It's definitely NOT the joke game many people claim it to be.

Also, the new hacklopedia of Beasts is, IMO, the greatest monster book ever written for an RPG.

 

[MortonStromgal]

Character Customization with "Powers" but you dont need minis...

I would say Hero, GURPS, Mutants and Masterminds or possibly even the 4th Edition of Shadowrun.

If you don't mind creating the world and setting up powers go with Hero, if you want the world set up and not have to create everything go with Shadowrun. GURPS and Mutants and Masterminds are somewhere in the middle.

thats said minis are less important with 3.5 and Pathfinder but I find you still need them for some feats/powers.

 

[ArghMark]

Ars Magica! Best magic system ever. Best world setting ever. Ability to play city shaking magi!

A little heavy on the rules but its nothing more complex than 3e I find.

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

Savage Worlds: The book is $9.99, and it will serve you very well for many genres. It's also some of the most fun I've ever had at the gaming table, and the mechanics actually add to that.

Pathfinder: If you're looking for more D&D, this is the place to go.

Shadowrun: My one true love. It's a deep and complex game and setting.

 

[clearstream]

Savage Worlds with perhaps the Hellfrost campaign setting (needs the Fantasy) rules, is quite nice. For me the character customisation isn't as good as D&D 3.5, which is a tremendous game - probably the pinnacle of D&D design to date, not that 4th doesn't contain some good ideas. However, 3.5 is rules rich. The weakness of Savage Worlds in my opinion is that the character development is just a lot lighter than D&D. On the other hand, you can run complex fights with Savage Worlds very quickly, and still feel like everyone played a proper part.

Runequest or Earthdawn are both fun, with quick fights. I guess Runequest is a bit creaky by now, but if you can get hold of the Griffin Mountain campaign setting you can have an expansive, rolling campaign that is really great to play. Earthdawn has its own definite feel, but certainly is a good alternative to vanilla fantasy.

I played a lot of systems before reaching D&D 3.5. I've kind of settled there because it offers so much entertainment. I play it with the Forgotten Realms campaign guide, and the core three books (well, I use the Rules Compendium) and that works wonderfully. So I would flat recommend getting to grips with 3.5. If not, perhaps Savage Worlds.