Which "new" adventures are classics?

[Dykstrav]

This is a topic worth considering, although I do believe that it's too early to definitively consider many classics for the 4E era.

What does "classic" mean for adventures, anyway? The conventional definition is that a "classic" is exemplary of its style or that it has a timeless quality. I'd posit that for D&D, a classic adventure is one that is so well-known and well-received that it has become part of the lexicon we use to describe the game. An adventure that almost everyone who has played the game has played, or has at least heard discussed as a model of design. In this sense, I'd consider the following adventures (across several editions and publishers) to be classics:

The Keep on the Borderlands (B2): Sure, it's only a few caverns chock-full of monsters near a place to rest. But the sheer number of players who have been through the Caves of Chaos certainly qualifies the adventure as part of many player's first experiences with the game.

Ravenloft (I6): Ravenloft has been held up for decades as a paragon of good design. Not only did Ravenloft draw upon a literary and cinematic basis, it also used familiar D&D monsters in ways that fit the story well and the adventure has some serious replay value, even if you've played through it before (through the use of the villain's variable goals). I've run Ravenloft in every edition of D&D so far and players have always loved it.

The Ruins of Undermountain: This one is a classic simply because it embodies the old-school love of vast complexes that can serve as the basis of an entire campaign. I understand that it's currently being used in the RPGA as the basis for material for Living Forgotten Realms.

The Sunless Citadel: Many players first experienced 3E through this adventure. It's sort of like the Keep on the Borderlands for 3E in that respect. Not only does it showcase the best of a new edition, but it incorporates some interesting new ideas as well. The story showcases a new type of monster, and it's notable for introducing a druid as a villain and includes one of the most fan-loved NPCs ever (Meepo).

Red Hand of Doom: For a while, WotC didn't make any printed adventures. They got back into the swing of adventure design with Red Hand of Doom, which not only had an interesting story, monsters, and NPCS, but also incorporated material from its (then) current history of published products. Seeing the victory point system from Heroes of Battle in actual play was a real treat. It also had interesting twists on classic monsters, such as a druidic lich with ghostly animals. More than anything previously published, this adventure showcased the flexibility of D&D's mechanics and source material.

Keep on the Shadowfell: Although this adventure gets mixed reviews, I still consider it a classic. Many 4E players discuss their experiences in this adventure when they join a new group, which I think makes it worthy of inclusion. It's a favorite with DMs too, since it includes the neat maps for several encounters (albeit most of them are reprints).

Although I think their status as classics is disputable, I'd like to give honorable mention to the following:

Dragonlance: The original Dragonlance saga is fondly remembered by many older gamers. Ten years ago, I would have included the original Dragonlance adventures as classics without hesitation. However, it's getting tougher and tougher to find people who actually played through these adventures, despite updated support in the 3.5 era. Players just don't seem to much care for Dragonlance any more.

Rappan Athuk Reloaded: Rappan Athuk scratches a primordial gaming itch within me like no other product. It's so reminiscent of my early days of gaming that I'd be thrilled to run this entire thing from beginning to end. Sure, it's just a big dungeon crawl--but it's a good dungeon crawl. If you enjoy that style, Rappan Athuk can satisfy in droves. However, I'd hesitate to call it a classic simply because so many people don't enjoy that play style.

 

[Mark Hope]

Going to limit my list to my top 3. There's no 4e on here, because I don't know anything at all about 4e . From what I hear, though, Keep on the Shadowfell is likely to endure due to shared play experience, if nothing else.

1) Sunless Citadel - 3e's opener. Plus, as mentioned above, it has Meepo.
2) Rappan Athuk - the definitive mega-dungeon, yet with more detail and depth than a dozen smaller modules.
3) Tomb of Abysthor - fantastic, flavourful dungeon in great 1e style.
4) Ptolus - yeah, it's a cheat because it's more than 3 and it's not just an adventure. But this is a milestone in gaming and should be on the list.

So there you go, my three. Plus one.

 

[TerraDave]

Good thread.

As I noted in the other thread, one reason you may have so many early classic modules, is that you had so many modules, about 140 from 78-88 not including tournament one-offs, compilations, etc.

But, with the 3rd parties, you also did have a ton of stuff for 3E. And some of it was really, really good.

Still, the advantage here lies with the old, and most classics people still cite tend to come from the early years (83 or earlier). Here is why I think that is, and newer stuff has a harder time:

Originality: The advantages of being first here are obvious. You can do a very good adventure with drow, slavers, giants, vampire in a castle…but you will never be seen as “original” as you could be.

Common Experience: Again, the advantage is obvious. The early modules were at first the only ones around, and then were kept in print for years. And they stuck, being a constant point of reference.

Need to establish the product: Not as obvious…but those early adventures were actually pretty good. At that point OD&D had been out for a while, people had their own dungeons, so it was clear that the mods needed to provide something beyond the ordinary. And they did, often boldly so. They also tended to have a lot of it, with extensive detail and lots and lots of little tricks and twists. And it was something that the top designers would be willing to spend time on, and could often draw on their own years of play experience for.

Latter on, “unneeded” detail would tend to disappear, resources devoted to the product would go down and the bar would lower as it was taken for granted that if you made a module, someone would probably buy it.

Now, newer products also have their advantages. And the idea that if you just print something it will be bought I think is long gone.

Production values: Are almost certainly higher, especially compared to the early classics. (though there are arguably some exceptions).

Coherence: Again, a good modern module is going to be clearer.

Mechanical soundness: Still a little hit or miss, but later editions do tend to provide more guidance in this area.

Better mix of place or plot: It will be neither fully place or event driven, but should have a nice mix of the two, allowing a good amount of player choice, but still have some overarching elements.

The problem: all these things are expected. You get 0 extra credit for it.

Ok, now that I have set the bar so high, proceed .

 

[Wicht]

My list of classics from the 3e era and following would include:
The Sunless Citadel
The Crucible of Freya
Nemorhen's Vault
Rappan Athuk
Burnt Offerings

 

[the Jester]

I'd say a lot of the listed modules will NOT stand the test of time- Scales of War and Keep on the Shadowfell, I'm looking at you. KotS might end up considered a classic, but it's really not that good, and if it is, it's simply because it was the first 4e module.

I do think the following are likely to be remembered as classics in 10-20 years:

Red Hand of Doom
Sunless Citadel
Speaker in Dreams
King of the Trollhaunt Warrens
Demon Queen's Enclave
Age of Worms

 

[Festivus]

For Adventure Paths and the like, I'd suggest that nominating all 12 adventures is probably overkill, unless all 12 have that certain something, and I'd suggest that's not the case.

Having said that, I'd be more than happy to nominate The Whispering Cairn, Part 1 of The Age of Worms AP. It has a creepy dungeon, a couple of nice twists, a great villain in the final showdown and sufficient background material with it to run a few side adventurs in Diamond Lake. Even if you don't plan to run the whole AP, I don't think that there's a better "official" First-Level adventure out there for 3.xE.

I always point to Whispering Cairn when people ask about classic 3.x adventures... my friends still talk about it from time to time, and that's my measure of classic. Filge is pretty much unforgettable, as ar emany other characters in town. The dungeon is cool and creepy, with novel traps that fit the theme, and the town of Diamond Lake is a great launching point for many an adventure. So that's my vote for classic 3.x

As for 4E, I really haven't played one yet that's official and I totally thought was a classic. I think Keep on the Shadowfell will become one just because of it being first but about the best adventure I have run in 4E is the Village of Hommlet freebie WoTC sent out (and that was pretty much a 1E adventure reworked with 4E stat blocks).

 

[SoldierBlue]

My :"modern classics":

1) Whispering Cairn. Interesting dungeon set-up, cool villains, the dungeon was "believable within its own construct"

2) Burnt Offerings. My whole party died there, but it doesn't take away from how cool it is. DMed right, and the party should care what happens to Sandpoint...

3) Sunless Citadel. 3.0's Keep on the Borderlands.

Not classics:

1) Keep on the Shadowfell. Needs editing, too hard for the levels, too boring...

2) Fortress of the Juan-Ti...

 

[Celebrim]

There are very few. To begin with, I automatically disqualify any adventure which is just trading in on the reputation of an actual classic module. While some of these modules are actually pretty good in their own right, they are generally inferior to the original and loved mostly because they expand on something beloved.

That leaves a very small list:

1) Sunless Citadel
2) The Whispering Cairn

In my opinion, TWC is one of the finest modules ever written. It is almost perfect, and by that I mean, I am not tempted to alter or expand on it in almost any fashion which is really unusual for me. The only thing I might change is to make the undead kid a bit creepier, alien, and more well ghostly, but that's really more a matter of style and presentation than anything else. The only real problem with the module is that it is the introduction to an adventure path, and that AP itself is extremely uneven in quality (IMO).

There are a couple of other possibilities I'm fairly impressed with but which miss the mark slightly:

3) Of Sound Mind: Overly tied to a particular mechanical implementation (psionics), suffers from some descriptive writing that just gets worse the more you think about it, presents a dragon in a way that isn't draconic enough for my tastes, and too dangerous for stock 1st level characters, but a very varied and inventive scenario with good RP, combat, and puzzle challenges.
4) J1: Entombed with the Pharoahs: Great set peice encounters but the scale of the dungeon is simply too limited for its grand theme, and there are some potential game mastery problems with having this many proactive NPCs that make it challenging to run and potentially self-derailing.

There are a few that I'd have to actually play before I'd dare an opinion, chiefly 'Red Hand of Doom'. Burnt Offerings and the AP path it starts out looks really good on paper.

Actually, I'd settle for a list of superb new adventures, much less classic ones.

 

[The Shaman]

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

Great Topic!

I agree with the earlier comments on Rappan Athuk and the Whispering Cairn. Rappan Athuk is the definitive megadungeon, and The Whispering Cairn is an awesome 1st level module.

In my mind the Savage Tide Adventure Path belongs in there somewhere. I'm not sure which of its adventures I would pick , though. Maybe There Is No Honor?

Ken