Who Kills Your PCs?

[Lanefan]

Rarely but it happens. I'd say in the less than 10 percent range. Of course that might change now that I"m incorporating some of Monte Cooks suggestions from the latest Dungeon magazine. He suggests providing a random element for such spells as fireball and such to be off a bit. It makes perfect sense if you're getting away from games that get "too tactical". When you're in combat you hardly have the time to count squares and ft. He suggestes a random chance that the spell will be off a certain number of feet.

Absolutely! We put that in about 20 years ago, that anything (including spells) that required aim or placement needed a (usually very easy) roll to hit; it just made sense.

I voted 25-50 range, as the question specified *my* characters, and mine tend to get killed in the most bizarre ways...and not always by the enemy! And not always by *other* party members...PC-vs.-self (usually through mis-aimed spells or fumbles) can be just as deadly... But our 3e group is pretty cohesive, and despite some squabbles there's yet to be any of the truly murderous infighting I've been entertained by in other games.

In our non-3e games, PC vs. PC has at times been intentional, other times not; the infighting sometimes gets deadly.

Lanefan

 

[adwyn]

I initially noted the 25-50% category, but with a couple of hours to mull it over I realized that the number is higher, much higher. Not because of intent but friendly fire from area of effect spells probably accounts for half or more of the deaths.

Add to it the tactical errors of "I was trying to flank it, not distract it while you ran away" and the percentage begins to creep ever upwards. Well chosen risks (like the fighter who died from an AoO from a friendly barbarian while bullrushing) also boost the numbers ever upwards.

This isn't bad though. As a DM I have near infinite control over the size, power, and location of most encounters. I alone know (or can guess if I'm not paying attention) the hit points of all. I, not dice, judge morale of at least one side. With 30's years of DMing under my belt I can pull Deus ex Machinas off with subtlety and finnesse.

What I cannot control are those whose faces stare back over my screen. No wonder then that so many PC deaths stem from the choices of other players -as well it should be.

 

[kigmatzomat]

IME the party is usually not of the PvP nature. I exclude cases of possession, undeath, lycanthropy, and other curses that turn the person into a PvP fiend.

The one exception was a plane-hopping game with a large number of PCs. One established character had become a high priest of Lloth. A new PC was a Takhisis-worshiping Black Robe necromancer. The in-character hatred was immediate and intense. The Black Robe had a knack for getting in over his head completely at odds with the player's normal skills; he got caught in his own AE spells, he dim-doored into bad tactical positions, etc all while being mocked by the Llothian as a worshiper of a "backwater, barbarian of a god with no style."

Eventually they went at it hammer and tongs. The precipitating event was when the Takhisian died (again due to his own miscalculation) and the Llothian exclaimed "Wait! I can bring him back!" And then proceded to cast Animate Dead. "See, he's all better now." "He's not talking." "He's just choked up with emotion." "His eyes are glazed." "I don't see a difference." "Why doesn't he thank you then?" "Why he will by making me a sandwich! Go my friend, go make me a sandwich!"

The Llothian kept winning his fights against the Takhisian (lucky as sin, he was) and kept getting interrupted before he could sacrifice his dead foe to his Lloth. It almost became a Benny Hill episode at one point when the Llothian is carrying the Black Robe's heart around a ship cloaked in fog with multiple illusions/ghost sounds/etc adding confusion while the party tries to catch him.

It was horribly funny PvP.

I'm glad I didn't have to deal with it often.

Oh, umm, the Llothian eventually found an artifact that promised him great power if he killed his allies. Immediate agreement followed and the party was forced to kill the Llothian. They also, uh, killed the PC who picked up the artifact because, and I quote the LG party member, "Better safe than sorry."

 

[werk]

0% = none.

Following a game destroying anti-social character's actions in a game in which I played, I made it a house rule that players may not roll dice against other players.

It's always fun when a new player in my group, after a few sessions to get comfortable, says that they pick someone's pocket or tries to use diplomacy on a party member. They usually say that they do it and throw dice. I say no, no dice against fellows, remember. They then sit there for a while with a weird look on their face trying to figure out how to cause mischief. Then I ask them if they still want to do it. They usually say no, but if they say yes, I let the two of them work it out roleplaying.

So far, it's just prevented a lot of wasted time. No problems, other than teamwork.

 

[KarinsDad]

Then I realized that 33.3 PC deaths per year would be about right for the group I've played with for the last three years.

3 a month is huge. Glad I don't play in that group. It would take too long to create new PCs (assuming not every PC is raised).

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

3 a month is huge. Glad I don't play in that group. It would take too long to create new PCs (assuming not every PC is raised).

It's definitely a Tomb of Horrors like environment. You have to be at least two out of three between: really powerful, really lucky and really tactically astute.

Of course, this group has four separate campaigns going, with an average of 10 players per game.

I've had all of one character death the entire time I've played there, and that PC was raised. The only case where I had a character killed and not brought back was in a Champions game, and the character was a sidekick (her death did cause me to retire the PC, admittedly, but that was my choice). I also had another Champions PC's powers completely drained, so I retired him from 'active duty' although he remained a character involved with the group.

Another player had no character deaths at all except for one where he chose to sacrifice himself as a protest to the DM's railroading the party (this was the same campaign I had an actual PC death and resurrection).

 

[Lanefan]

Following a game destroying anti-social character's actions in a game in which I played, I made it a house rule that players may not roll dice against other players.

So if I'm playing a Thief and I want to pick the Fighter's pocket, and I can't roll the dice, that means you'd have to roll 'em...

Me, I'll keep the firefights. But then, it doesn't matter to me whether the adventure gets completed in one session, or one month, or half a year, as long as people are mostly having fun.

So far, it's just prevented a lot of wasted time.

But, as long as it's fun, is the time really wasted?

Lanefan

 

[Storyteller01]

Do players killing themselves count??


Almost had a tpk when the gun specialist was charmed. The cleric had a dispell magic handy though...

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Death happens.

Usually to misplaced spells, or misjudged saves, or charm/dominate. I'm not into intentional PvP.

 

[DonTadow]

Following a game destroying anti-social character's actions in a game in which I played, I made it a house rule that players may not roll dice against other players.

It's always fun when a new player in my group, after a few sessions to get comfortable, says that they pick someone's pocket or tries to use diplomacy on a party member. They usually say that they do it and throw dice. I say no, no dice against fellows, remember. They then sit there for a while with a weird look on their face trying to figure out how to cause mischief. Then I ask them if they still want to do it. They usually say no, but if they say yes, I let the two of them work it out roleplaying.

So far, it's just prevented a lot of wasted time. No problems, other than teamwork.

I have the same rules but I think the posters examples pretty much mean means accidently or some other type of control. For instance, you can't prevent a pc from fireballing the bbeg despite the fact that two of his party is in the way. Yo ucan't prevent the dominated pc from killing the wizard.