Why D&D ISN'T a video game (the hidden rule)

[JDJblatherings]

For example, lets say an ogre is trying to kill my rogue and I want to send him falling on his bum. Nothing fancy, just a knockdown roll.

In 3.5, I make a trip attack. The ogre gets to try to bash my brains in, then we make opposed str checks, with a bonus for being larger, etc. Long story short, unless I spend two feats to get improved trip (+combat expertise) I'm not sending that ogre down. Better stick with a straight melee attack.

Under d20 ish rules I'd have the rogue make a Bull Rush attack to knock the Ogre backwards into the flames while swining from a rope. If there was a enough of a swing from the rope I'd give the rogue a bonus to the STR check for the force of the swing. Maybe even simply let the rogue do the whole thing as a sneak attack that did subdual damage.

As for video/computer gamishness I've played plenty of video games where I knocked down a baddie wihtout pushing the "knock them down" button.

 

[Thanee]

This is what killed 4e for me... I am completely aware that its in the "House Rules" section... but the fact they included it at all... IN a role playing game... I'm not even a DM and I found this offensive and belittling...

I like it and will surely try it... D&D the boardgame, why not? Sounds like fun!

And that doesn't change D&D the roleplaying game, at all... how could it?

Bye
Thanee

 

[Doug McCrae]

Well, not any more. See page 195 of the 4e DMG. DMs are no longer needed! This one little 2 paragraph section totally makes D&D a computer game now. So all you wonderfully creative, hardworking DMs out there; you're no longer needed....

This is what killed 4e for me... I am completely aware that its in the "House Rules" section... but the fact they included it at all... IN a role playing game... I'm not even a DM and I found this offensive and belittling...

With the random dungeon, a player has to make decisions about what tactics the monsters use, essentially taking the role of the DM. Those decisions always have to be made, does it really matter if the person making those decisions is called a player, a DM or a computer programmer?

Also, 1e and 3e both have rules for random dungeons too, so it's no big deal.

 

[jdrakeh]

You're all overthinking this. D&D 4e isn't a video game because it doesn't require video.

 

[JDJblatherings]

A buddy and I used to use the random charts in AD&D to DM for each other at the same time as we each PC'd in the same dungeon. It was fun. We just made a gentleman's agreement to never attack each other with our PCs.

 

[Felix]

Heh. You've found the Thin Red Rule.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

...4e isn't a video game because it has less rules for creativity, causing the DM to pull more things out of his butt?

I'll admit, that's a new argument for me.

 

[Agamon]

You're all overthinking this. D&D 4e isn't a video game because it doesn't require video.

Exactly. I'd be sorely disappointed if I thought I was getting a video game when I bought the books and they didn't fit in my XBox.

 

[Mallus]

...4e isn't a video game because it has less rules for creativity, causing the DM to pull more things out of his butt?

4e provides a nice, simple framework to help support what the DM pulls out of his butt, which, I might add, is all a role-playing game need do. It's the crux of the biscuit, as Frank Zappa might have said.

Also, nothing provides 'rules for creativity'.

 

[Lacyon]

...4e isn't a video game because it has less rules for creativity, causing the DM to pull more things out of his butt?

I'm not entirely clear on why you think "pulling things out of his butt" is not creativity.

Or, to put it a bit differently:

The DM's whole job is to pull things out of his backside, and as long as said assal extrusions are balanced per the encounter rules (combat, trap, social, whatever), it is absolutely not a problem.