• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

Why I refuse to support my FLGS

Tatsukun

Danjin Masutaa
two said:
Vacuum answer: yes, it's cheaper.

Real-world answer: probably not, given the huge disparity in cost, which is only possible when somebody, somewhere, is being vastly underpaid and overworked. And buying from FloorMart supports that kind of abuse.
...
...
Staying "price is low ergo I buy" simply isn't responsible and sometimes won't be ethical OR moral.

Sadly, the world is complicated; people that CAN thank have a responsibility TO think, and decide these sorts of issues at least for themselves (and hopefully influence others).

Hang on, lemme think. Hmm.. hm... hmmmm...

Nope, buy the cheaper one. I don't have enough cash lying around to go all super hero
do-gooder with it. Maybe some day I will be rich and I will be able to pay extra to assuage the ‘guilt of living in a developed nation’. Right now, I am just happy it's not ME getting the short end this time, as there are plenty of times I do.

Sob stories don’t add value to the more expensive product. Don’t pay extra for it. In the immortal words of my personal idol (Eric Cartman) "I hate hippies!".

Then again, I have been described as Chaotic Evil in the past...

-Tatsu
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Waldorf

First Post
Once upon a time there was a little bookstore on the east coast of the US. Over time it flourished and grew, finally becoming a chain of stores called Barnes and Nobles. How did it get so big? Well, it didn't cater to a niche market like some of those christian bookstores you see around, or even gamers for that matter, but rather to ALL readers, selling almost every book published at the time. That's why B&N prospered, people, by appealing to the largest market possible.

If game store owners want to bellyache about the bigboys like Walmart, Barnes and Nobles, and Amazon and why people prefer to shop there, maybe they should consider the fact that limiting themselves to a niche product is precisely the reason they will never be able to grow beyond mom and pop status. Furthermore, writing long guilt trips to the gaming community about why people should support you isn't going to keep you afloat, gaming store man; appealing to the broader base will. But I sincerely doubt these owners will see the reason in that. I think they just want a place to keep out of the sun and meet gamers.
 

Waldorf said:
If game store owners want to bellyache about the bigboys like Walmart, Barnes and Nobles, and Amazon and why people prefer to shop there, maybe they should consider the fact that limiting themselves to a niche product is precisely the reason they will never be able to grow beyond mom and pop status. Furthermore, writing long guilt trips to the gaming community about why people should support you isn't going to keep you afloat, gaming store man; appealing to the broader base will. But I sincerely doubt these owners will see the reason in that. I think they just want a place to keep out of the sun and meet gamers.
Did you ever think that most gaming stores want to be "Mom & Pop" stores, not everybody gets into business to become a big nationwide chain. Just like nobody gets into being a game writer/designer to get rich, nobody (sensibly) goes into selling gaming materials to get rich, people sell and make the games largely for the love of the game. Gaming stores are more than bookstores, far more than just a place that sells books. Let's look at two successful FLGS in my home city and how they succeed despite Amazon.com and big-box stores:

The Rusty Scabbard. It's been around for about 20 years, so I think it's safe to say whatever it's doing it's doing well. About 30% of it's internal volume is devoted to gaming books, with a very large selection of books, including minor d20 publishers, an entire bookcase of GURPS, all kinds of small press/minor games, and the obligatory Wall o' WotC in the back (along with d20 Fantasy stuff). An entire wall of reaper minis (as well as old Ral Partha minis, special minis lines like the Arcana Evolved and Elmore minis series, and the Mongoose Babylon 5, Judge Dredd and Starship Troopers minis games), a bookcase of used games for sale also finish out the tabletop area. Another ~30% of the store is devoted to miniatures games, and this includes those expensive Games Workshop games that people come in and dutifully buy several hundred dollars worth at a time every time I'm in there, as well as loads of painting/terrain stuff (including the neato MasterMaze stuff from Dwarven Forge), and of course all the Wizkids and WotC collectable minis. Then there is an entire wall devoted to current and popular CCG's, and a wall devoted to out-of-print or less popular CCG's (and a buck-a-piece bin of low-interest CCG's), not to mention loads of non-collectable card games and board games (Catan, Axis & Allies, Fluxx, Lunch Money et al). Under glass at the counter are some rare books (like the 1e D&DG with Cthuhlu mythos) and other special merchandise, like the fancy precious stone/metal dice, and some hand-painted metal minis. A display selling dice on it's own about the size of the gaming displays in chain bookstores selling d3's to d100's tops it out, with big displays of card sleeves and storage boxes too. Then there is the icing on the cake of three gaming tables, with almost always somebody playing miniatures games on them and a library of terrain in the back. It also has very nice service about special orders, and very knowledgeable and friendly staff who are certainly experts on their subject matter and quickly learn the preferences of regular customers. Even the biggest "big box" bookstore or website couldn't provide all this, it is a "full service" FLGS and does good business based on that.

A+ Comics and Collectables. It's been around for about 5 years, and has been growing steadily, so it's looking pretty good. In terms of gaming materials, it has a large bookcase with all the up to date WotC and White Wolf publications on it (and a relatively small amount of odds & ends older books, mostly old WoD stuff and AD&D 2e materials), as well as ample supplies of collectable miniatures games and a wall of popular and mainstream CCG's. This is probably about a quarter of it's business, although it does have large tables in the back that are often host to CCG or CMG tournaments (which seem to always be going on when I go there). Most of the rest of the store is dedicated to comic books, comic related merchandise, and collectors toys (old Star Wars, GI Joe and similar toys up for sale and resale). It's gaming aspects are secondary to the comic/collector aspects of the store, but it still stocks much more gaming books and materials than the Barnes & Noble on the outskirts of town.
 

AdmundfortGeographer

Getting lost in fantasy maps
Waldorf said:
If game store owners want to bellyache about the bigboys like Walmart, Barnes and Nobles, and Amazon and why people prefer to shop there, maybe they should consider the fact that limiting themselves to a niche product is precisely the reason they will never be able to grow beyond mom and pop status.
There we go, wisdom from the customer, who we all know knows best. ;) Ah... the proctologist viewpoint of retail health. They specialize in looking at quality and quantity of what gets ... put out... there can't be any other perspective worth looking from, could there?

(prepares for another analogy flying over people's heads)
 

S'mon

Legend
Dristram said:
For example, lets say the Weapons of Legacy retail price from the manufacturer dropped to $23.99 and Amazon sold it for $14.39. Would you then buy it from your FLGS for $23.99, or still get it online anyway?
(-Brad Daeda
Owner, Gamer's Keepe

This would have zero effect on my buying practices I think. I look for the best combination of service & price. Eg I paid ca 70p extra this week to get a book from Leisure Games rather than a discount retailer because I knew I'd get it very fast (like day after they got my order! woot!) rather than in 2 weeks or so (if lucky).
 


Rykion

Explorer
FickleGM said:
<snip>
Is this the fault of the customer? No, being able to get what you are looking for at a cheaper price (and in some cases being able to by additional product) is very helpful. The roleplaying game market is a luxury market. These products are not essential, therefore, saving money will improve a customer's means to provide essential products.

<snip>

Is this the fault of the FLGS? No, being able to offer a product to the customer and provide a profit (see above) also forces B&M establishments to offer products at higher prices (due to extra costs). As has been mentioned - timeliness, convenience, service and additional amenities are the weapons that FLGSes have to battle online retailers. Unfortunately, these don't always make up for the "putting bread on the table" savings that online retailers provide. This spiral of death is also partly responsible for declining service, as the FLGS can only afford to hire from the bottom of the barrel (the top of the barrel will work for more money at a high-end retailer).
<snip>

I don't disagree with most of your points, but you do have the interaction between luxuries and essentials backwards. Saving money on essentials will give you more money for luxuries. Saving money on luxuries will give you more money for other luxuries, but will never give you more money for essentials. Essentials are things you have to buy to continue living. If you can not afford them, you can not afford any luxury. Some people do buy luxuries in place of essentials, but they tend to be addicts that see their luxury as a needed essential. You can choose to spend more money than normal on essentials, but then they become luxuries, such as when you go to a restaurant rather than eating cheaper at home. No discount on RPGs puts bread on anyone's table. Discounted luxuries might allow someone to choose to eat more expensively or buy more gaming materials, but no sane person chooses to continuously go without food to buy luxuries.
 
Last edited:

Mark Chance

Boingy! Boingy!
Dristram said:
For example, lets say the Weapons of Legacy retail price from the manufacturer dropped to $23.95 and Amazon sold it for $14.39. Would you then buy it from your FLGS for $23.95, or still get it online anyway?

Would I still buy from Amazon? Yes, unless I found a less expensive price elsewhere. There is nothing that a game store offers me that is worth the extra expense.

For example, I've purchased three of the Complete... books during the past week. I got all three for $37.30 US, including S&H. That's a total savings of more than $50 US, and I didn't have to leave the comfort of my home, put up with Houston traffic, stand in line at the store, et cetera.

For me, that is money, time, and hassle well-saved.
 

ssampier

First Post
wingsandsword said:
Did you ever think that most gaming stores want to be "Mom & Pop" stores, not everybody gets into business to become a big nationwide chain. {snip}

The Rusty Scabbard. It's been around for about 20 years, so I think it's safe to say whatever it's doing it's doing well. A Then there is the icing on the cake of three gaming tables, with almost always somebody playing miniatures games on them and a library of terrain in the back. It also has very nice service about special orders, and very knowledgeable and friendly staff who are certainly experts on their subject matter and quickly learn the preferences of regular customers. Even the biggest "big box" bookstore or website couldn't provide all this, it is a "full service" FLGS and does good business based on that.
Emphasis Added

You hit the nail on the head, service. Why should I support my game store where the game owner treats me like an annoyance and his regular clintele are spoiled brats? Now if the store was more comfortable to shop in, the owner more knowledgable about his products, and provided a nice place to game in, I may be inclined to shop there.

[ssampier's dream world]*
In my dream world, I would own two types of games shops: Discount Store A large, spacious warehouse style environment with discounted books, games, hobbies, and accessories. I would feature weekly tournaments and large gaming space.

Boutique style: This would feature a more intimate environment located in a sub-urban environment, near a shopping mall and close to parks, bike paths, and/or schools. The emphasis would be unmatched customer service and product support. The selection would be slightly less than the warehouse store.

[/ssampier dream world]

* I know this may not work in the real world, but hey, I like the fantasy
 

Dristram

First Post
Mark Chance said:
For example, I've purchased three of the Complete... books during the past week. I got all three for $37.30 US, including S&H.
WOW! :confused: That is about $12.43 each. I'm afraid to ask, but where did you find those prices?? That's much less than my cost. I could sell the books less than retail if I could get them for that!

That's a total savings of more than $50 US, and I didn't have to leave the comfort of my home, put up with Houston traffic, stand in line at the store, et cetera.

For me, that is money, time, and hassle well-saved.
You mention time, so I'm curious, how long does the shipping take?

(-Brad
 

Voidrunner's Codex

Remove ads

Top