Why Identify?

[rrealm]

How rare are pearls in the real world? If they are fairly rare, what if a change was made to where one could use a 100 gp pearl or a 200 gp ruby/diamond/whatever. Pearls save you money but it you don't have them, you're not SOL.

Personally, I don't see the problem with the identify spell costing 100 gp per item. Generally "cheaper" or less valuable (in terms of their Market Value) items like scrolls and potions can be determined with skill checks like spellcraft. Weapons and armors have a much higher market value so burning 100 gp to figure out what it does shouldn’t be any problem. Even a basic +1 dagger has a market value of 2301 gp. It sells for 1150 gp and 5 sp. Take away the cost of the identify spell, and you make an easy 1050.5 gp. What’s the problem?

 

[kirinke]

Here is a fairly good house rule that can deal with the issue of material components:

Material components are only used when scribing scrolls or scribing spells into your spell book. At this time, the components are used to make a special ink that when properly prepared can be used to create magical writings. Once written down, the caster need only to memorize the spells from the spellbook. In effect, the spell-book becomes the major focus for his magic, in much the same way a holy symbol is a cleric's spell-focus. Normal rules apply to potions, scrolls and other magical items.

 

[Kaleon Moonshae]

People say that having everyone be able to identify magic items without the spells would make it flavorless...why? What is keeping you from still describing the weapon and what it does, what it looks like, things like that? Identify in my world tells you the *history* behind the item, where it came from, who has used it, things like that. It's research. What it does I handle with an appraise/knowledge arcana skill check. Also, anything of MW quality or higher in my game has a name and specific look to it. You don't find a MW sword you find a finely crafted basket hilt rapier with the letters QT inscribed along the blade, which has an off knick half way up its length which looks like some fighter at some point wished to make it even more personal. Along the hilt you can notice 34 tiny scratches evenly spaced. With a successful Knowledge Arcana check you learn: "The rapier has a light enchantment placed upon which seems to always keep it sharp, as well as a radience of fire magic which could mean it does extra damage on particularly lucky strikes (+1 eversharp rapier of flaming criticals). When you cast Identify you learn: "The sword is named Wraethuis and was forged by the smith Perindal over three thousand years ago for a minor noble of a Glamding house named Carl. Carl had the habit of marking off each man he killed in duels by scratching lines into the hilt. When once told that his sword was a common design by Perindal, Carl promptly went to the local smith and had him knick the blade in order to make it "unique." The last time the sword or Carl were seen was in a small border town along the coast of Highridge."

The players knew as soon as they made a DC 15 knowledge check every magical ability of the sword but I really doubt that the sword is "bland" or "flavorless."

 

[CyberSpyder]

Unbalanced, I'm sure not. Uninteresting, flavorless, non-fantastic, and reducing D&D to nothing but number-crunching, I'd say "yes" to.

All that with the removal of a single spell? Boy, that is a balancing act the designers pulled off.

 

[Herpes Cineplex]

This thread reminds me of a question I've had for a little while now: Has anyone ever used self-identifying magic items in a game? I'm fairly sure I saw stuff about it in Magic of Faerun and in the DMG; just a percentage chance that an item will let its owner know exactly what it is when he holds it, nothing fancy.

Because personally, I have NEVER played in a game where any non-intelligent item was self-identifying. Not even once. Not even one tiny, inconsequential item. It's always been "cast identify or take your chances with trial-and-error." (And trial and error was usually a GM euphemism for "I'll let you waste an hour or two of playing time trying stupid things until you give up and just get it Identified.")

I bet GMs who are beginning to worry about all the 100gp pearls that are found, sold, and consumed in the casting of Identify spells could help reduce the stress on those poor li'l oysters if they just made a few items ID themselves, y'know?

--
like it's supposed to be a big secret that a sword bursts into flames
ryan

 

[Pinotage]

I think a few people have raised the point that it's not the cost that's the problem, but the fact that you have so much downtime because of it. In essence you're forced to spend days identifying items due to lack of spell slots. Perhaps I should just ask the DM to houserule to 100 gp per item, but as many as you want with a single casting. In that scenario one might want to increase the time spent identifying for any particular casting.

It's no fun sitting around for two days in a place just to ID items when you could be doing useful things elsewhere. No other spell requires say 10 castings in two days.

Pinotage

 

[Kaleon Moonshae]

I think a few people have raised the point that it's not the cost that's the problem, but the fact that you have so much downtime because of it. In essence you're forced to spend days identifying items due to lack of spell slots. Perhaps I should just ask the DM to houserule to 100 gp per item, but as many as you want with a single casting. In that scenario one might want to increase the time spent identifying for any particular casting.

It's no fun sitting around for two days in a place just to ID items when you could be doing useful things elsewhere. No other spell requires say 10 castings in two days.

Pinotage

well...except heal spells;P In my group that requires more like 30 in two days, hehehe. I do, however, see your point and agree with you.

 

[Pax]

But why does it cost 100 gp? If there's one thing I've found in years of gaming that's always a pain, it is the need to identify items and find 100 gp pearls.

Be a blood magus, and take nothing worse than a few HP of damage for casting it. ^_^ Then have the party cleric toss a CLW your way after every, say, second casting. ^_^

 

[Dark Psion]

I'm more annoyed at the casting time of 8 hours. I constantly gripe about this spell. Why make it so hard to learn what an item does? One of my DMs says it's to encourage trial an error. For a weapon or armor, sure. But what about wands? Staffs? Even potions? Without identify, you can't use a wand or even figure out what it is. (UMD aside--it may not be available.) Then there's the fact that you don't get to learn everything about an item, just the primary feature.

I don't know, this is a regular rant with me. I just don't see any imbalance with learning everything about new items. And make Identify a 10 minute spell or something. Maybe an hour. But 8? It's unnecessarily annoying.

That's nothing, check out Psionic Identify, it has a manifestation time of ONE FULL DAY!

An entire day in meditation just to learn that a crystal is a Shard +1 (Use Rope).

 

[Fauxargent]

IMC we have a third level spell "Greater Identify" which functions as the 3.0 Identify spell.

I like the requirement for the 100 gp pearl and dislike the fact that Clerics with the Magic domain don't need it.

And I would prefer Craft (Alchemy) was used to identify potions rather than Spellcraft which already has many uses.